Trouble with first batch

[Seawolfe]

Actually, that's a really good point: so many new soapers think that soaps use a recipe, but it's really a formula. That's why we speak in percentages so often. And why my favorite formulas may not be yours. By all means get ideas from others recipes, but formulate them yourself using a calculator, and tweak them to suit your needs.

Edit to add: the Brambleberry fragrance calc is for weight of soap, or lotion etc. I like it because it spits out a range from light to strong scent.

 

[mommycarlson]

I think the tutorial page actually made my anxiety worse. How do I know what percent of water I want to use? And amount of lye discount? I've read several books but I feel like I know nothing. How do I decide these things? I've put the oils in that I plan to use but it won't let me calculate a recipe, I have to put in a value for the oils. What does that mean? I'm sorry I can't figure this out thank you

 

[kchaystack]

I think the tutorial page actually made my anxiety worse. How do I know what percent of water I want to use? And amount of lye discount? I've read several books but I feel like I know nothing. How do I decide these things?

These are important things you have to figure out by trial and error.

What I would do is change from water as % of oils to lye concentration and enter 30%. This is a nice starting point, and as you go along you can adjust as you learn.

As for lye discount (also called superfat) I would use 5%. This is the default and will be fine for your first batch.

The most important thing is to stay calm. Being anxious does nothing but make the process stressful and not fun.

 

[Seawolfe]

http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showthread.php?t=49627

As the tutorial says - use the default 38% of water as oils at first. Not sure where you are seeing lye discount, but on Soap Calc keep the superfat at default 5%
You add oils by double clicking, and you can ask the calculator to formulate by percentages or weight for the oils. Just follow the tutorial I linked to step by step and you'll get it

 

[mommycarlson]

I took a deep breath and found the tutorial someone posted that is actually on the soapcalc website. This did help some. it's the whole water % issue that has me stumped. Thank you kchaystack for your help, I am getting closer to a recipe on the calculator! I used to be excited about making soap but math is not my strong suit, and this does not make me calm LOL. Once I have a recipe I will be fine. I so appreciate all the feedback from everyone.

Okay! Thank you guys, I did it, I have a recipe! woohoo! now I just need my last oil to arrive

 

[BusyHands]

There are some Soap Calculators on the web. Some are more in depth than others. Just start out slow to get the feel of things. A good way to start is by making 1 lb tester batches of soap or even trying a one bar "recipe", just to see how you like each formula; during the curing process and as a finished product. Bramble Berry has a simple soap calculator on their website. Another is Soap Calc, it's more in depth. There are others, so test them out for your comfort level. The calculators will decide for you on the amount of water (liquid) & lye to use based on the amounts, types of oils you choose; at a superfat percentage. To start out, I would stay with a 3%-5% superfat. I hope this helps & doesn't make your nervousness worse.

 

[mommycarlson]

Thank you busyhands, I'm feeling a little better now that I have an actual recipe. The soapcalc calculator was very intimidating at first, the tutorial helped. What tripped me up was the % of water and the superfat. I'm so new and all those things are foreign to me. I hope I will get to the point of knowing and feeling confident.

 

[navigator9]

You have to wait until it is ready to cut. Every mold and every recipe is different.

You will know when you try to get it out of the mold if it is too early. You pull the sides of the mold away from the soap - if the soap deforms or is sticky you have to wait a bit. If you leave it too long it will be easy to get out of the mild but difficult to cut. There is a sweet spot for each recipe.

And this is one of the benefits of gelling soap...you can unmold and cut the next day. I gel nearly all of my soaps because I need the (almost) instant gratification, and when I don't, I always try to unmold too soon, and end up messing up my soap. Gelling or not is strictly aesthetic, some people prefer to gel, some not to. Most of us have pretty strong feelings one way or another. This is something you can experiment with to see which side of the debate you end up on.

 

[dixiedragon]

Thank you busyhands, I'm feeling a little better now that I have an actual recipe. The soapcalc calculator was very intimidating at first, the tutorial helped. What tripped me up was the % of water and the superfat. I'm so new and all those things are foreign to me. I hope I will get to the point of knowing and feeling confident.

I am not great at math either, so don't let that stop you! Soapcalc has good defaults: Lye as percent of oils 38% (section 3 on the page) and superfat 5% (section 4). At this point, there is no need to change those.

Regarding using a recipe - it's actually really the same thing! Lots of people publish crappy recipes. Bad recipe = bad food. Bad soap recipe = bad soap. Very similar! Making soap is less like making soup and more like making bread, in that certain chemical reactions are going on. If I add 10 carrots instead of 1 carrot to my soup, my soup will be fine, just extra carrot-y. If you are baking bread and add too much or not enough of something, your bread won't rise.

Generally speaking, recipes tend to err on the side of high superfat rather than low superfat. Superfat is the amount of oil over what the lye will saponify (turn into soap). Generally it is good to have at least 5% superfat - it gives you a margin of error. Many books contain recipes that have a 15% or 20% superfat, which is a LOT. The "average" here on SMF is 5%. There are plenty of people who go lower and higher, but 5% is a good starting point.

 

[mommycarlson]

Thank you dixiedragon, that helps make me feel better. And the analogies of bread vs soup vs soap are very good!
And Navigator9, neither of my batches have gelled yet. I'm wondering if it's because both times I've used those long thin molds? I've read somewhere that you need your soap in a larger mold for the gel phase to happen.

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

That is a good analogy. If someone says to me "use 100 eggs and 10 grams of flour" I know that something is wrong. I don't know what each ingredient brings to the party, though, so I struggle to fully 'get it'

Look through the recipes that are posted all over this forum and you'll get a feel for what goes where and then things will make more sense. Like when people use a SatNav and then have no real idea of where they went, just using a recipe blindly means that you miss out on the "why" of the recipe, which is a crying shame. I strongly suggest reading back through the recipe sections of the forum for 10 pages or more, looking at what is suggested and why, then recipes will really start to make sense to you. You'll start to know what the cleansing oils are and how much you should look at for each type of soap and why. Going beyond the basics in to getting understanding.

You never need to "do" maths, as the calcs do it for you. But the difference between a 15% castor and a 5% castor recipe is something you can pick up easily

 

[mommycarlson]

Thank you EG, much appreciated and I will look through the recipes section. Now I have a question. When do I add the coffee grounds to my coffee soap recipe? At trace? And how about the Espresso fragrance oil? Does that go in at trace as well? And do I need to warm it first?

 

[kchaystack]

Thank you EG, much appreciated and I will look through the recipes section. Now I have a question. When do I add the coffee grounds to my coffee soap recipe? At trace? And how about the Espresso fragrance oil? Does that go in at trace as well? And do I need to warm it first?

I would add them at trace, since they are heavy enough to settle in a thin batter.

I do not remember espresso causing acceleration, so I would add it to your oils before you add the lye. It does not need to be warmed.

 

[mommycarlson]

Okay, great, thank you!

 

[dixiedragon]

Thank you EG, much appreciated and I will look through the recipes section. Now I have a question. When do I add the coffee grounds to my coffee soap recipe? At trace? And how about the Espresso fragrance oil? Does that go in at trace as well? And do I need to warm it first?

Aaaaand here is when you find that many questions have multiple "correct" answers. I add the coffee grounds to my lye water. In my experience, coffee grounds are light enough and soap is thick enough that they don't settle in.

Regarding your FO: I generally use 1 to 1.5 tablespoons per pound of oils (PPO). Unfortunately BB's fragrance calculator is down so you can't check their recommendation that way.

If I have a 1 OZ sample, I use it to make 20 ounces of soap. I tend to scent on the heavy side.

 

[mommycarlson]

My soap recipe has 49 oz of oils, is this too big of a batch for my 3rd try? Should I do just a half batch?

 

[Seawolfe]

For early batches I would recommend around 2 - 2.5 lb of soap out of the mold or around 21 - 25 ounces of oils. Much less than that and small errors become larger problems.

Plus you don't know what you like yet - this is how you find out

 

[mommycarlson]

Okay, thank you Seawolfe. I cut the batch in half (per the soapcalc calculator) but I do have a question about the salt. The original recipe calls for salt and 1/4 cup of coffee grounds. Someone said to cut the coffee grounds down to 3 T, so should I do less than that since I am doing half the batch? And the salt, so instead of a T of salt, do I add 1/2 a T? Is the salt necessary? What is it for? I'm going to make the soap hopefully today.
Thanks!
Also, I would like scale advice please. I bought a cheap one from Amazon, it measures in the correct measurements but it jumps around so much it's hard to get an accurate measurement. Then I got the Biggest Loser one from Walmart but it doesn't measure in the correct measurements. Can anyone please recommend one that doesn't break the bank, but is a good one? Thanks!

 

[SoapingChick]

I'm guessing the salt is for initial hardening of the soap - to get it out of the mold easier. I've never used it myself as I imagine it will cut just a teeny, tiny bit of lather and I want ALL the lather. I just wait a bit longer, one time almost 2 weeks! (It had a lot of extra glycerin.) I do add sugar at 1 T ppo (disolve in water before adding lye) for even MORE bubbles, if you haven't tried it yet I recommend, made a significant difference in my recipes
As for the coffee grounds, most people add I think about 1T ppo. Depending of the level of scrubbiness you want, you can adjust/play around with the coarseness (?) of the grounds. What I like to do is split my batter and only add grounds to part of the soap and either swirl (in the pot) or put the coffee-part in the bottom and do a pencil line and then the rest on top, so I only have scrubbies in the bottom part. Did it in a slap mold, so the soap had a scrubby side and a smooth side, split with a gold mica pencil line. You can use micas, cinnamon, activated charcoal, I'm guessing parsley tho I don't recall seeing it (anyone used powedered parsley for pencil line?? Should stay green, right?)
Best of luck :-D

 

[SoapingChick]

I now know my kitchen table is uneven, my scale will jump if it's not on a COMPLETLY flat, level surface. I now put it on a big glass plate when weighing. It's a cheap (BAD) one, but it is precise. (It's (BAD) cause it turns off automatically in 60 seconds, regardless it's still counting. DON'T get a scale that has no off-button!)
I don't have any recommendations tho, but I imagine the price goes up with the quality.