Reverse engineer this recipe

FrayGrants · Dec 7, 2022

I would like to start off by saying that I am by no means trying to commit industrial espionage, but I was wondering if someone here could help me reverse engineer a soap recipe with the ingredients list from the packaging. I really love this soap and was hoping a more experienced member could help me recreate it.

The ingredients list is as follows in this order: Olive Oil, Coconut Oil, Palm Oil, Goat Milk, Avocado Oil, Meadowfoam Seed Oil

I understand that the list goes in order from highest percentage used to lowest, with the following ingredient having to be equal or less than the previous. I was probably going to use HO Safflower to replace the Meadowfoam Seed Oil as it is quite expensive, but I can factor that in myself. Can anybody come up with a good recipe for me with these ingredients? Thanks in advance for any and all replies.

Mobjack Bay · Dec 7, 2022

Does the ingredient list include sodium hydroxide and fragrance? It helps to know where they are in the list.

FrayGrants · Dec 8, 2022

Mobjack Bay said:
Does the ingredient list include sodium hydroxide and fragrance? It helps to know where they are in the list.

Unfortunately no it does not, but I could definitely see how it would

Marsi · Dec 8, 2022

If the goat milk is used as a full water substitute, the location of goats milk in the list suggests that this recipe is a classic trinity oil soap (between about 30/30/30 with 10 percent exotic oils/butters to 40/25/25 with 10% exotics).

Mobjack Bay · Dec 8, 2022

I was writing while @Marsi was posting…

It looks like a basic Holy Trinity recipe with a fairly high percentage of CO and some avocado and meadowfoam oil subbed in for part of the OO, and then with goat milk in the mix. If you know how much CO you like, you can start there in the so@p calculator. Then play around with the percentages of PO and OO until you get the longevity (stearic+palmitic) you want. 28-30 s+p will give you a bar that doesn’t melt away quickly and makes a resonable lather, >30 will result in a longer lasting bar that is likely to make a creamy-leaning lather, and <28 will result in a bar that lathers/bubbles more, but dissolves faster. I haven’t put any numbers into a calculator, but I suspect that you’re going to have a hard time formulating a recipe with a high longevity number due to the CO being listed before the PO. Once you’ve settled on the “Trinity” percentages you can replace some of the OO with avocado and another liquid oil. Avocado has plenty of palmitic fatty acid and using a bit of it in lieu of OO won’t affect the fatty acid profiles much. Adding a third liquid oil at <5% is unlikely to produce a noticeable change in the lather or feel of the soap unless that oil is castor, which helps to sustain the lather. I tend to have problems with >35% palm causing acceleration. Instead of increasing the palm further, I usually add a bit of cocoa butter and/or shea if I want the longevity number to be higher than 28.

FrayGrants · Dec 8, 2022

Wow thank you so much @Mobjack Bay, your post was incredibly informative about the properties of the oils and FA profiles.

I need to learn more about the properties of common soaping oils and where and how I can push the boundaries.

TBH, I am kind of a slave to the soap calc and I only make soaps that generate good numbers, but I know it isn’t foolproof. For instance, ZNSC has pretty lousy numbers, but makes great soap IMO!

I need to learn more and experiment and stop playing it “safe” all the time. It’s funny though, I’ve never even made the Trinity soap before but I was thinking that was what it was. Thanks again!!!