Sticky soap when washing off . Looking for help with recipe .

[Zany_in_CO]

Im adding Kaolin Clay 1tsp and sea salt 1tsp 1300 g batch

At this stage, it's highly advised to make several 500g batches until you get your basic recipe "perfected".

You have been given options that need testing before you size up to 1300 grams.
One option is no clay then with clay.
Another option is no salt then with salt.
Another option is playing with stearic & palmitic FAs to find the right balance. Testing, testing, testing...

Pine tar soap is a topic for another thread. Once you've perfected your recipe, you can share the printout in the Recipe Feedback forum and ask for input about adding Pine Tar.

Patience, grasshopper.

 

[Mike E]

At this stage, it's highly advised to make several 500g batches until you get your basic recipe "perfected".

You have been given options that need testing before you size up to 1300 grams.
One option is no clay then with clay.
Another option is no salt then with salt.
Another option is playing with stearic & palmitic FAs to find the right balance. Testing, testing, testing...

Pine tar soap is a topic for another thread. Once you've perfected your recipe, you can share the printout in the Recipe Feedback forum and ask for input about adding Pine Tar.

Patience, grasshopper.

Okay sounds good . I appreciate all the help !

 

[Arimara]

I’m looking to have a faster curing soap . I want to wait a month or 6 weeks . My formula seems alright to you?

You might want to test this recipe as you have it with a 3 month cure. it might be that type of recipe. Since you say the soap it a little sticky, it could more than likely be the shea butter and the palm oil (they're both high in palmitic fatty acids and both can be sticky in feel, in my opinion). Maybe slightly decrease the palm oil and allocate it to the olive oil as an experiment? I'd honestly keep keep a few bars of this batch and test variations of this recipe to see what you like best.

 

[lucycat]

I would have to respectfully disagree. My experience is that lye discount is the older term, and SF is the more commonly used term by soapers today. All of the soap calculators that I've seen use the term "super fat" - and none of them use "lye discount."

My old books (Ann Bramson, 1975 and Susan Cavitch, 1995) use the term superfatted soap to refer to the addition after trace of oils that they thought would still be left in the soap and not saponified; ie too much oil for the amount of lye. Lye discount was not a term used at that time because lye was caluculated based on the oils to be mixed with lye/water before trace, not the superfatted oils added after trace.

Lye discount is the best description of what we do today; ie too little lye for the oil size of the recipe. Interchanging the terms may be current practice but it doesn't explain or make clear that we are doing is changing the lye calculation for 100% saponification to 93%/95% or 97% saponification.

When I started soaping I was taught to do my own lye calculations and I still keep current saponfication values for the oils I use in a spreadsheet for calculation. I use soap calc rarely and didn't realize it was using the term superfat.

 

[AliOop]

@lucycat I appreciate what you shared. It's impressive that you do your own lye calculations.

However, unlike you, the vast majority of modern soapers use soap calculators. I would venture to say that most folks who started soaping in the last five+ years have NEVER done a single lye calculation by hand. They all use lye calculators, and in fact, are encouraged to do that, rather than risk making a math error by manually calculating their lye.

None of the English language lye calculators use "lye discount" - they all use "super fat." Take a look at any popular YT channel that teaches soaping, or explains lye calculators - all that I have seen refer to super-fat. Maybe it is different for calculators or YouTubers in other languages? But in English-speaking countries, if you insist on talking about lye discounts, then you have to explain that it is called something else in the lye calculator and by most every other soaping instructor out there.

Bottom line, although "lye discount" may be a more accurate way to explain what we are doing, it is the far less common term, at least in the US and many other English-speaking countries. You would be fighting an uphill battle to get everyone to change their ways.

I have a similar pet peeve with the suggested cleansing range on soap calculators. It is ridiculous to suggest that low end of the recommended cleansing number is 12. That is at the higher end of the cleansing range for many, many soapers. When they were modifying SoapMakingFriend, I strongly encouraged them to set the low end of the recommended cleansing range at zero, since a zero-cleansing soap will still clean, and in fact, is recommended for many with skin sensitivities. But alas, my plea fell on deaf ears. It's hard to buck the system!

 

[Zany_in_CO]

Lye discount is the best description of what we do today; ie too little lye for the oil size of the recipe. Interchanging the terms may be current practice but it doesn't explain or make clear that we are doing is changing the lye calculation for 100% saponification to 93%/95% or 97% saponification.

I agree.

When I made my first soap in 2003 I also calculated the lye amount with pen & pencil. Once I joined a forum in 2004 I learned to use a calculator. At that time, it was called "SOOZ" and later became SoapCalc which I've been using for almost 20 years.

Also at that time, "lye discount" was used to describe what we now commonly refer to as "superfat". Back then, we used 0% lye discount and added 5% (more or less) of a superfatting ingredient at trace. Either way, the result is the same.

Source: @DeeAnna 's Soapy Stuff ~ Superfat

Your description of "lye discount" is the best explanation for those who want to understand the term "superfat". It's good to know both terms. Well done.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

It is ridiculous to suggest that low end of the recommended cleansing number is 12.

I hear your frustration!

It's good to keep in mind that "the system" is comprised of values intended for a "best case scenario" and included as "recommendations", i.e., not written in stone, so to speak. Whatever calculator you use, it's best to consider the recommendations as guidelines for whatever formula you're trying to create.

There will always be exceptions to the recommended values. That you learn through experience.

HAPPY SOAPING!

 

[Mike E]

Your recipe has a fairly high percentage of palmitic versus stearic, which some think makes a bar a bit waxy feeling. I have testers that love that profile, but most seem to prefer a bar that has a better balance between the two. Is the shea unrefined? If so, the unsaponifiable fraction in the shea, which is ignored by the calculators, could be contributing to the sticky feeling. When I had sticky soaps in the past, a long cure (3 months or more) made a big difference in hand feel and overall performance.

How would I change that ?

 

[Mike E]

Whats everyone thoughts on

30 % olive oil
30% coconut oil
30 % palm oil
10 % shea butter

5 percent super fat

If you super fat your soap . Is it less drying ?

 

[Mobjack Bay]

How would I change that ?

See post #39

 

[penelopejane]

Whats everyone thoughts on

30 % olive oil
30% coconut oil
30 % palm oil
10 % shea butter

5 percent super fat

If you super fat your soap . Is it less drying ?

Try it.
I use <2% superfat and 3.5% salt of the recipe water because that is the equivalent of sea water. I use 5% castor oil in all my soaps because it makes it bubbly.

No one is trying to hide a recipe from you but your skin will be different to mine so your “best” soap will be vastly different to my “best” soap.

 

[Mike E]

Try it.
I use <2% superfat and 3.5% salt of the recipe water because that is the equivalent of sea water. I use 5% castor oil in all my soaps because it makes it bubbly.

No one is trying to hide a recipe from you but your skin will be different to mine so your “best” soap will be vastly different to my “best” soap.

Okay sounds good . If a soap is drying . Do you higher your super fat . If you don’t mind me asking . Why do you use 2 % in all your soaps ?

 

[penelopejane]

Okay sounds good . If a soap is drying . Do you higher your super fat . If you don’t mind me asking . Why do you use 2 % in all your soaps ?

I use a lot less than 2% superfat in all my soaps to avoid slime and to save my bathroom pipes. I don’t make soaps that dry my skin. I do make 50% salt soaps but don’t use more than 10% coconut in any soap as I find it drying on the skin and coconut just causes the soap to dissolve quickly - much quicker than other ingredients.