Oil percentage, is this good?

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jellybeanskie

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35% olive pomace oil
35% coconut oil
15% sweet almond oil
10% avocado oil
5% jojoba

I know I should try first but just wanna know if this has an automatic "Kitten Love" reaction for master soapers out here :) Comment would be highly appreaciated. I want a really really great bar so no worries on the price

Follow up: Should I still put sodium lactate or my coconut oil will be enough?
 

lsg

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35% coconut may be too drying for the skin.
Maybe try this:

32% Olive pomace
25% coconut
20% Palm (You can substitute the new Crisco with palm for this)
15% sweet almond
8% Castor
 

jellybeanskie

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35% coconut may be too drying for the skin.
Maybe try this:

32% Olive pomace
25% coconut
20% Palm (You can substitute the new Crisco with palm for this)
15% sweet almond
8% Castor
I dont want to use palm :) May I ask why you removed avocado and jojoba? thanks!
 

Dawni

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I can take a guess.

5% is too less for some people to feel the effects of the oil in soap and if you use it in 15% or higher it's like a "waste" to use a luxury oil in soap, since saponification changes a lot. Jojoba would be better suited in leave on products.

The switch to palm from avocado could simply be because you're lacking an oil that lends hardness? Both sweet almond and avocado, together with high olive might give you soft soap. If you don't want use palm, your options for hardeners are the animal fats, the butters and the waxes.

lsg or another experienced soaper will come n correct me if I'm wrong :)
 

jellybeanskie

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I can take a guess.

5% is too less for some people to feel the effects of the oil in soap and if you use it in 15% or higher it's like a "waste" to use a luxury oil in soap, since saponification changes a lot. Jojoba would be better suited in leave on products.

The switch to palm from avocado could simply be because you're lacking an oil that lends hardness? Both sweet almond and avocado, together with high olive might give you soft soap. If you don't want use palm, your options for hardeners are the animal fats, the butters and the waxes.

lsg or another experienced soaper will come n correct me if I'm wrong :)
I've read jojoba threads here and people are saying 5% is already enough to feel the changes. But do know that I am aware that is more effective in leave on products as well as avocado.

Maybe I can just leave out avocado oil?
35%coconut
35%olive pomace oil
25% sweet almond
5% jojoba
 

Dawni

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I've read jojoba threads here and people are saying 5% is already enough to feel the changes. But do know that I am aware that is more effective in leave on products as well as avocado.

Maybe I can just leave out avocado oil?
35%coconut
35%olive pomace oil
25% sweet almond
5% jojoba
Ah ok.. Wasn't speaking from experience anyway, just what I've read, coz jojoba is expensive where I am so I was bound to be corrected lol

I will agree though, from experience, that 35% coconut will probably be too drying/stripping for you unless you up the superfat, sacrificing some lather.

And, also from experience, I'd still say you might need some sort of hardener.....
 

earlene

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Have you made soap so high in CO before? That's really high for some people's skin, unless you use a higher SF.

Also with that much CO & that much pomace OO, the recipe will move very fast, so I would recommend that you stir this one by hand only and not use a SB at all.
 

jellybeanskie

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Have you made soap so high in CO before? That's really high for some people's skin, unless you use a higher SF.

Also with that much CO & that much pomace OO, the recipe will move very fast, so I would recommend that you stir this one by hand only and not use a SB at all.
I will have 5% superfat for that recipe

Ive listened to your suggestions and ive decided on this:
45% olive pomace
30% coconut
20% sweet almond
5% jojba
 

The Efficacious Gentleman

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You might well like it. Make a small batch, though, as you might well not like it at all.

When looking at oils for use in soap, don't think of them as the oils themselves - what is left after saponification rarely has the same properties as the oil which went in.

The coconut is a prime example - is good for the skin as an oil, is very drying when saponified. So with many of the more expensive oils you can look at the properties of the saponified oil and get the same results with a cheaper oil in the majority of cases
 

KiwiMoose

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Have you thought about adding some cocoa butter for hardness? The coconut oil will lather up very quickly and your bars will wear out quickly too. Maybe only last a week at most.
 

shunt2011

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@jellybeanskie I like avocado oil in my soap. I use it at 15-20% in a couple recipes. It makes a lovely soap. I don't find it that expensive to use personally.

@KiwiMoose I use CO at 25% in a couple of my soaps and my soaps last a good long time. However, it also has hard oils in it that help. A lot is how the recipe is designed. The recipe as posted will be a decent bar after a good cure I think. The key is a well balance bar. They just need to make a small batch and then let it cure and test it out.
 

KiwiMoose

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How about this?
Almond oil 10%
Avocado Oil 15%
Cocoa Butter 20%
Coconut oil 25%
Olive oil pomace 30%
It’s just a suggestion, there are many ways to skin a cat.
 

earlene

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When I use butters in my recipes, I usually use a minimum of 15%. I don't know if it's true, but I was told and also read in a few places that anything less than 15% didn't make enough difference to be noticeable. I took that on faith without testing it out to see if I would notice any difference, though, so I cannot confirm or deny that it's true.
 

The Efficacious Gentleman

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I think it depends on the rest of the recipe. Adding in a butter which is very similar to another hard oil will be hard to notice unless the amount is high. But in a recipe with no other hard oils......it will be like adding in that much of a hard oil
 

Susie

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In my humble opinion, even 25% CO is too much. However, experience is the best teacher. So, why not make all of the above recipes and try them out? Then you can compare them and learn what YOU like. I learned a ton by changing ingredients 5% at the time.
 

jellybeanskie

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In my humble opinion, even 25% CO is too much. However, experience is the best teacher. So, why not make all of the above recipes and try them out? Then you can compare them and learn what YOU like. I learned a ton by changing ingredients 5% at the time.
will do! thanks! :)
 

jellybeanskie

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Have you made soap so high in CO before? That's really high for some people's skin, unless you use a higher SF.

Also with that much CO & that much pomace OO, the recipe will move very fast, so I would recommend that you stir this one by hand only and not use a SB at all.
Hi! I just tried my recipe and what you said was soooooooooooo true. It was like seconds only!! I used a mixer yesterday. HAHAHA. My 1st trial was super flop because it was pretty much chunky already and then my 2nd trial was a bit better because I lessened the mixing time in half and moved very fast. This will be a very hard reciper to use if I plan on designing my soaps. Huhu. Any recommendations?

Olive pomace: 45%
Coconut: 35%
Sweet almond: 10%
Jojoba oil: 5%
Cocoa butter: 5%

Did a 5% superfat

Scent: peppermint FO (yes not EO) 1.5% PPO
Additives: white kaolin clay 1% PPO and menthol crystal 1% PPO

Temp: oil around 35degC
 

Dawni

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I hope this recipe works for you. I know you said you already had a 5% superfat but what several of us tried to say is you either need more SF or use less coconut. Update us after cure, you could be one of the few who can tolerate high coconut in soap :)

If you want swirls with that recipe you'll have to use less water, and soap cool... And probably learn how to tell emulsion from trace so you can stop blending at that point to mix your colors n stuff.

Here's an ongoing discussion regarding trace and water.

And here's a video on emulsion that I think everyone should watch lol I do so still every now n then because I still miss it every now n then and have to go to plan B coz of thick trace haha.

So..... Pictures? :D
 

earlene

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Hi! I just tried my recipe and what you said was soooooooooooo true. It was like seconds only!! I used a mixer yesterday. HAHAHA. My 1st trial was super flop because it was pretty much chunky already and then my 2nd trial was a bit better because I lessened the mixing time in half and moved very fast. This will be a very hard reciper to use if I plan on designing my soaps. Huhu. Any recommendations?

Olive pomace: 45%
Coconut: 35%
Sweet almond: 10%
Jojoba oil: 5%
Cocoa butter: 5%

Did a 5% superfat

Scent: peppermint FO (yes not EO) 1.5% PPO
Additives: white kaolin clay 1% PPO and menthol crystal 1% PPO

Temp: oil around 35degC
For intricate swirls, you need a slow moving recipe, so this one won't do at all for fancy designs.

So I would suggest switching to plain OO (not pomace), because plain OO does not speed up trace the way pomace does. You an use any other grade of OO in soap; some like Extra Virgin OO for soap, but I prefer that for food consumption due to it's high cost where I live. But it doesn't have to be OO at all, just any oil that doesn't speed trace can be used.

The second thing I would suggest is to lower your Coconut oil to no more than 20%. That still might be too high for some folks skin, but you will have to figure that out with testing after the soap cures.

I'd keep the Cocoa butter at 5%, but I'd take out the jojoba oil (which is really a wax according to some sources) unless it is very inexpensive where you live.

Then, of course, run whatever changes you make to your recipe through your lye calculator and give it a try. If the stearic acid content is very high in your resulting recipe, it will probably be a fast moving recipe, which will mean you won't have much time for swirls. But you might be able to manage layers of colors if you soap somewhat cool and move fast. But you do need the batter to be warm enough to keep your hard oils clear, so that can affect how cool you soap, which of course affects how long you have to play with your design.

Another thing you can do is alter your lye concentration (amount of water and lye mixture). One would think that a lot of water gives you more time to work, but that is only true with some recipes. If you have oils that don't heat up fast, it is true, but for oils that heat up a lot, it is the opposite (in my experience). So for your particular recipe, using a lower water amount might give you more time, although not much as that's going to move really fast even with less water anyway. Maybe it is too soon in your soap making journey to start playing with water amounts, though. But keep it in mind for the future.

It takes practice to learn to move at the rate your recipe warrants in order to get the designs you want.
 
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