Combining lye and oils immediately??

[ZanyZoaps]

I have ALWAYS (for 7 years now) made my lye mixture, and separately melted my oils, then get the two down to the same temps (within a few degrees of each other) THEN combine them and mix with a stick blender until trace.

Recently I heard that some people mix their lye with liquid, then immediately slowly add the oils to it while mixing. (adding hard oils to softer oils in order).

THEN they pour it into a big mold, cover, and let it sit for apx 2 hours... at this point they uncover it and CUT It!!!

:shock::shock:This goes against EVERY thing I know as a soaper.:shock::shock:

I want to try it, but I don't want to needlessly use precious oils for a failed batch either.

Anyone do it this way??

 

[DeeAnna]

There are people, myself included, who add hot lye solution to room-temp solid fats and let the heat from the lye solution melt the fats. After all is melted, I then add the liquid fats and make the soap as usual. It works.

"...THEN they pour it into a big mold, cover, and let it sit for apx 2 hours... at this point they uncover it and CUT It!!!..."

Can't say I've heard about this part, however. Can you give a link to the info so the rest of us can read about what you're talking about?

 

[ZanyZoaps]

I watched a video by the "West Ladies". This is a link to the youtube excerpt of the DVD, but it doesn't show the actual video of soap making there.
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDJRrHERbvI[/ame]

I may try this method in a half batch, but not cut it early like they do.

Thanks for your input. Good to know there are others who do it this way. Seems sooo much easier than what I do.

What do you do if you want to add goats milk to the batch? When do you add that?

 

[seven]

What do you do if you want to add goats milk to the batch? When do you add that?

you can do a full liquid swap or partial.

full swap, that means adding the lye to the milk. make sure the milk is frozen, and add the lye slowly to avoid milk getting burned.

partial, usually 50-50. mix lye with water (at least 100% of lye weight), and let the rest of liquid be goat milk. the milk doesn't have to be frozen if you choose this method. you can add the milk to the oils prior to adding the lye, or afterwards.

 

[DeeAnna]

There's no real reason why a person can't cut a CP soap shortly after making it, assuming it's firm enough to unmold and cut.

The ladies in the video are emphasizing the old-fashioned aspect of soap making, so it might be that they're making soap with all solid fats -- lard, tallow, etc. These soaps are very likely firm enough to cut a few hours after making. Only problem is the saponification probably isn't done by that point, so I'd want to use gloves to protect my hands if I did that.

I grew up watching my grandmother make lard-lye soap. I know she didn't cut until a day or so after she made it, so there's not any "old time magic" about cutting the soap just a few hours old unless you're making a soap that is too hard or brittle to cut if you wait longer. Some soaps are -- salt soap comes to mind.

 

[gpeppers]

There's no real reason why a person can't cut a CP soap shortly after making it, assuming it's firm enough to unmold and cut.

The ladies in the video are emphasizing the old-fashioned aspect of soap making, so it might be that they're making soap with all solid fats -- lard, tallow, etc. These soaps are very likely firm enough to cut a few hours after making. Only problem is the saponification probably isn't done by that point, so I'd want to use gloves to protect my hands if I did that.

I grew up watching my grandmother make lard-lye soap. I know she didn't cut until a day or so after she made it, so there's not any "old time magic" about cutting the soap just a few hours old unless you're making a soap that is too hard or brittle to cut if you wait longer. Some soaps are -- salt soap comes to mind.

Salt soap?! You have my curiosity up. What is it and when do you add the salt? Do you just make salty water to which you add the lye?

Once I tried to make soap out of some rancid coconut oil and I guess I didn't let the two mixtures (lye water and fats) get either cool enough to the right temp or the temperature differential between them was too high. Whatever it was, it did make the volcano erupt all over the kitchen.

I wonder whether doing soap this (suggested above) way has that element of potential outcome? A very large vessel and a small batch could be called for, just in case.

 

[gpeppers]

I have ALWAYS (for 7 years now) made my lye mixture, and separately melted my oils, then get the two down to the same temps (within a few degrees of each other) THEN combine them and mix with a stick blender until trace.

Recently I heard that some people mix their lye with liquid, then immediately slowly add the oils to it while mixing. (adding hard oils to softer oils in order).

THEN they pour it into a big mold, cover, and let it sit for apx 2 hours... at this point they uncover it and CUT It!!!

:shock::shock:This goes against EVERY thing I know as a soaper.:shock::shock:

I want to try it, but I don't want to needlessly use precious oils for a failed batch either.

Anyone do it this way??

I would be up for trying this with a small batch of lard I have on hand and have to use up. Have you done it yet?

 

[gpeppers]

I have ALWAYS (for 7 years now) made my lye mixture, and separately melted my oils, then get the two down to the same temps (within a few degrees of each other) THEN combine them and mix with a stick blender until trace.

Recently I heard that some people mix their lye with liquid, then immediately slowly add the oils to it while mixing. (adding hard oils to softer oils in order).

THEN they pour it into a big mold, cover, and let it sit for apx 2 hours... at this point they uncover it and CUT It!!!

:shock::shock:This goes against EVERY thing I know as a soaper.:shock::shock:

I want to try it, but I don't want to needlessly use precious oils for a failed batch either.

Anyone do it this way??

you have more experience than I do; maybe you can answer a question for me. I have used both koh and noh; I prefer hot process (which no one seems to do anymore?!) My soap never seems to come out as hard as it did the first batch or two. I've only been making soap for a few years (ie 5 or 6 batches in as many years). Do you think it matters which kind for this suggested way you mention? I would like to make it the most traditional way possible; it isn't rocket surgery after all. However, I'm also not meeting with wild success. When you say you get the two down to similar temps, does it matter how hot? ie I have heard 110 or something like that. What if they are close to each other but say hotter than 110?

 

[shunt2011]

NAOH is used for hard soaps and KOH is used for liquid soaps. Temperatures are relative to how you want to soap. Some as you see above do the thermal transfer method, some have their lye/oils close in temperature while still warm and then there are those that soap like me at room temp. I generally masterbatch my oils/butters in a 5 gallon bucket. I make my lye in the morning before I go to work and then when I get home I just measure out my oils for my batch and add the lye and I'm good to go. I also usually do a 50/50 water/lye solution and add milks to my oils once measured off for the other 50%

 

[MzMolly65]

I never wait for my lye and oil to be similar temperatures. I mix my lye and as soon as it's dissolved I pour it into my oils.

Lately I've been masterbatching lye so now it's room temperature for me to work with but it doesn't make any difference.

 

[DeeAnna]

"...Salt soap?! You have my curiosity up. What is it and when do you add the salt? Do you just make salty water to which you add the lye?..."

Either way.

Soap made with salt water is also called solseife: http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showthread.php?t=44266

Soap made with granular salt: http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showpost.php?p=64789&postcount=5 and http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showthread.php?t=35093

 

[Susie]

There are people, myself included, who add hot lye solution to room-temp solid fats and let the heat from the lye solution melt the fats. After all is melted, I then add the liquid fats and make the soap as usual. It works.

Thank you! I now have a new, simpler, method of making soap!

 

[houseofwool]

I do the same thing, adding the hot lye solution to my hard oils/fats and then once they are melted, I add the liquid oils. I generally add scents and any other additives to the liquid oils and stick blend like crazy to make sure it is well blended before adding to the lye/hard oil mixture.

 

[DeeAnna]

If the hot lye solution isn't quite hot enough to melt the hard fats completely, you could warm the liquid oils a bit in the microwave before adding them to the lye-solid fat mixture.

If the hard fats are mostly liquid-y with just some soft lumps remaining, I don't fuss around with that -- I just stick blend until the whole mess is smooth and then add the room-temperature liquid oils. That works fine for me and it keeps my batter cooler.

This method can slow trace so you can do swirls and other fancy work. Not that I'm any expert on fancy designs -- but I'm working on that.

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

I made this mistake with cacao butter - the lye temp wasn't quite hot enough to melt it down from room temp

 

[DeeAnna]

Good point, Gent. With cocoa butter I can definitely see that happening. As with so many things in life, it's always good to have a Plan B in mind, which is why I thought I should mention the "heat in the microwave" option.

 

[ZanyZoaps]

You have all been so much help! I'm off to make a batch this way right now.... if it works, soapmaking is going to be even MORE fun!! This way seems so 'freeing' to me!!