palm oil...liquid @ room temp ok?

[jessicammorton]

I just got mymost recent order of palm oil in from New Directions Aromatics. It arrived much different than previous batches...so liquid it leaked out all over the box, and even after 48 hours @ 65-75 degrees in my storage closet, it is still liquid (I thought I could blame the 90+ degree heat here in CO, but that is not 100% the case it seems). NDA's rep informed me that yes, they had recently changed suppliers, and that this new batch is much softer (i.e. "liquid") at room temp than previous batches. No one could tell me if this characteristic in the oil was going to affect the hardness of my CP soaps.

My question for you soapers...
1) has anyone purchased the organic palm oil from NDA recently, and what has your experience been?
2) if the palm oil is liquid at room temp, vs. semil-solid, will it set up in my soap the same, or is my soap going to be softer?

Wish I'd known about the supplier change when I ordered! :?

 

[carebear]

it can take a few day for it to harden up. mix well and then pour some off and see if it'll harden in the fridge overnight.

if it stays liquid that means it wasn't well mixed before your portion was poured off - the stearic part tends to settle out. so if that happens I'd call NDA, because it will NOT perform correctly in soap.

 

[Woodi]

I usually buy palm oil in a 20kg plastic pail from a food wholesaler near here.

Palm oil does have a strange character....the stearic eventually drops to the bottom of the barrel. So I was noticing that batches made later got harder and harder, as I dug to the bottom of that pail.

Once I knew this, my procedure went like this:

I would melt the entire contents of the large bucket,(by standing it in a deep sink of hot hot water) so I could stir it with a large wooden spoon, right to the bottom of the bucket. Then I would immediately scoop out just the amount I would need for one batch,(usually about 21 ounces), put it into a mason jar.
I would do up a couple dozen of these jars at a time, and have them ready for whenever I wanted to make soap.

Messy and time-consuming at first, but easy as it went. Then I'd put the jars into the dishwasher upstairs after each one got emptied. That way, I would have clean jars for my next palm oil shipment.

If the oil stays liquid on you and doesn't harden, it will affect the hardness of your soap....cuz maybe what they sold you was skimmed from the top of their barrel (or bucket, whatever).

I agree with carebear: if your palm doesn't harden at all, I'd call NDA and talk with them about it.

Cuz an oil that stays liquid at room temp will do that in your soaps. Soap is usually used and stored at room temp, right?

 

[jessicammorton]

oh bummer....I figured as much :-( I hope I can find a local source for it, as I am needing to make some soap ASAP! Thanks for the info about the stearic acid - good to know.

 

[jessicammorton]

It doesn't sound like I'll be able to get NDA to take that palm oil back...I have stearic acid at home, can I add some to my formula to harden the bars, and bring the palm oil's properties back to where they should have been? Unfortunately no one sells this product locally, and Mountain Rose Herbs is out of it too! Any other suppliers out there you would recommend that sells *consistent* organic palm fruit oil? Thx

 

[scouter139]

NDA shipped a product that leaked all over the box, shipped product that could possibly not be usable and they won't replace it? I'm glad they don't want it back (so they can't resell it) but good customer service would be to send out a new batch asap for no charge. I don't think I'd order from them again. They don't offer any guarantee?

 

[jessicammorton]

They finally did agree to take it back, but will only refund 50% of the freight (and that's to Canada!) No offer to replace the product, but they do offer a refund...will take several weeks to process though. Yeah, I have had some bad customer service experiences with them, I have definitely taken the bulk of my biz elsewhere...but they are the only ones that offer some of the products I need. I don't highly recommend them. Do you have some recommended suppliers?

 

[scouter139]

That's good to hear, hope it works out. I get most of my stuff locally and I don't make alot of soap, only for my family and a few friends. I have purchased oils, shea and mango butter from Wholesale Supplies Plus and was very pleased with the quality. Looks like they are offering free shipping in the continental us with a $15 purchase. I've purchased from Brambleberry, Peak and Nature's Garden and was pleased with all of them.

Good luck, check back and let us know how they handle your money back...no better place than here to vent. It sure does help all of the members, remember there is probably less than 10% of total people who view this forum who actually post. I would imagine 90+% are just lurkers who love to read.

 

[jessicammorton]

Just ordered some organic palm fruit oil from J. Edwards...I have delat with them before and they have great customer service. Wish I had remembered that they carried this product before I re-ordered from NDA! Oh well, I guess it's time I finally put together a supplier spreadsheet

 

[carebear]

[quote="scouter139"...Wholesale Supplies Plus and was very pleased with the quality. Looks like they are offering free shipping in the continental us with a $15 purchase. [/quote]

sorry - guess again. it ain't free. they've simply rolled the shipping and handling (plus often a substantial price increase) into the basic price. there are instances where this results in a cost savings, but those seem to be few and far between.


oh, and the $15 is a minimum order amount (if your order comes to less than $15 they simply charge you $15...).

 

[Best Natural Soap]

Anyone want to share their REALLY good total price (price+shipping) suppliers?
I'll share mine for shea butter-- Soaper's Choice. WSP runs $80 for 10 #'s, where Soaper's Choice is $49.00 (that includes $7 shipping). That's a big difference, and it's only on one oil.

 

[Best Natural Soap]

This is from a product review for WSP's palm on their site--
"At first I was not sure. I did not like having to pour the product from a bucket. This product stays in a fluid-like state in my storage area even at 72F. My previous supplier had a palm oil that could be scooped. But the benefit to having this semi-liquid palm oil is that I can add ROE directly to the bucket to aid in it's preservation. This benefit has greater value than having a "scoopable" palm oil..."

My palm from WSP has always been a solid, with a little puddle (1/4 c. worth?) in the middle of the 3 gal. bucket.
I just wanted to post that- there seems to be inconsistency in palm's consistency (!) even with the same supplier.
Do you think it might have to do with getting hot during shipment?

 

[scouter139]

Bummer about wsp...must have ordered before the increase..don't remember it being too overpriced.

 

[dcornett]

Bummer about wsp...must have ordered before the increase..don't remember it being too overpriced.

Yes, their prices have went way up! Back in March I only paid $15.50 for a gallon of palm oil, a few months later it sells for $20.50 a gal. and their fo's have skyrocketed!!!

 

[scouter139]

Yep, that is a heck of an increase. Probably was December or January when I ordered last.