Mostly butter soap?

[SudsyKat]

Would it make any sense to make a soap with mostly butters and hard oils? I've been wanting a harder, longer lasting bar and I'm wondering if that's one way to achieve it. I know that a longer curing time helps, and that you can add sodium lactate, but it just occurred to me that maybe you could do a lot of butter (and/or throw in some beeswax). It would be kind of a super rich, novelty bar.

I know it wouldn't be economical to use a lot of butter - nonetheless, it's a thought. And would it clog your pores, perhaps? I don't know.

On a side note, I know that sodium lactate produces a harder bar, but does it also make the soap last longer?

 

[krissy]

only if you want very stinky soap :wink:

 

[SudsyKat]

Why would it be stinky? Maybe I didn't clarify - by butter, I mean shea, cocoa, etc.

 

[krissy]

Why would it be stinky? Maybe I didn't clarify - by butter, I mean shea, cocoa, etc.

i thought you meant BUTTER! like for on top of toast! lol, yes you can use those other butters in soap!

 

[carebear]

I soap with 100% hard oils/butters all the time. You'll want to soap on the warm side to avoid horrid ash (110 - 120 F).

No need for beeswax.

Butters don't really lather well, so use lots of coconut oil with them. Then you'll probably want to increase your lye discount.

 

[PrairieCraft]

I thought she meant regular butter too.

I tried a mostly coconut with cocoa butter bar after carebear talked about it in another thread. It was so much easier to work with just a couple oils rather than the four that are in my usual recipe. But...I had a horrible time cutting it. It was very crumbly. Do I just need to cut sooner? It hadn't even been 12 hours. I did use a water discount because the FO was one I've used many times. Should I use full water instead?

 

[carebear]

I use full water because it's important that the soap gel. If soaps that high in hard oils don't gel the ash can be up to half an inch thick!!! In MY experience!

Mine don't crumble, but they do get super rock hard if it's 75-100% coconut oil. I tend to cut as soon as it reaches room temp which can take 12 hours since I gel in a cooler. I've waited 24 hours and that was too long for my Tank.

 

[PrairieCraft]

Ah hah! Thank you so much for the advice. I've been reluctant to try again and risk wasting more oils. I did get a partial gel on that batch which seemed so strange since I did insulate and it seemed to get really hot. It was really ugly soap.

On a happier note, I ordered a tank!! Here's how I did it...I was too busy to soap all December so last week I made like a half dozen batches in one day. Totally went nuts. Then I said "honey, I can't cut these as well as you can will you cut them for me." After about a half hour and some frustration at uneven cuts I told DH "you know you can get this thing thats cuts the soap perfectly in one go." And he snapped back "well, why haven't you bought it". SOLD I thought he would flip at the cost but he said for as long as it takes to cut one loaf and to still not be happy with the cuts makes the tank worth it.

 

[AmyW]

LOL Awesome!

 

[judymoody]

Check this out: http://www.zensoaps.com/singleoil.htm

There are some 100% butter (not cow) only soaps there.

Cow butter is supposed to be majorly nasty in soap.

 

[SudsyKat]

Thanks, Judymoody - I've seen that page before and had forgotten about it. good information on there!

And thanks to all for the input. I will experiment and see what works!

 

[Zhuliya]

Cow butter is supposed to be majorly nasty in soap.

I disagree. I make lovely cow butter soaps!! You can find a very nice recipe here. Cow butter makes gentle, hard and bubbly soap. It's true, it can get smelly, but here are some tips to avoid this problem, and once you learn how to do it butter could become your favourite ingredient!!

The only important things are:
1. always use a little lemon or eucalyptus EOs to help with the smell;
2. use preferably HP or CP it and then rebatch after 2-3 days with EOs;
3. never use more than 20% of cows butter, preferably combined with OO and some precius oils like almond or sunflower, otherwise you'll end up with a cheese smelling soap;
3. let it cure for at least 8 weeks... and you'll have a nice, hard and nice-smelling bar with a creamy lather and a wonderful consistency!

 

[Woodi]

Well sudsyKat....I always believe that the best thing to do is GO FOR IT!...make several batches of single oil, or double-oil (I like fluffy lather so always add either coconut or palm kernel)....and test them yourself.

I don't believe the Zensoap ravings about moisturizing, esp when they say that an all cocoa butter or coconut, or all palm kernel oil soap is kind to my skin. I find some of the harder oils really dry my skin out. I use at least 30% olive in most of my soap recipes for the moisturizing....but that's just me!

Each of us has our own skin, and preferences. Best way to find out what yours are is...

 

[SudsyKat]

Thanks, Woodi. I am still working out my tastes in terms of recipes. I've done many different recipes and I think I'm leaning towards a nice, balanced blend of oils with just a little shea or cocoa. I knew that coconut could be drying, of course, but had not thought about shea or cocoa butter being drying as well. Hmmm..... will have to make more soap!

 

[carebear]

any soap can be drying. it's what soap does. it's all about balancing the cosmetic attributes like lather, and of course the lye discount/superfat.

 

[soapbuddy]

Butter made in different countries might have different composition(s), but here in the US, the butter has butyric fatty acid which breaks down to smell like rotten milk or womit.

 

[carebear]

Yes, the butter here is actually fermented a bit - go figure!
(or more accurately, the cream is fermented before it's butter-fied)

 

[SudsyKat]

Thanks to all for your input - I fear I didn't communicate well in my original post - I meant butters (as in cocoa butter, shea butter, etc), not cow's milk butter. Anyhow, I appreciate all the good input!

 

[carebear]

Thanks to all for your input - I fear I didn't communicate well in my original post - I meant butters (as in cocoa butter, shea butter, etc), not cow's milk butter. Anyhow, I appreciate all the good input!

yea, we figured that out about half way through the thread, but then someone said they do soap with cow's butter so the convo took a turn.

 

[GardenGirl]

I use full water because it's important that the soap gel. If soaps that high in hard oils don't gel the ash can be up to half an inch thick!!! In MY experience!

carebear, you ain't lying!

I did your recommended bar and used about a 40% lye concentration and basically room temp. It heated up like crazy and humped up in the mold (only 1 lb batch) but it's like it didn't *really* gel . . . it was weird. Anyway, holy heck! I gotta shovel my way into the soap room to get through the ash from those bars. But - Yowza! Niiiice soap.

Gonna try with more h2o next time. And warmer temps. I want these bars to work out. I'm sold.

I heart carebear.