SOS!!! Super quick trace problems

[ladyjerusalem]

Hey all! I am new here and new to soap making in general. I've only been doing it for little over a month. I've bought a couple of books, and I have had great success with simple recipes. However, I decided I wanted to start playing with color and scent and I've run into the mother of all problems...quick trace. I'm using a recipe from a book, and after FIVE botched batches now, using tips from this forum, I've decided to come directly to you for help!

Here is the recipe, as it is in the book:

7.2 oz lye
15.0 oz H2o
16.0 oz palm oil
16.0 oz coconut oil
2.0 oz castor oil
16.0 oz olive oil
3.0 oz pumpkin puree
3.5 oz pumpkin spice fragrance oil (from brambleberry)
3 tsp titanium dioxide
3 TB sunflower oil
.5 tsp copper sparkle mica

Basically, the task is to separate the batches into three sections, two of them being quite small and colored but not scented, then drizzled into the larger, scented, and colored with the mica. When you pour into the mold, it's supposed to swirl on it's own. Unfortunately, the INSTANT I add the FO, we're talking mashed potatoes. Not kidding. I've tried having the lye solution and oils at exactly the same temp (120 F). I've tried adding the FO right before adding the colored sections. I've tried adding the FO into the oils before adding the lye solution. I'm so very upset!!! I always wisk my FO and colors. I only stick blend until it's cloudy (still very liquidy). I really want to work my way up to some interesting color patterns, and I can't see myself doing it if I can't master a simple one like this! Help please?

 

[greenmountainwife]

Spicy scents (cinnamon essential oil for one) can seize soap. You could try the same recipe and design with a different scent to see how it works for you.



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[ladyjerusalem]

I've also tried Almond fragrance oil too with same recipe. Same problem.

 

[greenmountainwife]

Hmm.... I don't see any other potential problems in your recipe or method. Is the almond fragrance for soaps? Alcohol based fragrances can seize as well.


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[soap_rat]

I suspect there are real spice components in the FO, like clove or cinnamon, that are making it trace very very fast. Does that recipe call for exactly that sort of fragrance oil? If so the author should have given more advice on how to keep it fluid.

I made a soap including clove and cinnamon EOs the other night (fast tracers) and I soaped at or under 100F. Maybe leave the FO out of the two colors since you say there's little of those, blend it in with the main batch before you add the lye. I mostly just stirred my soap then did hit it with the stick blender for just a couple of pulses. I got a chunky but fluid batter--like runny applesauce. Hopefully you can get the same and achieve your swirl! If not, perhaps that company's FO is more troublesome than other pumpkin spices--people who know FOs may chime in on that.

The sugars in the pumpkin may speed up trace, too--I do hot process when I do pumpkin, but you can't get fine swirls with HP.

I didn't run your recipe through a lye calculator like soapcalc, but you should always do so even if a recipe is published. Being lye-heavy or short on water can speed up trace too.

(just posted and saw new comments about the almond. I dunno about that!)

 

[ladyjerusalem]

Thanks to both of you. Yes, I did use the exact fragrance oil suggested by the author (her own company, actually!!). Maybe I will just move on to a different recipe and see if I can't make it work better. Maybe I've beat this one into the ground

 

[Hazel]

At what temperature did you blend your oils and lye? This will also make a batch move faster. You might want to practice coloring with well behaved FOs.

This FO Chart is helpful; however, this only gives you an idea since your results can vary depending upon your recipe and soaping temperature. I also noticed the person who posted a review of Pumpkin Spice stated there wasn't any acceleration. I've read some other reviews of it and most people stated it didn't accelerate. But they didn't mention what temperature they soaped at and this would have been helpful to know.

Another helpful site: http://soapscentreview.obisoap.ca/index.php

 

[newbie]

At some point, I would try an FO that has a really solid reputation for not speeding trace with your current recipe, just so you know if that recipe is one you'd like to use or not.

Some that I think are very safe are Lime FO, Love Spell, Daystar's Paradise, NG's The Perfect Man, BB's Mango or Kumquat. Those are some go-to fragrances for me if I want time to play and I don't believe I've ever read about anyone having difficulties with trace with these. In fact, some Love Spell FO's seems to slow trace for some people.

 

[elmtree]

Is this the recipe for "pumpkin in the pot swirl" in the "Soap Crafting" book?


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[Moody Glenn]

At what temperature did you blend your oils and lye? This will also make a batch move faster. You might want to practice coloring with well behaved FOs.

This FO Chart is helpful; however, this only gives you an idea since your results can vary depending upon your recipe and soaping temperature. I also noticed the person who posted a review of Pumpkin Spice stated there wasn't any acceleration. I've read some other reviews of it and most people stated it didn't accelerate. But they didn't mention what temperature they soaped at and this would have been helpful to know.

Another helpful site: http://soapscentreview.obisoap.ca/index.php

Hello! My first thought was with your soaping batter temperature. Hazel beat me to the punch. If the batter is way too warm the chemical reaction will go into fourth gear real fast. And, as what many others have expressed, certain FO's are notorious in causing many "colorful" words to be expressed. :evil: Take Hazel's advise and always check with the Soap Scent Review Board. If a FO is not listed be on the safe side and try a small test batch first.

 

[elmtree]

Yes, my thoughts too. If this was the recipe from the soap queen's book she does list what temps you should stay within for the best results. I know everyone is different, but I have found I have lots of time to work if I keep my lye and oils at around 100-110. I made this recipe and I didn't have any issues (not to make you feel worse lol) so that's why I think temp must be the issue too. I know it can feel quite overwhelming trying to remember all of these little details lol


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[My Mountain Soaps]

I agree, "Hot" fo's/eo's can really speed up trace, and i think your temp is too high as well. I also prefer soap around 110. Also, beware if you are using a wooden mold, that makes your soap even hotter, and can crack. but if you dont go above 110 and check your FO's like the others are saying, you SHOULD be ok. Unless the soap elves are against you.... you can make the same batch five different times, and at times get five different results! i'm glad that you reached out to this crowd. arent they a wonderful group, so so so helpful to me!!!

 

[My Mountain Soaps]

Oh, by the way, I love your soaping name "Ladyjerusalem" is there a story behind that name? It reminds me of Psalms 122 where we are encouraged to pray for the peace of jerusalem. Beautiful prayer! oh, and welcome!

 

[Hazel]

And, as what many others have expressed, certain FO's are notorious in causing many "colorful" words to be expressed.

I know these words.