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RTCP Help ~ problem with batch

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perfectsoap

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Hi,
I used a high percentage coconut oil recipe I found on here and think I might have messed up.
4 lb
Coconut Oil - 54.4 oz (85%)
Shea Butter - 6.4 oz (10%)
Caster Oil - 3.2 oz (5%)
4oz FO
Super Fat at 20%, but left the H2O at38% of oils (mistake?)
Lye/Aloe Juice 50/50 mix - 15.37 oz
Aloe Juice - 18oz

The problem is the soap gelled in an oven with light on, looked fine, but know almost 24 hours later it has a 1/2 of oil (transparent) on top of the solid. Do I wait or did I mess up the recipe?

Thanks for any thoughts.
Jeff
 
G

Guest

Did you have trace or false trace? Sometimes with RTCP it's hard to tell until you make a few batches of it.......


Why did you put it in the oven with the light on?
 

perfectsoap

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Oven with light on - a suggestion I saw on here instead of using towels.

Trace... I thought I did lol!
I think I remember hearing that trace wasn't truly needed once as long as everything was mixed thoroughly, but I though I did.

DO I wait, or is there a fix?
 

perfectsoap

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I also thought it took a long time to trace, like ten min. with a hand blender... is my recipe ok?
Faithy - What does your 50/50 aloe lye mix look like?
Just 50 Aloe Juice and 50 Lye by weight, correct?
 
G

Guest

I have used a hand mixer before when my old stick blender died in the middle of a project. And I scrambled for it so i wouldn't ruin my project. So I know if you use a hand blender takes a bit longer than using a stick blender. (they function a bit differently, so you may have not gotten them blended as much as you needed.)


It sounds silly but I have a baby quilt that I made. I couldn't sell the darn thing on ebay and it really turned out cute!!! *sigh* My daughter refuses to play with dolls, so I now use it to wrap around my soap. Since it's about 34x34 oh and it even has satin binding....... 8) I think i have the coolest soap warmer ever.

But you might want to use a towel or even a baby blanket instead. It's cheaper to operate then your oven light. :p


But your superfat % might have been a little high. I recently made a batch with 55% coconut oil and 15% superfat and Paul suggested the recipe you used. And he suggested 12% superfat on that.


Because I have small children around and my two youngest are special needs, I can't run the risk of keeping a lye liquid around. So I make up each batch as I need them. But Paul or one of the others will have the answer to that.
 
G

Guest

Trace to RTCP soap is when you can see the lines forming at the top of the mixture. Sorta like when you make a box of jello-0 pudding. And it starts to thicken.... That's what I compare to trace. Not the finished pudding product after it's had a chance to fully thicken.
 

perfectsoap

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Sorry, I meant to say stick blender.
The recipe is from Paul, but it did have 18-20%.
I don't know it leaving the water at 38% on th4e soap calc. was a mistake or if I didn't get to a true trace...
Can I remelt and ?
or is it trash?
Thanks!
Jeff
 
G

Guest

Since I'm not familiar with the 50/50 aloe lye mix and how to adjust your recipe accordingly.

I'd wait till Paul arrives or one of the others who use it to make sure the lye/liquid amounts are correct.

If they are correct yes you should be able to rebatch it. And at least try to save it.

If it's not correct Paul will have the best solution to the problem.
 

Soapmaker Man

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Well for one thing, I never use a 50% lye solution in a batch, never! I start out with a 50% solution, and by adding my goats milk, it comes down to about a 30 to 33% solution in the batch. That is why I do a 50% solution in aloe vera juice, so I can add the rest as GM while I'm stick blending the oils. This also keeps my gm from burning and keeps my soap a nice off white colour. I've never soaped a batch over a 35% solution as it is dangerous. I'd re-batch as I think you have separation issues due to a lye that was int incorporated into the oils.

I really need to do a seep-by-step tutorial with pics an how I come from a 50% lye solution to a 30% solution. It is super duper easy peasy.

Someone asked me if my lye solution weakened since I store my aloe/lye solution in a HDPE safe bottle at RT. The answer is NO! I have solution that is a month old and never have issues with the soap not going into gel, lye pockets, or anything like that. Draino used to be sodium hydroxide and a water solution and it was manufactured and used many months, or years later. Lye can;t loose strength when mixed with water or aloe vera juice and stored in an air tight container. It wont degrade the lye by storing it in a premixed solution in a correct container. My observations only over the past year or so.....

Paul

Paul
 
G

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Soapmaker Man said:
Well for one thing, I never use a 50% lye solution in a batch, never! I start out with a 50% solution, and by adding my goats milk, it comes down to about a 30 to 33% solution in the batch. That is why I do a 50% solution in aloe vera juice, so I can add the rest as GM while I'm stick blending the oils. This also keeps my gm from burning and keeps my soap a nice off white colour. I've never soaped a batch over a 35% solution as it is dangerous. I'd re-batch as I think you have separation issues due to a lye that was int incorporated into the oils.

I really need to do a seep-by-step tutorial with pics an how I come from a 50% lye solution to a 30% solution. It is super duper easy peasy.

Someone asked me if my lye solution weakened since I store my aloe/lye solution in a HDPE safe bottle at RT. The answer is NO! I have solution that is a month old and never have issues with the soap not going into gel, lye pockets, or anything like that. Draino used to be sodium hydroxide and a water solution and it was manufactured and used many months, or years later. Lye can;t loose strength when mixed with water or aloe vera juice and stored in an air tight container. It wont degrade the lye by storing it in a premixed solution in a correct container. My observations only over the past year or so.....

Paul

Paul

I know I'd be one who would love to learn more about the master batching of lye/aloe juice.

But with small kids around it just isn't possible to keep them in the type of container you do. But do you think a bleach bottle would be strong enough to handle the heat from the lye until it cools? Those have safey caps that are child safe, so that would work for me.

Plus even if i don't do it, i'd still like to learn how it's done and how to use it once it's mixed up back into any recipe.
 

perfectsoap

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Hi,
I used a high percentage coconut oil recipe I found on here and think I might have messed up.
4 lb
Coconut Oil - 54.4 oz (85%)
Shea Butter - 6.4 oz (10%)
Caster Oil - 3.2 oz (5%)
4oz FO
Super Fat at 20%, but left the H2O at38% of oils (mistake?)
Lye/Aloe Juice 50/50 mix - 15.37 oz
Aloe Juice - 18oz

The problem is the soap gelled in an oven with light on, looked fine, but know almost 24 hours later it has a 1/2 of oil (transparent) on top of the solid. Do I wait or did I mess up the recipe?

Thanks for any thoughts.
Jeff
The calulator said use:
24.32 oz water
8.957 oz lye

I used 18 oz of lye/aloe mix (50/50) right?
and them added 15.37 more of aloe juice.
Did I do that part wrong?
 

perfectsoap

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I forgot to add this part to the original~
The calulator said use:
24.32 oz water
8.957 oz lye
:oops:
Jeff
 

Soapmaker Man

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perfectsoap said:
I forgot to add this part to the original~
The calulator said use:
24.32 oz water
8.957 oz lye
:oops:
Jeff
Nope, if you added more aloe vera juice, than it should just fine. This is what I do, just add in as GM though. Strange :? Jeff, as everything seems to be just fine. It may have overheated in the oven and separated. I've had this happen a few times. Just re-batch and everything is salvageable. I'll try to get some pics of how I do my RTCP method with premixed lye solution, I'll shoot a video when I do my demo in May at the TN gathering and post it to youtube as a video. I can shoot it on my digital camera and upload it to youtube.

ETA; Faithy, I use a bleach jug to store my 50% solution in. Since we don't have kids and I have a dedicated soap/lotions room and keep the door closed most of the time, I can get away with leaving the bottle on my table or up on my supply racks, on the top rack above my oils and fo's/eo's.

Paul
 

perfectsoap

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was leaving the default water ate 38% of the oils on the soap calc. ok?
To re-batch a mess like this, just mix it all again?
Thanks so much Paul,
Jeff
 

Soapmaker Man

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perfectsoap said:
was leaving the default water ate 38% of the oils on the soap calc. ok?
To re-batch a mess like this, just mix it all again?
Thanks so much Paul,
Jeff
Yup, just chop it up, throw it in a double boiler or microwave, remelt, add a bit more fo if you want to, then get into your mold. All should be just fine, Jeff! :wink: :)
 

FSowers

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I made soap yesterday, and it did the same thing. Thought it had come to a light trace after beating it with the SB for over 10 minutes, then after being in the mold all day, I peaked and it was half oil, and half mud.

Had to put it in the mixer to get it to stay together. Finally had to make soap balls.

The soap fairies have it hard this past week, but made another batch today, that came out perfect with the same above recipe.

Soap fairies have moved on.
 
G

Guest

Soapmaker Man said:
Well for one thing, I never use a 50% lye solution in a batch, never! I start out with a 50% solution, and by adding my goats milk, it comes down to about a 30 to 33% solution in the batch. That is why I do a 50% solution in aloe vera juice, so I can add the rest as GM while I'm stick blending the oils. This also keeps my gm from burning and keeps my soap a nice off white colour. I've never soaped a batch over a 35% solution as it is dangerous. I'd re-batch as I think you have separation issues due to a lye that was int incorporated into the oils.


Paul

Paul
I soap at 50% with water all of the time and have never had any problems. I soap milk at 40-45%. Many soapers do in fact.

I wouldn't recommend it to newbies as it moves very quickly. I also use less of a discount when I am using finicky FOs.
 

pjb31apb

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Soapmaker Man said:
perfectsoap said:
I'll try to get some pics of how I do my RTCP method with premixed lye solution, I'll shoot a video when I do my demo in May at the TN gathering and post it to youtube as a video. I can shoot it on my digital camera and upload it to youtube.

Paul
One more addition to Paul's already yard long to so list! How do you keep it all straight? Seriously! How do you do it?
 

Soapmaker Man

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Yes, you can soap at 50% solution and below, but you do need to work fast and if using a floral scent, it is very hard at that percentage. :? It is not the % that was the issue in his batch, as I think it was overheating and that caused separation of oils in the mold in the oven. Anyone can soap at up to 50%, just have a fast hand...... I soap with milk at 30 to 33% so I can get multiple colours and swirls. That is why I soap cool too.


Paul
 

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