Salt Bar question please....

[sygrid]

From what I have read here you want lye/water at room temp to keep the salt from dissolving. Does the high content of salt in the recipe affect the cure time? Less cure time would be a really good answer. I do make floating cp at room temp but cure time is a killer. I will admit to being spoiled by developing a 24 hour cured cp process and if any recipe doesnt' cure that fast I ditch it. Can you shed a little light on the cure time of the Salt Bars, I'd really like to try a batch. I suspect with the high salt content they will take a pattern beautifully in single molds. Having said that..... I'll summon all the patience I have for the cure. I just have to try this one after seeing Valors blue bars!

 

[artisan soaps]

I will admit to being spoiled by developing a 24 hour cured cp process and if any recipe doesnt' cure that fast I ditch it.

Can you please share how this is possible ?

I've only made one batch of salt bars and I always soap RTCP, but considering how hot these get during gell I really don't think your oil/lye temp will be an issue .. I also wouldn't be using them within 24hrs - correct me if I'm wrong, but saponification may not have even finished ?!

You may find this post helpful: http://soapmakingforum.com/forum/viewto ... t+bar+cure

And cure time for SB's was discussed here: http://soapmakingforum.com/forum/viewto ... t=salt+bar

 

[xraygrl]

I will admit to being spoiled by developing a 24 hour cured cp process and if any recipe doesnt' cure that fast I ditch it.

I've never heard of 24 hr curing for CP...even HP needs some drying time. Soap mellows as it ages, which is one of the reasons why soapers recommend a longer cure time for cp (the other is to evaporate out some of the water content). The soap may be hard enough to use in 24 hrs, but IMHO would still need some time to mellow. Even with CPOP, which IMHO is just forced gel, the soap still would need a full cure time....3 weeks at the least. I may be the oddball out there though.

Whenever I have used "fresh" just out of the mold CP, it always felt a bit harsh/drying to me...and this was just testing it out on my hands, but as the soap aged/cured it was fine. This has always been my experience with CP. I'm with artisan, I wouldn't be using 24 hr old cp either.

yes please share, I am curious.....

 

[Dixie]

HP salt bar IMHO can be used in a week, but they are much much better if you let them sit for 3 to 4 weeks.

CP salt bars IMHO need to sit up to 6-8 weeks. At least Mine do because they don't gel. They don't get hot enough....I use 80% or more salt. If you used less salt than I do I think it would gell a little and you could maybe use it with no problems in 4 weeks.

I think it has a lot to do with your recipe and your chosen process.

 

[valor]

Wow, I'm truly flattered that I have inspired you! I have to say...patience or none, you should DEFINITELY try them out. I am soooo in love and they are just getting better.

I wouldn't recommend it for others, but I used mine the next day and I didn't have any drying effects from it, but I am inured somewhat to drying out from lye. I will just now let my husband try them and there is no way that I would think about selling them. But for me and my own luxury, sure, I will use it as much as I can! They feel like silk.

The ones that I have put up to cure are still sweating a little. But I live right on the ocean, so I have a lot of humidity in the air, especially when it's hot inland and I hear that it has been a scorcher.

I really do recommend them, long or short cure time. They are fan-tab-u-lous!

 

[sygrid]

Quick cure Process

I had responded in detail and then got called away as I was writing and was 'timed out' . When I went to send it was lost. I will be back this afternoon and explain the process in detail.

Pilot error....didn't know that could happen. Sorry for the delay

Sygrid

 

[sygrid]

24 hr cure CP

Hi Everyone,

Just in case some of you might be thinking I'm a crazed, irresponsible soapmaker, I am a former SVP Marketing & R&D for a prestige cosmetic company with 25 yrs of cp soapmaking behind me. I currently and for 14 yrs I have owned a Heritage style soap factory and teach soapmaking classes 4 nights /wk.

Here is the Process:

(Deleted by admin. SMF management has determined this recipe/process to be hazardous.)

Thank you for your response to my salt soap recipe. I am going to make it now and I will send pics.
If you have any other questions I'm happy to help if I can.

Sygrid

 

[valor]

Wow, Sygrid, that really works, huh? I'll have to try it out. It sounds so simple!

Do you have pics in the photo gallery of any of your soap? I would love to see some.

I need to make some soap fast, but I have the usual cure time for the bars to harden. But your customers like them soft? Do you wrap them in plastic or anything, or do you sell them bare to continue the evaporation?

 

[andreja]

Are you taking about phenol red, that is used for measuring pH between 6.5 and 8.5? If so, isn't phenol red useless in soap making as pH homemade soap is between 8.5 and 9.5.

 

[Val]

Re: 24 hr cure CP

....... snipped for size........

Here is the Process:

You can use any of your regular recipes. Some work better than others.
Once you try this it is not likely you will ever HP again. You gain the benefit of HP i.e.: immediate neutralization, while retaining the appearance and texture of your best CP bars. What we are doing is maxing the temps quickly and forcing neutralization which happens at approx 175 degrees F.

WARNING!!! DO NOT EXCEED 140 DEGREES F. Your batch WILL VOLCANO!!
I HAVE READ IN THIS FORUM HP SOAPERS TALKING ABOUT THE VOLCANO PHASE OF HP SOAPMAKING.
A' VOLCANO' IS NOT PART OF THE HOT PROCESS - PROCESS....

....... snipped

Sygrid

I don't follow this here in bold. First you say we are maxing the temps quickly to force neutralization at 175 degrees F........ then you say DO NOT EXCEED 140 Degrees F or it will volcano.

So which is it?

If we are not to go above 140 then how can we force neutralization and use it so soon.... as you say we can.


Val

 

[Vinca Leaf]

I think what' she's saying is one or the other solution should not exceed 140, and then your batch will do it's exothermic thing, heating up to 175, and neutralizing.

 

[xraygrl]

I believe the soap will heat up to the 175 on its own from the chemical reaction between the lye and oils.

I am still not convinced. Doesn't soap usually reach that temp and higher on it's own during gel anyway? And for those that do CPOP, the gel is forced around that temp as well. I don't get what difference it would make that only one part is 140 degrees. Seems to me it would be a booger to work with in relation to siezures too. I think I'll stick to doing cp the regular way with a good cure time, and do hp when I can't wait.

 

[artisan soaps]

Hmm, I don't like messing about with thermometers or having to heat things up - I'm too lazy

It would also limit what additives and scents one could use, so I think I'll be sticking with RTCP ..

Thanks for explaining your soaping method though Sygrid :wink:

 

[ChrissyB]

Sygrid, I'm intrigued, do you discount your water?
If not, how do you account for water loss after the pour? Like in a normal cure I mean when some of that time is purely for the extra water to evaporate?

 

[soapbuddy]

It takes up to 24 hours for normal neutralization of lye in soap. The heat might speed up the process and even with a heavy water discount, this soap would not last in the shower for very long. Water still needs to evaporate to create a mild, long lasting bar.

I have done quite a few soap methods over the many years that I have been making soap. The fastest would be direct hot process, but I find the soap to be esthetically challenged. Ditto for crock pot soap. I have done CPOP on many occassions if I want to make sure that the soap gels.

I let the soap cure as long as possible. 4 to 6 weeks is my norm, no matter which process I choose. I have many repeat customers this way. It's hard to tell with tourists, since you might not ever see them again.

 

[mamaT]

Sygrid, let's see the pics of your salt bars.

 

[sygrid]

You're right..

Any cp soap will reach those temps on their own, but not as fast. This method shoots the temps within maybe 10 mins. Depending on the recipe the soap is completely ready for use by the next morning. The variable is water content for the most part. Some recipes especially CTCP need time to build lather as well but that also depends on ingredients. As far as the testing of the soap, I use the same chemical compounds that are an industry standard with the major cosmetic companies. ( I can guarantee you they do not lick the soap )

The soap is not a hard bar, it has a high water content & yes it does goes rather quickly in the shower. But who says you have to have a bar that will cut glass before it's ready? Density and degree of 'hardness' play no critical roll in a bar of soap other than to justify the price to a customer who can buy 10 bars of ivory for $2.00.
If that is not true then why does a bar have to last that long? My bars average between 10.00 - 35.00 for a 4 - 6 oz bar & I have a great deal of repeat business from my tourist clientele as well as local.

Everyone has their favorite method, this is mine.
All I wanted to do is share it.

Sygrid

ps: my salt soap bombed as I could not put it in the oven in the plastic molds I was using. I haven't thrown it out but I do not have great hopes for it. I suspect it will take as long as my whipped soap to be ready. I will try again.

S.

 

[sygrid]

first pics of salt bars

Here they are. The two white and both fuschia are salt bars.
I won't give up till I get it right...back to the scales

 

[Val]

:shock: Am I blind? I can not find a pic or a link!!!

LOL

Val

 

[NANCYB]

receipe?

Hi sygrid

Soap ready the next day, that's amazing.

I'm very intrigued, would you mind sharing your receipe?

Nancy