Soda Water to increase bubbliness?

[jenny1271]

Do you guys think I could increase the bubbliness of a soap from a score of about 12 to more like 25 by using soda water instead of water to mix with the lye? What other liquids might increase bubbliness? I was considering trying champagne?

 

[Obsidian]

No soda water or other carbonated drinks will not add to bubbliness. You can dissolve a little sugar in your water to help add bubbles but nothing is going to increase the number from 12 to 25 except more coconut oil. If you post your recipe, we can help you change it around some so it has more bubbles.

 

[IrishLass]

Ditto what Obsidian said. The only other thing I would add to her advice is that besides coconut oil, the following oils will also increase bubbliness: palm kernel oil (PKO), and/or babassu oil.


IrishLass

 

[jenny1271]

Thank you.

My recipe is attached. I've been just playing around with soap calc, trying to get my ideal balance of hardness around 45, cleansing 12, conditioning at least 50, bubbliness at 25, and creaminess at 25. So, I thought maybe I could use like 65% Palm oil, 18% Palm kernel, and 16% olive oil, for example. Do you know of any ways to increase bubbliness without increasing cleansing? I'm trying to keep it ultra-gentle. It's just my way of spending time to learn the oil properties.

 

[Seawolfe]

Sugar in the water before adding the lye helps with bubbles, use 1 tablespoon per lb of oils. Castor oil helps at around 5%. I think sodium lactate helps too.

 

[galaxyMLP]

If you add 6% castor oil you can get the bubbliness a little higher, but not much.

OO: 18%
PKO: 16%
PO: 60%
CO: 6%
Hardness29 - 54 45
Cleansing12 - 22 11
Conditioning44 - 69 53
Bubbly14 - 46 16
Creamy16 - 48 39
Iodine41 - 70 55
INS136 - 165 148

Also, this helps
http://soapcalc.net/info/SoapQualities.asp

 

[jenny1271]

This recipe is the absolute best I have been able to do so far. (Hardness)44, (Cleansing)12, (Conditioning)52, (Bubbliness)17, (Creaminess) 38. Laurel fruit seed oil is hard to find though and prohibitively expensive. I would still like to add 7 to bubbliness and take about 10 off of creaminess.

What about adding glycerin after trace. I was thinking of using glycerin like a carrier oil for when I add my fragrance oils. Would added glycerin add bubbliness without increasing the cleansing score? Is a 38 in creaminess going to be super sticky?

 

[jenny1271]

Thanks you guys. I didn't see your replies until just now. I will definitely use those suggestions. Thanks again.

 

[marilynmac]

Use some coconut oil.

 

[Susie]

Glycerin will not increase the bubbliness. And you do not need a cleansing at 12 to get soap that cleans. I would decrease those butters down to no more than 15%. Butters are notorious for killing lather. I would not even put butters in any first batches.

You really need to start with a soap using the "trinity" oils, so at least you have something to compare lather with as you tweak and make your own recipes. Sugar really does boost bubbles, but you won't know how much until you compare a bar without it to one with it. Castor Oil really does stabilize those bubbles so you get a better lather, but you won't understand that until you hold it in your hands. Research is incredibly important, but there comes a point where you need the rubber to hit the road to really understand more.

 

[shunt2011]

I agree with dropping your butter and using PKO or CO at about 20% and Castor at 5-6% with sugar in the water dissolved before adding your lye. I add about 2% Sodium Lactate as well and I think that give the bubbles a boost as well. That amount of butters will inhibit your bubbles.

Also remember the numbers on soap calc are just guidelines and don't necessarily mean a whole lot in the whole scheme of things.

 

[DeeAnna]

Laurel fruit oil is very expensive and hard to find, at least in the US. Do you have a supply?

 

[Nevada]

For Lots of foamy Bubbles
Lard 35%
Olive oil 30%
Coconut 30%
Castor 5%
SF 8
Give it a long cure > 6 months at least

 

[IrishLass]

I really like your recipe and superfat %, Nevada. That would fit right in with me and my peeps.

I didn't know whether or not the OP is keen on using animal fats, so just in case, I came up with this recipe:

Olive oil 42%
Palm Oil 24%
Coconut oil 14%
PKO 14%
Castor Oil 6%

Hardness 43
Cleansing 19
Conditioning 54
Bubbly lather 24
Creamy lather 29

Like it has been said by others, the numbers should be taken with a grain of salt, and you won't really know how the synergy of the chosen oils/fats in your recipe have worked together until you actually use a fully cured bar, but they can at least be used as a guideline/plumbline to work from in order to tweak future batches.

The above makeshift recipe will produce a hard bar with lots of bubbles and a fair balance of bubbly to creamy. Yes- the cleansing is higher than 12, but it has a conditioning of 54 to counterbalance that out a bit, plus you also have the superfat % to play with, which also helps (at least it does for me). If it were me, I would superfat the above at no lower than 8%.

IrishLass

 

[jenny1271]

Thanks you guys! A while after I posted here, I ran across this soap swap. This blogpost includes "with" and "without" pictures for about twenty-five different things to add to try and increase bubbles. It's interesting... I've also tried sodium lactate several times and compared with and without on the same recipes, and it definitely makes a huge difference in the bubbles. Does anyone know whether it would increase the cleansing strength? I meant to start doing sugar in my lye solution but had not thought again about it recently. Time to make another batch!

http://www.modernsoapmaking.com/secret-to-the-best-soap-recipe/

 

[valerieinthegallery]

I agree to not worry too much about the numbers on soapcalc (I was only skimming replies, but I think this was mentioned).

I make a soap that only scores about a 17, I think, (edited to add: I checked my recipe on soapcalc, and the Bubbly is actually listed at 15!) which is way lower than I would want, but when I make it, it has huge fluffy bubbles, it lathers instantly when you rub it in your hands under the water, and has an incredibly fluffy lather.

The only oil I use for bubbles is coconut oil and only at 15%. I also add 5% castor. That's it. And the lather is INCREDIBLE.

(I have never bothered with sugar or sodium lactate or anything like that, either. Just play around a bit - you might be surprised!)

 

[Obsidian]

SL and sugar will not add the the cleaning power of soap.

 

[valerieinthegallery]

SL and sugar will not add the the cleaning power of soap.

I only referenced SL and sugar in regard to some people using them to boost bubbles, not cleansing properties.

 

[Obsidian]

Jenny had asked if they increase cleansing.

 

[valerieinthegallery]

Jenny had asked if they increase cleansing.

(Oh, sorry! I thought you were replying to my post right above yours. Carry on. :smile: )