Quick dissolving soap problem

[sarge4j]

Hello all,
Am kind of new to soap making and I had 2 major problems with a batch I made.
Its dissolves quite fast with use, can it be made long lasting?
Secondly, from the first use it produces small droplets of water all over the soap bar when it should have dried and continues this way in between uses. How can I prevent this?

 

[Loolee]

have you let your soap cure for 4-6 weeks? that allows the soap to dry out and last *much* longer in the shower.

dont know about the water droplets. did you do a zap test?

 

[IrishLass]

As Loolee said, curing for 4 to 6 weeks is very important for longer lasting soap, as well as other qualities such as hardness, mildness, improved lather, etc..

The oils/fats in your formula also play a big role. Oils that are high in lauric acid tend to melt much more quickly, while oils/fats high in stearic and palmitic acid add longevity.

Regarding the water droplets - what kind of formula did you make, and do you live in an area with high humidty? I ask because some soap formulas will get sweaty in high humidity areas. Salt bars are notorious for that, for example.

IrishLass

 

[Amy]

I would also add that if you use a soap calculator (I use soapcalc.net) it will tell you how hard your bar will be. There is a recommended range that you want to be within. You may figure out the problem by doing that. I've made recipes from books that I've later entered into soap calc and found them to be way too soft, cleansing, etc. Not all recipes in books are good!
You said you were new to soaping? Make sure you have a good soap dish that allows soap to dry between uses. That will help keep it from being a slimy mess.

 

[IrishLass]

I would also add that if you use a soap calculator (I use soapcalc.net) it will tell you how hard your bar will be. There is a recommended range that you want to be within. You may figure out the problem by doing that.

SoapCalc is great and I highly recommend it (it's my favorite calculator to use), but just be aware that the 'qualities' numbers it gives you can be very decieving. For example, the Soapcalc numbers say that a 100% olive oil soap will have a hardness level of 17 and a cleansing level of zero, which is far from reality. My 100% olive oil soaps are rock hard (as hard as my 100% coconut oil soaps) and they cleanse just fine. That's not to say that the numbers are useless, though. Far from it. I've found them wonderfully consistent enough in their own quirky way to be used as a sounding board of sorts to tweak your formulas so that your future batches will exhibit more of this or less of that. That's where those numbers really shine. But taking them at face value can get you all mixed up and confused.

Not all recipes in books are good!
You said you were new to soaping? Make sure you have a good soap dish that allows soap to dry between uses. That will help keep it from being a slimy mess.

Very true. Some recipes found in books and on the net can be downright dangerous. Always run recipes through an online calculator to get the proper amounts of water and lye. Even those recipes you find here. Sometimes typos are made and it's always better to be safe than sorry.

Ditto on the well-draining soap dish. I never bathe/shower without one. :wink:


IrishLass

 

[sarge4j]

Where I live has a relatively high humidity but other types of soap I have bought in the past don't behave that way-producing droplets of water on the soap bar after and between uses. I also use palm kernel oil which contains lauric acid. Which other types of oils which are easily acquirable do you recommend that help make the soap long lasting?
I don't really know the types of soap making formulas there are being a newbie but this is the recipe I used, if you can go through it and help check it kindly let me know what adjustments you'd recommend.
NaOH-1kg in 180cl of water with density of 13kg/m^3
SLS (Sodium lauryl sulphate) - 1/2 kg in 1 ltr of water
Palm kernel Oil (2 times the lye solution in volume)
sodium sulphate -1/2kg
STPP (Sodium Tripoly phosphate)- 1/8kg
Sodium Carbonate (Soda Ash)-1kg in 1 ltr of water with density of 12.75kg/m^3
Calcium Carbonate- 1/2kg
Silicate- 30 cl
Glycerine - 10 cl

 

[sudbubblez]

I believe those droplets are from the glycerine. It is a humectant and will draw moisture out of the air. You mentined other soaps you "bought" didn't do this. The bar soaps at the major retailers have had their glycerin harvested out because its a valuable commodity they can sell seperately and because it gums up the machinery. The glycerin is a good thing.

 

[Soap Techniques]

For example, the Soapcalc numbers say that a 100% olive oil soap will have a hardness level of 17 and a cleansing level of zero, which is far from reality. My 100% olive oil soaps are rock hard

I believe that the hardness number refers to solubility of the soap, not whether or not it is as hard as a rock physically.
Castille is very hard after a decent cure, but it's very soluble - it will melt quickly. That’s the nature of the oleic fatty acid.

 

[IrishLass]

For example, the Soapcalc numbers say that a 100% olive oil soap will have a hardness level of 17 and a cleansing level of zero, which is far from reality. My 100% olive oil soaps are rock hard

I believe that the hardness number refers to solubility of the soap, not whether or not it is as hard as a rock physically.
Castille is very hard after a decent cure, but it's very soluble - it will melt quickly. That’s the nature of the oleic fatty acid.

I don't know about that.... The theory does not seem to fit with how my 100% CO bar, which has a hardness number of 79, melts much faster than my 100% olive oil soap which has a hardness number of 17.


IrishLass

 

[sudbubblez]

The denser oils cure slower. It might be dissolving faster because its got more moisture content than the castile. One of my books monitored moisture content of 100% CO and it took 60 days for the full water CO to drop to the moisture content the 1:1 CO was on day one. I believe he was curing on racks.

 

[SkinLover]

Hello all,
Am kind of new to soap making and I had 2 major problems with a batch I made.
Its dissolves quite fast with use, can it be made long lasting?
Secondly, from the first use it produces small droplets of water all over the soap bar when it should have dried and continues this way in between uses. How can I prevent this?

May I ask what oils you used and at what %, or was it a glycerine soap base you were working with?

Glycerine soaps can be notorious for 'sweating', but I've not come across the problem with the regular cp soaps I've made (although I have often wondered if it could occur in humid, tropical climates?).

As for not lasting long, yes, as others have said, cp soap should be cured for between 4-6 weeks before using, but I'd add to that, that if I'm using a higher % of 'soft oils' like olive oil (which I love), then I'll also add between 1-2% sodium lactate to help harden the bar and make it easier to unmold.

 

[Soap Techniques]

The theory does not seem to fit with how my 100% CO bar, which has a hardness number of 79, melts much faster than my 100% olive oil soap which has a hardness number of 17.

Perhaps, the level of superfat also plays a role in it...
But sodium oleate is the most soluble of all the fatty acid soaps, that's why the 'slime' is typical of Castile soaps.

 

[sarge4j]

I really appreciate the replies, its enlightening, it answers a lot of thoughts both stated and unstated, i have added the recipe i used for people who wanted to help go through it for recommended adjustments, especially from irishlass and skin lover who asked to see it. Its the 6th in the list of posts to this topics, thanks a lot guys.

 

[Genny]

NaOH-1kg in 180cl of water with density of 13kg/m^3
SLS (Sodium lauryl sulphate) - 1/2 kg in 1 ltr of water
Palm kernel Oil (2 times the lye solution in volume)
sodium sulphate -1/2kg
STPP (Sodium Tripoly phosphate)- 1/8kg
Sodium Carbonate (Soda Ash)-1kg in 1 ltr of water with density of 12.75kg/m^3
Calcium Carbonate- 1/2kg
Silicate- 30 cl
Glycerine - 10 cl

Can I ask what kind of soap you were trying to make? These aren't the normally seen ingredients in CP soap making, that's why I ask.