Basic trinity of oils starter formula

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Zany_in_CO

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A balanced bar starts with the Basic Trinity of Soapmaking Oils:

BASIC TRINITY OF OILS STARTER FORMULA

Olive Oil 35% ~ for emollience, conditioning
Coconut 25% (or PKO* or Babassu) ~ for hardness, lather
Palm or Lard 40% (or GV* Shortening from Walmart) ~ for bulk

*PKO = Palm Kernel Oil (flakes)
*GV = Good Value

After getting the feel on trace times, bar hardness, lather, etc., start tweaking, to build other elements into the bar… TAKE NOTES each time you tweak the formula.

TWEAK 1
Olive 30%
Coconut or PKO 22%
Palm, Lard or Shortening 40%
Shea Butter 5%
~ for luxury and moisturization
Castor Oil 3% ~ humectant and lather booster

TWEAK 2 (to reduce cost of Olive oil)
Olive 20%
Rice Bran 10%
(or Sunflower, Safflower, Almond, Avocado, etc)
Coconut or PKO 22%
Palm, Lard or Shortening 40%
Shea Butter 5%
(or Cocoa Butter, Mango Butter, etc.)
Castor Oil 3%

NOTE: Shea Butter and other “luxury” oils & butters ... at 5% you WILL notice the difference in the bar, it keeps the cost per bar still within a reasonable profit margin for resale, and gives you a GREAT ‘adjustable’ formula to tailor to your own formula creations.

Just be sure to run any and all changes through a lye calculator.
 

LilyJo

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Any ideas for a basic recipe without palm or lard?

Have stopped making soap for a while with frustration at not having a recipe that consistently works, isnt drying and doesnt use palm or lard - I have a few recipes but tbh whilst they are all good soaps, they are not amazing!
 

earlene

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Any ideas for a basic recipe without palm or lard?

Have stopped making soap for a while with frustration at not having a recipe that consistently works, isnt drying and doesnt use palm or lard - I have a few recipes but tbh whilst they are all good soaps, they are not amazing!
Check out the link atiz posted above for other palm-free vegan recipes. Also there are numerous palm-free & animal-free recipes around the web if you do a search. That's where I started when I was new. It's okay to tweak any recipe you find here or online, as long as you run all changes through a lye calculator to get the correct amount of lye for your recipes.

Here are a few links to palm-free recipes:
http://www.soaprecipes101.com/homemade-soap-recipes/palm-free-soap-recipes/
https://www.lovinsoap.com/2012/06/palm-free-recipes-day-1/
https://www.millersoap.com/soapallveg.html
https://www.modernsoapmaking.com/tutorial-vegan-milk-and-honey-soap/ (all vegan recipe)
https://thenerdyfarmwife.com/how-to-make-any-soap-recipe-palm-free/ (how to alter a palm recipe to be palm-free)
https://www.soapqueen.com/tag/palm-free/ (palm oil alternatives - not actual recipes)
 

IrishLass

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Any ideas for a basic recipe without palm or lard?

Have stopped making soap for a while with frustration at not having a recipe that consistently works, isnt drying and doesnt use palm or lard - I have a few recipes but tbh whilst they are all good soaps, they are not amazing!
While fiddling around on SoapCalc one day a few years ago, I was able to come up with a unique combination of specific veggie butters and oils whose combined fatty acid profile was so close to palm oil's fatty acid profile that it could in theory be used as a substitute:

Shea butter 45.5% / Cocoa Butter 43% / Sunflower Oil 10% / Coconut Oil 1.5%

So, let's say you wanted to make 2 lbs of the Basic Trinity soap that Zany listed at the very top of her list, but would like to substitute the unique butter/oil combo for the palm:

First, type the Basic Trinity recipe into SoapCalc and set the oil weight box for 2 lbs. Hit calculate and then view print. Your oil amounts should look like this on page 2:

Olive oil................... 11.20 oz/317.51 g
Coconut Oil............. 8 oz/226.8 g
Palm oil................... 12.8 oz/362.87 g

Copy those amounts down somewhere.

Next, hit the reset/clear button on the first page and change the oil weight box to 12.8 oz or 362.87 g (the palm oil amount), then go to the 'recipe oil list' part of the page, click on the % circle, then type in these oils and %'s:

Shea butter 45.5%
Cocoa Butter 43%
Sunflower Oil 10%
Coconut Oil 1.5%

Hit calculate and view/print recipe. On page 2 it should give you these amounts:

5.82 oz/165.11 g Shea Butter
5.50 oz/156.04 g Cocoa butter
1.28 oz/36.29 g Sunflower oil
.19 oz/5.44 g Coconut oil

That's how much of each butter/oil to use for the combo to be able to sub for the palm amount.

Now, go back to page 1 and click on the oz or gram circle above the 'recipe oil list' section, and then click on olive oil and add in the
11.20 oz or 317.51 g amount for olive oil to the list, and then add 8 0z or 226.8 grams to the .19 oz/5.44 g coconut oil amount that's already there as part of the palm substitute.

This is what things should look like:

upload_2019-4-30_15-23-5.png




And below is what the recipe looks like with palm instead: Look at the fatty acid profiles and compare to the one above without palm. Yes- the individual palm and stearic numbers do not match up, but these two fatty acids act so similar to each other that they are virtually the same in my book where soap is concerned. Their combined total is 28 in the palm sub recipe and 29 in the palm recipe......only 1 point difference from each other, which is way too little to make any discernible difference in the finished soap.

upload_2019-4-30_15-25-48.png





IrishLass :)
 

Zany_in_CO

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Irish Lass wrote: And below is what the recipe looks like with palm instead:
Excellent analysis and information, as always, Irish! :thumbs:
Too bad it's getting buried in this thread. :(
I don't mean to sound nasty. Not at all; I'm just sayin'...o_O
 

LilyJo

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While fiddling around on SoapCalc one day a few years ago, I was able to come up with a unique combination of specific veggie butters and oils whose combined fatty acid profile was so close to palm oil's fatty acid profile that it could in theory be used as a substitute:

Shea butter 45.5% / Cocoa Butter 43% / Sunflower Oil 10% / Coconut Oil 1.5%

So, let's say you wanted to make 2 lbs of the Basic Trinity soap that Zany listed at the very top of her list, but would like to substitute the unique butter/oil combo for the palm:

First, type the Basic Trinity recipe into SoapCalc and set the oil weight box for 2 lbs. Hit calculate and then view print. Your oil amounts should look like this on page 2:

Olive oil................... 11.20 oz/317.51 g
Coconut Oil............. 8 oz/226.8 g
Palm oil................... 12.8 oz/362.87 g

Copy those amounts down somewhere.

Next, hit the reset/clear button on the first page and change the oil weight box to 12.8 oz or 362.87 g (the palm oil amount), then go to the 'recipe oil list' part of the page, click on the % circle, then type in these oils and %'s:

Shea butter 45.5%
Cocoa Butter 43%
Sunflower Oil 10%
Coconut Oil 1.5%

Hit calculate and view/print recipe. On page 2 it should give you these amounts:

5.82 oz/165.11 g Shea Butter
5.50 oz/156.04 g Cocoa butter
1.28 oz/36.29 g Sunflower oil
.19 oz/5.44 g Coconut oil

That's how much of each butter/oil to use for the combo to be able to sub for the palm amount.

Now, go back to page 1 and click on the oz or gram circle above the 'recipe oil list' section, and then click on olive oil and add in the
11.20 oz or 317.51 g amount for olive oil to the list, and then add 8 0z or 226.8 grams to the .19 oz/5.44 g coconut oil amount that's already there as part of the palm substitute.

This is what things should look like:

View attachment 38734



And below is what the recipe looks like with palm instead: Look at the fatty acid profiles and compare to the one above without palm. Yes- the individual palm and stearic numbers do not match up, but these two fatty acids act so similar to each other that they are virtually the same in my book where soap is concerned. Their combined total is 28 in the palm sub recipe and 29 in the palm recipe......only 1 point difference from each other, which is way too little to make any discernible difference in the finished soap.

View attachment 38735




IrishLass :)


I think I love you!!! Thank you so much for a fabulous post, so much really useful info, have always wondered what a combined sub would do.

Thats my bank holiday soap making planned out!
 

Zany_in_CO

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While fiddling around on SoapCalc one day a few years ago, I was able to come up with a unique combination of specific veggie butters and oils whose combined fatty acid profile was so close to palm oil's fatty acid profile that it could in theory be used as a substitute:

Shea butter 45.5% / Cocoa Butter 43% / Sunflower Oil 10% / Coconut Oil 1.5%
:rolling: I'm getting ready to make the Basic Trinity but I'm out of palm. 😱 Came on here to see if anyone had tried it with a palm sub. I'm so happy to see this! Thank you for all your hard work, @IrishLass . You just made my day!
Love:Girl.gif
 

Corsara

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What would be a basic trinity tweak that would add a significant amount of tallow to the recipe? (I hope this thread isn't too old to resurrect 😬)
 

Johnez

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Hey @Zany_in_CO , I have have all the ingredients and can't wait to try the first recipe. My question is I found some HO canola oil and am wondering if I can incorporate Canola oil in place of OO for a tweak in the future.

At, scratch that apparently I did the calculation wrong and the canola is mid-oleic. Dope! Another lesson learned.
 
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Zany_in_CO

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Hey @Zany_in_CO , I have have all the ingredients and can't wait to try the first recipe. My question is I found some HO canola oil and am wondering if I can incorporate Canola oil in place of OO for a tweak in the future.
Actually that's what the Basic Trinity is all about. Once you get a feel for the 3 legs as is, you can sub any liquid vegie oil of your choice for OO; any hard, lathering oil for the Coconut (limited choices are PKO or Babassu); any solid-at-room-temp oil/fat for the palm (lard, tallow, shortening, Crisco, Soybean, shea butter, etc.)

I will say this though, the Basic recipe, using the Default Settings on SoapCalc, is one of the nicest bars you are likely to experience. It reminds me of triple-milled French soaps with an elegant feel. Hard to beat, IMO. :D
 

Johnez

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Actually that's what the Basic Trinity is all about. Once you get a feel for the 3 legs as is, you can sub any liquid vegie oil of your choice for OO; any hard, lathering oil for the Coconut (limited choices are PKO or Babassu); any solid-at-room-temp oil/fat for the palm (lard, tallow, shortening, Crisco, Soybean, shea butter, etc.)

I will say this though, the Basic recipe, using the Default Settings on SoapCalc, is one of the nicest bars you are likely to experience. It reminds me of triple-milled French soaps with an elegant feel. Hard to beat, IMO. :D
Aw man this sounds good Zany, I don't know if I can wait till the weekend....I might even do this on a work night haha!

I will bug you one more time about this recipe to ask you if A) there needs to be any special consideration if I HP this recipe, and B) should I keep water as a percent of oils at 38% (default in soapcalc)? I will try to convert myself to the seemingly more standard lye concentration or water:lye ratio since I've read that's the better way to view recipes.
 

Zany_in_CO

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A) there needs to be any special consideration if I HP this recipe, and
B) should I keep water as a percent of oils at 38% (default in soapcalc)?
A & B For HP, water as a percent of oils at 38% is so-called "full water". To my mind at least, HP needs this because of the amount of water loss during the cook. But I'm not the best person to ask. I prefer CP. It's easier with less fiddling. I like the smooth pour and the finished look I get vs the "rustic" look of HP, plus there's the "plop and glop" aspect of the pour that challenges me. :rolleyes:
I will try to convert myself to the seemingly more standard lye concentration or water:lye ratio since I've read that's the better way to view recipes.
Good thinking. It's best to decide for yourself and have a reason to convert.
Using "Lye concentration" is popular on SMF. 30-33% is common. If you haven't already been advised to switch, it's bound to happen sooner or later. The idea of "discounting water" came along mid-career for me. To be honest, there are few soaps that are better with it. I have only one formula where I use 32% lye concentration.
"Water:lye ratio" comes in handy for making Liquid Soap. 3:1 ratio is ideal in most cases. You type it in. I also use it for making ZNSC.
Other than that, I'm currently using 38% water as a oercebt if oils and 0% SF (to fully saponify all the oils) and liking it.

The other consideration in HP is SF (% of super fat aka "lye discount"). That's a matter of preference but HP'ers generally add SF oil and fragrance at the end:thumbs: (when the batch is fully saponified) to spare them from going through the lye process.
 
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