Bubbles vs. Lather

[DWinMadison]

Did you ever have one of those giant bubble wands when you were a kid? Often when I use my soap...and it really is good soap, I get really large bubbles that form...like between my arm and stomach. What causes those types of bubbles versus more lather/suds?

My typical recipe includes coconut, palm, lard, olive making up about 80%, 10%-ish castor and the final 10%-ish avocado, safflower, sunflower or grapeseed.

 

[lenarenee]

Just guessing, but I suspect a big factor is friction and agitation from rubbing/turning soap in your hands or on a washcloth is what makes lather. The big bubbles from using wands are usually made with gentle motion in one direction.

 

[DWinMadison]

Just guessing, but I suspect a big factor is friction and agitation from rubbing/turning soap in your hands or on a washcloth is what makes lather. The big bubbles from using wands are usually made with gentle motion in one direction.

Maybe, but I'm guessing it's an oil selection. Commercial soaps don't make bubbles like these in my experience.

 

[lenarenee]

Commercial soaps with detergents in them?

The bubble solution for making bubbles is detergent, often with glycerin. We've made our own version from dish detergent, with added glycerin - and get both types of bubbles.

 

[DWinMadison]

Commercial soaps with detergents in them?

Surely. My point is that I want more lather and less bubbles.

 

[Clarice]

I am with you DW. I like lots of tiny dense bubbles (is lather a collection of bubbles? Lol).

I think of it as creamy and silky lather with a dense structure.

Makes me Wonder if I need to focus more on “creamy” versus “bubbles” in the calculator.

 

[lenarenee]

Lard certainly makes a rich voluminous lather of teeny tiny bubbles; as in leaning more toward a shaving cream type lather. Many say that tallow gives them a creamy lather, however to me it's a milky, coating lather, not creamy.

I don't know how much co you use, but lowering that will reduce the large bubbles. But the way you wash makes a difference too. Many SMF'ers have stated they use mesh puffs to create more denseness, bubbles, or lather.

 

[Cellador]

I also think your coconut oil contributes to the large bubbles. For a denser, creamier lather, you could try more lard or palm in your recipe, adding a milk, or adding a clay. Increasing your cure time can also make a big difference in lather.

 

[DWinMadison]

Thanks everyone for the input. I’ll try all of the above. Ive decided I’m not such a fan of goat’s milk but have been eyeing coconut milk as an additive over and above my 50/50 lye water.

 

[Hendejm]

I would suggest a butter or butter blend they really add to creaminess in soap and may reduce large bubbles

 

[Steve85569]

If you are wanting more lather in your recipe look for "creamy" numbers from the fatty acid profile rather than "bubbly" numbers. Creamy is the sum of Palmetic, Stearic and Ricinoleic acids while Bubbly is the sum of Lauric, Myristic and Ricinoleic acids.

Choose your oils wisely.

 

[Micchi]

I would hazard a guess that it's the castor oil. I'm currently experimenting with a castor oil-free recipe (I have a potential customer who is allergic, and it would be a pretty hefty custom order, so experimentation is WORTH it), and I've noticed that the lather is much more creamy and much less bubbly without it.

At 10% castor, I've gotten the big bubbles you describe. At 5% castor (adding 5% more of a soft oil, like sweet almond oil, instead), I get nice bubbles, a few larger bubbles, but not the mega bubbles.

 

[KiwiMoose]

I've just started testing my soaps i made in February in which I used at avocado oil at 10% for the first time - much of everything else was the same in my base recipe - and WOWSA! That's some creamy, silky soap! Me likey!

 

[lsg]

Castor oil is supposed to produce big bubbles. If you used 10%, then it might be the Castor oil. Try using more lard, which produces creamy lather.

 

[shunt2011]

Thanks everyone for the input. I’ll try all of the above. Ive decided I’m not such a fan of goat’s milk but have been eyeing coconut milk as an additive over and above my 50/50 lye water.

I use coconut milk in the majority of my recipes. It does help with a creaminess to the lather in my opinion. My soap gives a thick creamy lather with smaller bubbles. I use about 40% lard with a bit of shea too. I'm not fond of cocoa butter in soap. and of course castor.

 

[MadTeddyBear]

You could also try aloe vera juice along with some of the other suggestions to changing oils. I'm not sure how it compares to coconut milk (but I think I'll have to try it!). It seemed to help increase size, quantity, and creaminess each by a little bit and makes very a good creamy lather.

 

[Lin19687]

Lower CO and Castor, add a butter as that lowers bubbly

 

[Susie]

I use 5% castor oil, 65% lard, 10% coconut oil, and about 2% aloe vera juice to get my perfect idea of rich, creamy lather that has enough bubbles to satisfy the bubble-holic in me. I stopped using dual lye, but am about to return to it, as it just gave the lather that extra bit of happiness. You can also try a little tallow in your soap (sub in for the "other" oil that I didn't mention previously) if you find that this is not meeting your expectations. I stay strictly away from butters as I find that even 10% cuts my lather/bubble ratio.

 

[Clarice]

@Susie

would you describe yourself as a bubble-aholic or a creamy lather-aholic - or both?

I am still trying to get a grip on how to describe what I am looking for, as well as understanding what others mean!

Thank you!

 

[KiwiMoose]

I use coconut milk in the majority of my recipes. It does help with a creaminess to the lather in my opinion. My soap gives a thick creamy lather with smaller bubbles. I use about 40% lard with a bit of shea too. I'm not fond of cocoa butter in soap. and of course castor.

Yes i have to admit that my coconut milk soap was very creamy too - but as I used a whopping 15% avocado oil in that batch, I don't know whether it's the ago or the milk...