white blotches in honey beeswax soap

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apples

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Some oil/ honey pooled on top I hope will reabsorb before I cut. Soap in cupcake mold is sweating honey too. Partial gel and oily, OK, I can bear with that but what are those rough white blotches on the sides and bottom of the loaf??

honey beeswax fail.jpg
 

BattleGnome

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To me it looks like something didn't mix fully or it's soda ash. What kind of mold did you use?
 

apples

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It's just a 1lb mold made with cardboard and lined with wax paper. It was good for test batch (been using for a year) but the oil leaked much this time I had to throw it away.

Soda ash huh...I'll try to rub it off and see. BTW, I blotted the "sweats" off the small cupcake soap and got white dots in place...geez...I sure hope they are just soda ash.
 

penelopejane

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I have had this happen in soap I have added small amounts of honey to. I wasn't sure if it was unmixed honey or shea butter that hadn't been heated pretty well right before I mixed it with the other oils. So now I heat my honey a little and heat my shea butter really well then mix them into the oils well, right before I mix in the lye.

It doesn't happen now so one of those things was the cause.
 
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Susie

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I get those white spots on my honey soaps, also. Usually on the bottom. I have no idea what they are. But they are zapless, and usually disappear during cure for me.
 

Navaria

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When I moved in with bf, I found a jar of honey he had shoved in the back of a cabinet and forgot about. For years from the look of it. It was almost black, but the bottom was full of white/light tan crystals where the natural sugars had separated out. Just for grins I warmed the honey up and stirred and a lot of the crystals reabsorbed. I wonder if that's what is happening in the soap. Could the heat be causing the sugars to crystallize and then they reabsorbed as the soap cures?
 

DeeAnna

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Navaria -- The crystallization you describe is perfectly normal for pure honey, which is a highly-concentrated sugar solution. Honey in soap is diluted a lot with the water in the recipe. Diluted sugar solutions don't crystallize out because the sugar concentration is far too low. Also, warmth increases solubility of sugar (honey) in water, so that makes it even more unlikely that it's the honey crystallizing out during saponification.

I sometimes see droplets like this with high doses of fragrance, with soap that contains more fluids (watery additives, higher water recipe), and with soap that's gotten pretty warm during saponification. IMO, it's more a result of the extra fluids and warmth than it is the sugar (honey) specifically.

Be careful folks -- the droplets are lye heavy, so don't zap test or handle with bare hands. You're better off just letting the droplets evaporate or reabsorb. The white specks show up where the droplets were because the active lye in those spots is reacting with carbon dioxide in air to form sodium carbonate.

...I wonder if that's what is happening in the soap. Could the heat be causing the sugars to crystallize and then they reabsorbed as the soap cures?
 

Navaria

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Thank you DeeAnna. That makes a lot of sense. If I was thinking fully as I typed that I would have realized I said the heat dissolved the crystals so there's no way the heat from sapifecation would cause them to form. Oops. I'm gonna blame it on thinking about too many things at once and none of them fully <blushes>
 

KristaY

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I get those white spots on my honey soaps, also. Usually on the bottom. I have no idea what they are. But they are zapless, and usually disappear during cure for me.
Exactly the same for me, Susie. I get them on every batch of OMH soap I make and have always scratched my head over it. But like you said, those areas are zapless and fade a bit with cure.

On the other hand, I've gotten them too with accelerating FO's that didn't mix in well enough before I had to quickly mold. On those occasions I know it's FO because of the look, smell and icky taste (zapless too). I usually shred those and use for confetti in a different batch.
 

Susie

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Yeah, I have been using the FOs from WSP lately. (my first experiences with FOs) And every one thus far has accelerated. The first one, I was unprepared for, and ended up with a confetti batch. Since then, all FOs go into the oils. The longest trace time thus far has been 1 minute.
 

apples

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I sometimes see droplets like this with high doses of fragrance, with soap that contains more fluids (watery additives, higher water recipe), and with soap that's gotten pretty warm during saponification. IMO, it's more a result of the extra fluids and warmth than it is the sugar (honey) specifically.

Be careful folks -- the droplets are lye heavy, so don't zap test or handle with bare hands. You're better off just letting the droplets evaporate or reabsorb. The white specks show up where the droplets were because the active lye in those spots is reacting with carbon dioxide in air to form sodium carbonate.
i do a water discount for this soap so it is likely the sugar in honey causing the sweats. i didnt zap test the droplets since the sweat/ oils reabsorbed after a while. otherwise i would have (thought it would be sweet!)


I get those white spots on my honey soaps, also. Usually on the bottom. I have no idea what they are. But they are zapless, and usually disappear during cure for me.
Exactly the same for me, Susie. I get them on every batch of OMH soap I make and have always scratched my head over it. But like you said, those areas are zapless and fade a bit with cure.

On the other hand, I've gotten them too with accelerating FO's that didn't mix in well enough before I had to quickly mold. On those occasions I know it's FO because of the look, smell and icky taste (zapless too). I usually shred those and use for confetti in a different batch.
Same situation here, more on the bottom, less on the sides. after the sweat/ oil reabsorbed, they look somewhat like empty "pools" (as if the oil pooled there and then dried up). they're whitish and a bit rough on touch. hope they disappear soon.

just an update, it seemed that the soap didnt gel as i thought. the soap didnt heat up until about 8 hours after molding and that was when i realized the center bulged up and the color darkened. i pushed it down and cooled it in the fridge for a while hoping it will calm down. i cut the soap few hours after i started this thread (because the oil already reabsorbed) and the inside looked orangey tan, but lighten after few hours. i'm so relieved it turned out ok...:) the blotches, tested with ph strip 10 same as the rest of the soap :thumbup:

i reply late because i already read the replies in my email previously but thought i must thank you guys (or else i might have zapped my tongue?) and post an update on how the soap eventually look.

IMAG1558_1.jpg
 

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