Coconut FAT vs Coconut Oil

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saddigilmore

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So I went to the supermarket to try to plan my own entry to the "supermarket challenge"

We all know coconut oil. But I came across this stuff: Coconut FAT. It was about 1/3 the price of the coconut oil. I never heard of this stuff before today.

In english, I can find no distinction between the two...

In German, I got this translation to english:

"Coconut oil is pressed from fresh coconut meat - the oil obtained is not processed any further. Therefore it is also offered as virgin coconut oil. Virgin coconut oil can also be obtained by extraction from coconut milk. Coconut oil has a subtle coconut taste.

Coconut fat is extracted from the dried grated coconut meat - either by pressing or extraction - and then further refined, bleached and deodorized. The result is a white, tasteless, solid fat."

The coconut fat was refrigerated. Is this actually 76 degree melting point coconut OIL, labeled as FAT?? ,

How does this affect the hardness of the bar afterwards?

Is this the difference between the 76 degree and 92 degree coconut oil? The (cheap) coconut fat is the 76 degree melting point coconut oil, and the (expensive) virgin, cold pressed coconut oil would be the 92 degree stuff?

according to soapcalc, both the 76 and 92 degree coconut oils have the same effect on "hardness".

In terms of soapmaking, has anyone come across this distinction before?? Or are coconut fat and coconut oil two different things completely?

What would soapcalc think of this coconut fat? :p What would coconut fat bring to the table, if it was different than coconut oil, in terms of soapmaking?

Thank you all
 

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The Efficacious Gentleman

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Liebe Grüße aus Vorarlberg!

Your best bet is to compare the nutritional information on both packs. If they match, wunderbar! If not then check the ratios of saturated to unsaturated fats to the information in the soap calc.

Personally I use the Hofer (oder Aldi, bin nicht sicher wo du wohnst) brand coconut......well it's called fat of course, but I've never had an issue with it.
 

saddigilmore

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Aldi Nord, ride or die!!!!! AOO AOO AOO :p

I'm uploading the labels in case anyone is curious:

so the "coconut fat" has 91% unsaturated fat, with the virgin cold pressed coconut oil having 93.7%.

coconut taste and all that stuff that's important when cooking w these things is negated in soapmaking...

it seems the cheaper "coconut fat" seems more "pure..." with 0% carbs, and o% protein... (removed with the refining process, i imagine, vs being cold pressed, with all these fruity impurities left in)...

So the real question: does the "expensive": coconut oil have any distinct advantages over the "coconut fat"?

That sugar left in the "virgin coconut oil" theoretically would add to lather? that seems negligible, and we can just add some sugar to the water....

that 2% increase in saturated fat content isn't worth the ~3X increase in price, right?

and to clarify, these are actually both "coconut oil", in terms of a lye calculator?
 

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ResolvableOwl

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  • That reminds me so hard of my own supermarket experiences! I have used Othüna brand coconut “fat” too, and noticed no difference to virgin coconut “oil” (in soap at least; taste-wise it is more neutral, but the taste/smell doesn't make it into soap anyway)
  • It's not that coconut palms grow in Thuringia🤨. AFAIK Othüna is the old GDR margarine brand that somehow made it through reunification, and out of the Ostalgie corners in recent years all over Germany. My impression is that some GDR heritage remains in form of an unimaginative, boring and taste-neutral product of decent quality in austere outfit, at an unbeatable price.
  • As far as the usage of the names coconut “oil” and “fat” refers to unrefined/refined/virgin/blah triglycerides rendered from coconuts in whatsoever way, it is pure PR shmoo. Maybe blended with some cultural conditioning: Where coconuts grow, coconut oil is liquid, so the name “oil” makes sense there (in the tropics). Imported to cold and rainy Europe, it is solid most of the time. So it appeared sensible (back then in the colonial times, I suppose) to categorise it, along lard, tallow, dairy butter etc., into the category “[solid] fats”. With the animal fats gaining a bad reputation in the last decades, manufacturers wanted to get rid of that (seemingly “unhealty”) label “fat”, so they started marketing coconut triglycerides as “coconut oil”. They're the same plant, the same product. The methods (cold-pressed from fresh coconut flesh, or copra, or extracted, refined or not) vary from one to another manufacturer, but that's culinary distinctions, irrelevant for soapmaking. What counts is the content of lauric and myristic acids, and I seriously doubt that the extraction method has a larger impact on this than the natural geographical, seasonal and botanical variations of coconut cultivation/harvest.
  • Schneekoppe is a “big brand”, and its price premium comes mostly from that their customers pay for publicity, for stupid “supermarket snob vs. discounter proletarian” elitism, and for the dividends of their shareholders. Don't buy “big brands”, don't fall for their advertisement campaigns, don't fund their arrogance. Unless you're content with a superficial appeal of superiority. If you want a superior product, aim for independently certified qualities (organic, equitable, direct marketing/cooperative initiatives).
  • A caveat: there is a distinct product called “coconut oil” that is liquid at (and well below) room temperature, and sold not in jars but in bottles: MCT oil, fractionated or transesterified coconut oil (sometimes blended with palm kernel oil), “neutral oil”, INCI: caprylic/capric triglyceride. It is a lot more expensive than any coconut “fat”, and is useless as a bulk fat for soapmaking (skin irritant, low lather, low hardness).
 

saddigilmore

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Schneekoppe is a “big brand”, and its price premium comes mostly from that their customers pay for publicity, for stupid “supermarket snob vs. discounter proletarian” elitism, and for the dividends of their shareholders.
I never took notice of the brand Schneekoppe before today, but they seem to be at the same price point as all the other brands that I have access to at the moment(dm. rossman, rewe) I wasn't swayed by the brand name, this is the only brand aldi carries, and most time what I can get, only the aldi gods decide. :p

2,50 for 250g of coconut oil is normal, right?

maybe I am a victim? of this marketing. I don't know enough about nutrition, chemistry to say, but I definitely have been led to believe that it is "better", all other things being equal, to eat virgin cold-pressed coconut oil, compared to eating a "coconut fat" that is refined with solvents. I don't have any proof of this. but I probably will still pay the extra ~1 eur, when it comes to eating, to pay for the "virgin" coconut oil.

There has to be things that are stripped during a "large scale commercial refining process" that isn't lost in cold pressing. And there has to be SOME (maybe negligible) impurities left from whatever solvents they may have used during the refining of this "coconut fat".

This probably wouldn't even be noticed by my body, and I'm just paying that extra money to sleep better.

Most people, given the choice, whether or not they truly understand the science or not, would probably choose a "virgin" oil, over something refined.
Cold pressing is probably much less efficient also, adding to the price. The price is determined by supply and demind

I have used Othüna brand coconut “fat” too, and noticed no difference to virgin coconut “oil” (in soap at least)

They're the same plant, the same product. The methods (cold-pressed from fresh coconut flesh, or copra, or extracted, refined or not) vary from one to another manufacturer, but that's culinary distinctions, irrelevant for soapmaking. What counts is the content of lauric and myristic acids, and I seriously doubt that the extraction method has a larger impact on this than the natural geographical, seasonal and botanical variations of coconut cultivation/harvest.
Hearing this come from you makes me feel VERY confident in using this "coconut fat" in my next soapmaking experiments! I am not eating my soap, lol.
 
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The Efficacious Gentleman

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When we look at the properties of coconut oil/fat (I'll just say oil from now on though) in non-soap products and compare that to what saponified coconut oil is like, I wouldn't worry about using a more expensive brand to have any "goodness" in the soap.

As an aside, I buy cases of it from Hofer - when making a salt bar I need about 30 packs!
 

saddigilmore

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I wouldn't worry about using a more expensive brand to have any "goodness"
I will not worry! :) Othüna and I are going to get very familiar with one another!

I am debating with myself whether or not I should be eating this stuff too. I have no trouble eating "cheap" olive oil, and "cheap" canola, and "cheap" sunflower oil.. It's 1/3 of the price! I'm not always the most consistent, but I try
 

The Efficacious Gentleman

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It can also vary from product to product - I love the Hofer sour cream rifflechips, which are not expensive at all. But with other things (like cheese!) I really have to pay extra if I want to enjoy it. You might find that the cheaper option works, but also maybe not.....
 
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