Handling bulk Palm Oil

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NittyGritty

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My understanding of palm oil is that, before pouring out the few ounces you need for a recipe, you need to ensure that the entire bottle is melted and mixed, right? I have a 5 lb container of it that I've been placing in warm water for a few minutes to melt it all, then shaking it, then pouring off the necessary ounces for the batch. But, what if I want to go to a bigger (cheaper) quantity? How do I melt and shake a 50 lb pail, for example?

Thanks!
 

Candybee

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You may be thinking of pko - palm kernal oil. It can come in solid and flake form. I believe the flake form has to be mixed before use. Not so the with the solid. PKO should not be confused with palm oil. They are two entirely different oils with different soaping characteristics.

Re palm oil - no need to melt it down to stir/blend it. It is ready to go. I only melt it down in a tub of warm water if I need to transfer it to another container.
 

pamielynn

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Unless you are buying "no stir" palm oil, it should be melted and stirred. I still work with 7lb containers myself because I haven't found a good way to melt and stir a larger container - except to purchase and oil warmer and put a spigot on the drum.

PKO, in flake form does NOT need to be melted/stirred, but regular palm oil DOES require a good stirring, fairly frequently, in order to keep the stearic acid properly blended. I didn't know this when I started out and I would end up with inconsistent results. Started melting and stirring and now I have no issues with palm.
 

soap_rat

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It is a PAIN IN THE BUTT. I may start using smaller jugs to avoid it.

If it's truly roasting outside, keeping it in a car in the sun an entire day may do it, but I've only got a partial melt that way (and even with coconut oil which has a lower melting point). (I found a pail of coconut oil, which admittedly I'd used up very slowly, also had serious separation of stearic acid and I had had some inconsistent soaping results so I decided to treat the coconut the same way)

I have made a giant double boiler by putting a big speckled canning pot on the stove, putting in a couple blocks of wood, heaving the massive pail into the pot, filling the canning pot with water, and heating away. It takes a looong time so combining it with the car thing may help. It will also seem all melted when there's still a core of unmelted stuff.

In future I may try filling every big pot with part of the pail, melting it all then pouring it back into the big pail to mix it, then doling it back out into containers. But then I will have a million pots to wash :(

Also, a friend gave me what she called a birdbath heater when it's actually a stock-tank heater, and I wondered if that could handle immersion into oil! If so, that should do well, I think! (never used one before for anything but I'm sure I should keep it from touching the plastic bucket)
 

Candybee

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Now this is interesting. I buy my palm oil at SMR and never stirred it and never had any inconsistency problems. I also buy my palm oil at ED. Because the ED oil comes in a jug I heat it to pour into another container tending to stir it. So perhaps the SMR is a no stir? palm. I wouldn't know because it does not mention the need to stir on the website. Same with ED. I have only read that its the PKO flakes that need to be stirred. Where are you buying your palm that it needs to be stirred?
 

Meganmischke

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Here is what I do: when I first get my palm I melt it all down, then I separate it into manageable quantities and freeze or store for future use. When I need it I will melt it down stir and use. If I always used the same recipe I would weight the amount. Palm really does need to be melted and stirred. Small quantities may not be quite as bad as just scooping out of a 50lb bucket. I believe it is either stearic acid or stearins that will solidify first then sink to the bottom. Palm kernal does not need to be melted and stirred to my knowledge.
 

pamielynn

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Now this is interesting. I buy my palm oil at SMR and never stirred it and never had any inconsistency problems. I also buy my palm oil at ED. Because the ED oil comes in a jug I heat it to pour into another container tending to stir it. So perhaps the SMR is a no stir? palm. I wouldn't know because it does not mention the need to stir on the website. Same with ED. I have only read that its the PKO flakes that need to be stirred. Where are you buying your palm that it needs to be stirred?
PKO is hydrogenated and doesn't need to be stirred. All palm oil, unless it is marked "no stir" should be stirred to evenly blend the stearic acid. But, if you're not having problems with yours then don't worry about it :)

I buy about 90% of all my oils through Columbus Foods.
 

soap_rat

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Candybee, I didn't know about stearic separation until my SECOND bulk pail of palm oil. I think we got lucky with the first pail unless we just failed to notice differences because we had just started soaping. With the second I could tell something weird was happening the first time I went to scoop so I called the company. "Yes, all palm oil will separate, that's why you have to melt it each time, unless you buy the no-stir."
 

shunt2011

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I use the no stir Palm from Soapers Choice and does it make life easier. I hated melting the 7 lb bottles and then repacking them to avoid the stearic issues. I also use PKO (flakes) and you do not need to pre melt them all before use. You just measure out what you need and melt with the rest of your oils. I masterbatch my oils and have no probelms whatsoever.
 

Candybee

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Thanks for all the tips on the palm and PKO. Since I have been buying the large jugs lately I have been melting them down in a warm bath to transfer the palm oil into a bucket for easy use. Maybe thats why I haven't noticed any problems with it because it ends up getting well stirred. Funny the wrong stuff you can pick up on the internet. The info about stirring PKO was from another soaping forum!! That plus more than one person was passing that on.
 

pamielynn

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Thanks for all the tips on the palm and PKO. Since I have been buying the large jugs lately I have been melting them down in a warm bath to transfer the palm oil into a bucket for easy use. Maybe thats why I haven't noticed any problems with it because it ends up getting well stirred. Funny the wrong stuff you can pick up on the internet. The info about stirring PKO was from another soaping forum!! That plus more than one person was passing that on.
Especially in the soaping world!

If you use the liquid PKO, you probably would have to melt it to get it out of the bottle, but the flakes are so much easier to measure, IMO.

I'm just waiting on the day when I can have one of these:

http://www.soapequipment.com/Tanks/13GallonOilTank.htm
 

Soapsense

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I melt the pail of oil and stir every five minutes until it's too solid to stir anymore. I dont' melt again. So far this has worked for me. But then I may just be getting lucky.
 

sprklngsaphire

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I am so glad you asked this question. I currently have a 50 pound bucket from soapers choice that my husband just got for me.and after researching I realized that I have to do the melt and stir thing too. What I plan to do is stir it up well and portion it all of it out into one gallon containers. I am not trying to high Jack your thread at all, but I am wondering if this would work? And if so perhaps you could use this technique too?
What's terrible is I am brand new to soap making so I have no idea how I am supposed to use up all this palm oil before it goes bad. My husband ordered my oils for me when I talked about making our own soap but he never stopped to ask exactly how much I needed lol. I don't have the heart to tell him it was way way to much. Hahaha. He was being sweet by getting the things I needed,so I have just kept silent and wondering to myself quietly as I stare/glare at this gargantuan tub like ummm what am I supposed to do with this???? Lol. And just today he asked when I was gonna open up my big bucket of Palm oil!! Lol:lol:
 

cmzaha

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I buy my palm in 5 gallon pails and really do not stress it. If it is partially melted due to hot weather I stir it it well. When the weather cools and it starts to solidify I just stir it periodically while it re-solidifies.
 

soap_rat

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sprklingsaphire, I would try to store the palm in the coolest location you can, and I would also buy some rosemary oleoresin extract (ROE) or some mixed tocopherols--vitamin E-- and add some to the melted palm. Maybe to just half of it if the price on the stuff seems too steep, and use the untreated palm first. Both of those are antioxidants and prolong the shelf life.

Here is a snippet I have saved for the tocopherols, I'm not sure on the oleoresin rate but I think it's less:
from nature with love says: "To extend the shelf life of your vegetable oils, we recommend the addition of an anti-oxidant. Mixed tocopherols such as our T-50 and T-80 Vitamin E oils help protect vegetable oils and oil-based formulations from rancidity. T-50 and T-80 Vitamin E oils can be used at a rate of 0.04%-1.0% to help protect your oils."
 

maxine289

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I've considered purchasing 5 gallon pails of oil but wondered how I was going to melt them. I found some drum warmers on Amazon but I'm not at the stage yet where the expenditure makes sense.
 

Lin19687

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SPAM !!! Seriously do people have nothing better to do ??
this is his website posting he is linking to

reported
 
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