Lets talk about vanilla discoloration and CPOP....maybe just gel in general?

[Megan]

So I've noticed something very interesting over the last year or so when I've started CPOPing almost all of my soaps. I moved into a cold house during winter and it was the only option.

I've noticed pretty regularly that when I CPOP, vanilla discoloration is minimized...even as the bar is curing...even after a year. I've noticed a stark difference on partially gelled bars on rate of discoloration.
People have called me crazy...and maybe I am (maybe I need to do a controlled study)...but has anyone else experienced this? Also, if so, does anyone have an explanation?

 

[Arimara]

I rarely CPOP soap. I can't say that I experienced this wither as I have forced gel on almost all my soaps and still got deep discoloration.

 

[jcandleattic]

My soaps very rarely discolor due to scent. I use a really good VS and don't experience discoloration in general and I force gel all my soaps. Sorry I can't be of help.

 

[shunt2011]

I'm the same as Jcandleattic. I force gel and use VS in fragrances I know discolor for the most part. I just insulate well I don't CPOP except individual molds.

 

[Megan]

I tend to stay away from VS just because I don't feel like the added cost would be worth it for me. To be fair, the discoloration I've avoided using this method is tan at worst, I've not tried with a dark brown discoloring fragrance yet. I tend to avoid the really high vanillin ones anyway. I do really feel like I should due an actual experiment regarding this. I just have to design a good test and find the time.

 

[jcandleattic]

I tend to stay away from VS just because I don't feel like the added cost would be worth it for me. To be fair, the discoloration I've avoided using this method is tan at worst, I've not tried with a dark brown discoloring fragrance yet. I tend to avoid the really high vanillin ones anyway. I do really feel like I should due an actual experiment regarding this. I just have to design a good test and find the time.

I would have to go look up my actual costs, but it's really not that expensive, (I think something like .02 a bar or something like that) and the results are so worth it. I've kept discoloration away from very very dark discoloring FO's for over a year, and others indefinitely. Since I only do 4 shows a year, and start my production in January for those shows (all in Oct, Nov, & Dec.) I need something this is going to last.

 

[Witeaynjil]

My soaps very rarely discolor due to scent. I use a really good VS and don't experience discoloration in general and I force gel all my soaps. Sorry I can't be of help.

Which VS do you use. I have always stayed away from FO's that have vanilla and recently found one I just love but it discolors badly. I want to get a really food VS. Please help.

 

[jcandleattic]

Which VS do you use. I have always stayed away from FO's that have vanilla and recently found one I just love but it discolors badly. I want to get a really food VS. Please help.

The one from BCN. I've tried at least 5 other supplier's VS and none have been as good as the one from BCN. Some of the others wouldn't even hold off the discoloration through a full cure. Never had that problem with BCN's formula.

 

[Megan]

The one from BCN. I've tried at least 5 other supplier's VS and none have been as good as the one from BCN. Some of the others wouldn't even hold off the discoloration through a full cure. Never had that problem with BCN's formula.

How long does it last past a year?

 

[cmzaha]

The only difference I have noticed is between my two main recipes. I do use a lot of discoloring fo's without a stabilizer. I have found many times my vegan recipe doesn't turn as dark as the same fo will in my non-vegan recipe. I do force all soaps to gel so that is not the answer.

 

[jcandleattic]

How long does it last past a year?

Depends on the scent.
I've had pink sugar stay pink with only the outer edges start to brown after 11 months, but after 3 years, still only the edges were brown.
I've had my vanilla silk soaps never brown, and some other scents just turn a little tan to darker tan after about 9 months.

 

[Megan]

The only difference I have noticed is between my two main recipes. I do use a lot of discoloring fo's without a stabilizer. I have found many times my vegan recipe doesn't turn as dark as the same fo will in my non-vegan recipe. I do force all soaps to gel so that is not the answer.

Hmmm...this could be a factor for me I guess...my base doesn't use any animal fats...but I also wonder how this would work. I would think the soaps with the most unsaturated fats would create a pro-oxidizing enviroment...and I use mostly unsaturated...

 

[Witeaynjil]

The one from BCN. I've tried at least 5 other supplier's VS and none have been as good as the one from BCN. Some of the others wouldn't even hold off the discoloration through a full cure. Never had that problem with BCN's formula.

Sorry, who is BCN?

 

[amd]

Sorry, who is BCN?

Bitter Creek Candle Supply

 

[Cosmo71]

does vanilla stabilizer accelerate your soap batter in any way. Can I expect true color if I use vanilla stabilizer? How much vanilla stabilizer does one use per pound of oils? Thank you.

 

[shunt2011]

does vanilla stabilizer accelerate your soap batter in any way. Can I expect true color if I use vanilla stabilizer? How much vanilla stabilizer does one use per pound of oils? Thank you.

I've not noticed any acceleration. I get true colors with VS in my soaps. I use Bittercreeks as well and it's the best on the market. I too have tried many. How I mix it varies depending on how much vanilla is in the FO. If it's relatively low I'll use half the amount of FO. So, 3 oz FO and 1.5 oz VS. If it's higher Vanilla I'll use 1:1 or 1.5:1. One of my favorite fragrances is Vanilla Champagne from NG and it gets pretty dark. With VS 1:1 it stayed a year and a half before it started discoloring some. I've made it several times for baby/bridal shower favors. I don't mind the discoloration myself.

 

[AliOop]

Is Bittercreek the one that adjusts shipping after you have placed the order? I was just looking at buying some of their VS, but the shipping quote makes it outrageous.

 

[dibbles]

@AliOop, they have adjusted shipping in the past. I think that someone commented not long ago (since I've last ordered) that they are only using USPS now, so I'm not sure that this is still true.

I also use BCN VS and I add it to my oils and stick blend it in well at a 1:1 rate of FO. The one time I mixed it directly with the FO, I had a bright yellow, gloppy mess. With the few FOs I have that discolor dark brown, I end up with a very light tan color. With the FOs that don't discolor that much there is no discoloration, or nothing more than ivory. I mostly use white mica rather than TD, so my soaps aren't bright paper-white to begin with, but I would still call them white.

 

[AliOop]

@dibbles thank you, that is good to know. For a $32 order, I'm looking at $18 shipping via UPS ground. I'm really waffling because I really want a good vanilla stabilizer. Sigh.

 

[Jersey Girl]

@dibbles thank you, that is good to know. For a $32 order, I'm looking at $18 shipping via UPS ground. I'm really waffling because I really want a good vanilla stabilizer. Sigh.

Same here. Couldn’t justify the shipping. It’s was $18 for me too.