Temperatures for oil and lye

[Reets]

I am new to this forum and also fairly new to soap making. I have seen instructions that tell you to start your lye and water mix first, then melt your oils/fats then let both cool to 110. However, I read in Everything Soapmaking that lye cools fast than oils. So why are the instructions telling us to mix the lye and water first? I have had a difficult time keeping my fats from re-solidifying?
Thanks for any help!

 

[jeremmy]

I havent found my lye to cool quicker than my oils. I usually do my lye and water and set it in the sink with a little cold water. Than i melt my oils, set them aside, and get my other stuff ready (about 5 mins). By than they are usually the same temp. Keep in mind that I do 1lb batches. Im sure everything would stay hotter, longer if it was a bigger batch.

 

[danahuff]

I think it depends on your method. For example, if I mix my lye with room temp. distilled water, it can quickly shoot up to 180 degrees. It takes quite a while for that temp to cool. However, I melt my oils and butters in the microwave, and they are usually around 130 or less. When I mix the hard oils I melted in the microwave with room temperature soft oils, my oils are often around 115, give or take five degrees. Thus, my lye takes way longer to reach a soaping temp than my oils, but that is because I am not heating up all my oils on the stove.

 

[Crocoturtle]

I am new to this forum and also fairly new to soap making. I have seen instructions that tell you to start your lye and water mix first, then melt your oils/fats then let both cool to 110. However, I read in Everything Soapmaking that lye cools fast than oils. So why are the instructions telling us to mix the lye and water first? I have had a difficult time keeping my fats from re-solidifying?
Thanks for any help!

For me it depends on what oils I am using. If I use beeswax I start the oils to melt before I make my lye solution, because beeswax has a high melting point.
Otherwise I do my lye solution first because if I have to cool down the oil by stirring or putting it in the fridge, or whatever, it is much easier to cool the oils than the lye. I don't want to be sloshing lye water around trying to put it on a cold surface or something.

 

[Reets]

I think it depends on your method. For example, if I mix my lye with room temp. distilled water, it can quickly shoot up to 180 degrees. It takes quite a while for that temp to cool. However, I melt my oils and butters in the microwave, and they are usually around 130 or less. When I mix the hard oils I melted in the microwave with room temperature soft oils, my oils are often around 115, give or take five degrees. Thus, my lye takes way longer to reach a soaping temp than my oils, but that is because I am not heating up all my oils on the stove.

Thanks for all the input. I can see that it may be easier to cool things down, or to sync the temps with a bit of patience. I like the idea of putting the oils in the fridge--that way I don't have to worry about the oils getting a bit warmer to begin with. Also, I never thought about the temperature of the water. I am trying smaller batches at this point thinking they will give me more confidence and manageability. I learned in a class and started with 4lb batches and that is all I have been doing for the last few years. I like the idea of the smaller batches because you can play with scents, colors, and recipes in general.
Thanks all!

 

[VanessaP]

If you don't want to spend an hour waiting on the lye to cool down, or if you don't want to do an ice bath to help encourage cooling, use some ice to replace some of the water.

I made a batch last night. 418g water amount. 380g was ice. Yeah, I won't be using THAT much ice again, but about 300g should be good and get it warm without getting to near boiling and having to wait forever or give it an ice bath. I don't know why I used ice last night since it was for HP and I've never worried about my lye temp for that before. But yes, for CP because I'm very impatient and want to the batch over with, if water is my only liquid, I use ice.

 

[Reets]

Great idea! Thanks!

 

[rodeogal]

I like to soap at about 115 degrees. It seems this is where everything goes well for me. I used to get my lye going first, as this is how I was taught, then start on my oils. However, I would still end up waiting a long time on my lye to cool down. Then I read somewhere that the poster gets all her oils ready first. Then she prepares her lye in an ice bath to keep the temps down. As soon as the lye is disolved, she mixes lye and oils. I have found that by using this method, my lye rarely gets over my 115 degrees target, but by stiring constantly, I am able to make sure all the lye is disolved. I am able to soap at my fav 115, trace seems to go quicker, and I have shaved a good half hour off my batch time.

Like most of you, I work full-time and soap in the evenings so the time savings is huge!

 

[2lilboots]

I weigh my water and put it right into the freezer. When it has a frozen film across the top I take it out and use it for my lye/water solution. It still heats up, but not as much and cools down a lot faster.

 

[DWinMadison]

I agree about 115f. That seems to be a "sweet spot" for me too where the oil is nicely melted (no clumps) and it saponifies but not too quickly for coloring, swirling, etc. I've tried every method listed here for keeping or bringing the lye temp down. One other idea that should work, but I haven't tested, is to mix your lye in a shallow container. Common sense would dictate that the more surface area is exposed, the faster the heat will escape. (Now, don't go crazy with that create a spill hazard for yourself, but wider should be better).

 

[DWinMadison]

I also agree with RodeoGal. This is not my day job, so I want to make the process as efficient as possible. I keep harping on this, but I am a huge advocate of pre-mixing oils and having them ready for when the mood strikes. I have mine in plastic tubs with the Soapcalc recipe taped to the lid, so there is never any confusion about how much lye and water I need.

Personally, I have to start with a clean work space--no unnecessary clutter. Then, I mix my lye with cold water and/or ice cubes then move to getting my colors out and ready. Having them pre-emusified squirt bottles and in the fridge is another time/mess saver. I make sure my fragrance(s) is sitting out where I can't possibly forget them when everything starts moving. Next I line my mold and make sure I have any necessary items (funnels, chopsticks, dividers, etc...) lined up and ready to go. By the time all that's done, my lye is usually just about to temp. (A digital thermometer is essential.) For my typical 28oz of oils, 1 to 2 minutes is all it takes to bring them to about 120 degrees, and I stir them down to about 115...maybe lower if I'm doing something complicated where I'm splitting into more than 2 colors.

I broke my own rules and made soap while also cooking in the same kitchen on Sunday. Both envdeavors suffered for it, and I didn't enjoy either one. Per my wife, the kitchen looked like Russell Crowe's shed in "A Beautiful Mind" and it took forever to clean up. It's a wonder I didn't poison us all with lye. <right hand raised> NEVER again.

 

[Reets]

Thanks

Thanks again to all you who are answering. I love getting all these ideas to try. Today I made two small batches and had different results. With the second batch I stirred the lye and water as usual but the pot I used was sitting in a roasting pan of cold water. The temp came down way too quick and I had to eventually reheat it. My oils were much warmer so I cooled those. I spent quite a bit of time cooling and heating. It was a merry-go-round, but a fun one and a learning one also. I made a batch of pink/red swirled soap for Valentine's Day and I wanted to scent it with peppermint. I forgot the scent in the first batch -- so did a second one. And then I forgot the scent in the second one also! I almost never scent my soap because it saves money, so I am sure that's why I forgot. ):

 

[DWinMadison]

Thanks again to all you who are answering. I love getting all these ideas to try. Today I made two small batches and had different results. With the second batch I stirred the lye and water as usual but the pot I used was sitting in a roasting pan of cold water. The temp came down way too quick and I had to eventually reheat it. My oils were much warmer so I cooled those. I spent quite a bit of time cooling and heating. It was a merry-go-round, but a fun one and a learning one also. I made a batch of pink/red swirled soap for Valentine's Day and I wanted to scent it with peppermint. I forgot the scent in the first batch -- so did a second one. And then I forgot the scent in the second one also! I almost never scent my soap because it saves money, so I am sure that's why I forgot. ):

I would be scared to reheat lye water not knowing what reaction it might create. I probably go too far, but I treat lye like nuclear waste. I had on gloves, but not long sleeves on one of my early batches. In spite of being careful I got a small lye burn on my forearm. Won't be doing that again.

 

[Reets]

To DWinMadison

Thanks for the input. I read somewhere that it's okay to reheat the lye/water mix. I didn't do it over direct heat. I just poured warm water into the roasting pan around the lye mix. I agree though that the utmost care should be taken when working with lye. I think part of the reason it dropped temp so fast was my kitchen was rather cold and I had our window open for obvious reasons!

 

[2lilboots]

I have had my lye/water temp get down to 65 degrees F and had great results with it. My oils weren't hot either. I lost track of time and when I realized it, I was like "oh crap". Of course that was back when I still took temps of my oils and lye/water before I mixed them. Now I just touch the outsides of the containers and when they feel right I mix them. As long as my lye/water mixture is warmer than my oil mixtures I will start soaping.

 

[Scentapy]

I never even take the temp :shock:. I melt my butters/oils and then I make my lye mixture. I leave them both to cool for about 30 min. to 1 hour (and have even left them longer) depending on what I have to do in between and how impatient I am that day. I am sure I have soaped at many different temps.

 

[Reets]

Wow!

Interesting. Why are all the "instructions" in books and online out there telling us 110? Is that just the warmest temp you can blend at? Does your soap saponify quicker at the lower temps?
Thanks!

 

[DWinMadison]

It's all about limiting the variables if you want consistent outcomes...like baking. The temp is just one more variable. That said, there are lots of experienced cooks who've made a recipe so many times that they can do it consistently by sight and feel. After only a few batches, I pretty we'll know what the right temp feels like, but for now, I still take temps.

 

[2lilboots]

It also depends upon what you want to do with your soap. If you want to do swirls cooler temps work out much better. You have a little bit longer to work with your soap. If you want to pipe your soap thru decorator tips, it is better to go room temp so you have time to work with it so it doesn't harden up in your piping bag. It is trial and error and you learn from it.

 

[Reets]

Confused

I am a bit confused. Are you saying that when your soap is cooler that it is softer and easier to work with? I thought, maybe in error, that when the soap is hot it is more liquid, and when cool, it hardens up. Maybe I have it backwards.
Thanks