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Pine Tar question

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Scotsoap

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Does anyone know whether pine tar is actually saponifiable ? or is it just added for it's own properties ?

If it does saponify, does it lose anything ?
 

IanT

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do you mean pine sap?? ..I was wondering the same thing...like if you could put it in place of EO's or something like that...I wonder how itd effect the soap!
 

Scotsoap

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No I meant actual Pine Tar - the black gooey stuff - also known as Stockholm tar....I don't think it can be saponifiable because I cannot find it in any sap tables at all.
 

IanT

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maybe try looking up if any companies have done some research on its chemical ingredients??? and whether any of those are saponifyable?


Do you have any pics of the soap! would love to see it!
 

CPSoaper

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It has a listing for it on the soap calc.

I've made it once before. The soap came out very dark brown; almost looked like a batch of brownies. It has a very medicinal smell to it too. I think it is one of those scents that you either really like or really dislike. I think I lean towards the really dislike. I don't see how you could really use any fo or eo and not have the natural scent not overpower them.

When working with it, soap really cool and don't discount your water. It moves very fast. Use disposable cups to measure it. It sticks to EVERYTHING. Melt it in with your oils and be prepared for a stinky mess. Because you have to soap with full water, be prepared for a very soft soap that will need a very long cure.
 

Soapmaker Man

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Great points CPSoaper! Yes, the SAP vavue of Pine Tar is .043 according to Soapcalc. I add my Pine Tar, found at any Equine Center, at trace, and like CPS mentioned, kick yourself in the hind end because that stuff is soap on a stick in moments! :lol:

Paul
 

Scotsoap

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Update :

Well being a manic soaper like the rest of us :) I couldn't wait to try it, so I had a go before CPSoaper and Soapmakerman replied ( what can I say in my defense :lol: )

According to information read at Millersoap I chose a recipe and added my pine tar to it, I heated my oils and fats and added 2 teaspoons pine tar - not knowing how much would be too much in the first instance and seeing as I HP anyway it wouldn't matter if it was too little. Could always rebatch.

The pine tar I have is fairly viscous rather than solid, (apparently it can vary in viscosity/solidity due to it being a natural product etc) The spoonfuls were like thick honey.

I had heard that it can turn into soap on a stick fairly rapidly so I was prepared for that, but on adding the dissolved lye it didnt not trace immediately. I don't have a stick blender to I stirred gently looking for trace. I would say it took maybe 10 minutes to begin to trace and then it began to thicken but not rapidly.

Then it began to look grainy and then it began to separate or curdle, but the separated pieces were small and not at all chunky. Hurriedly consulting my troubleshooting section :) I decided it was possibly too much lye, so having nothing to lose I added a little more olive oil, it seemed to make a difference. I added more olive oil and suddenly it all came together in a lovely smooth mass once more.

Applying a little more heat it turned to the warm vaseline stage and stayed there. It was quite soft and pliable to work with. It was not pourable but glopped into the mould very nicely and behaved itself perfectly.

Due to the mad scientist gene I didnt wait 24 hours to unmould it, I took it out as soon as I could get it to release cleanly (flexible mould). Cut it up and gave it the litmus tongue test :) No zap just soap.

Of course I couldn't resist trying a piece could I ! Yes it was still a little soft but not gooey, by soft I mean I could feel it give when I pressed it but otherwise it was fairly solid. The wash test was fantastic, nice and creamy and lovely bubbles .. no doubt due to the base recipe but the pine tar didn't seem to have compromised any of those qualities.

The remaing pieces are drying very nicely and hardening.

The 2 teaspoonfuls ( in a 1lb batch) seem just right to me, the soap smells distinctly of pine tar but not overpowering and a very slight smell is left on the skin but that disappears quite quickly.

All in all I am really happy with the experiment and will definitely make more.
 

buffalosnowgirl

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Thank you for letting us know how it went! I just received my pine tar yesterday and plan on trying it out this weekend.

Glad it worked out for you!
 

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