Melt and Pour Dilemma...HELP!

[lapetite66]

Hi:

I just made some MP soap this past Sunday and I think I messed up.

According to the directions I recieved, I was supposed to turn the oven to 180 degrees and unfortunately, my oven dial is kind of weird and I think I only had the oven at 150 degrees and that is why the MP soap didn't melt as good as it should have. Then to make matters worse I decided that I should add some water to the soap (to make it more liquidy). Not too smart right? The MP was still kind of lumpy and I added more water and then I poured or should I say scooped the soap out into my awaiting mold (loaf pan). I waited a day and then when I attempted to take it out of the loaf pan it was still very soft.

I managed to shape the lumpy mess into individual squares and put on a tray (I don't have a rack). I just checked and they are still soft, not hardening up at all. My question is still should I just go back to the beginning and re-melt the still soft soap and try again? I don't have money to waste so I don't have a lot of options.

Also since it's MP how long do I need to leave it before it hardens? The directions I got said 3 weeks and frankly I think that a bit long as thought that CP soaps are the ones that need to that long cure or whatever the term is before you can use them.

Any assistance will be much appreciated.

Thanks,

 

[fasanis100]

Sorry for your problems. Here are some ideas, first you do not melt MP soap in the oven. You can use a microwave or put the MP base on a container and the container in another container with hot water. I know there is a name for that, but I do not know it, maybe somebody else can help you with that.
Second, the major problem is that you added water to the soap. That is probably the reason that is not hardening. If you add too much water probably the only solution is to throw it away and start again.
Finally, MP soaps do not need to cure. Basically, an MP soap has a lot of water, so what happened after you take it away from the mold is that the water starts to evaporate and the soap get harder and harder. But you do not need that to happen in order to use the soap. You can use an MP soap as soon as you made it, the only problem is that it will not last a long time. But also remember, that while you wait for the soap to get harder, the more you wait the less fragrance it will have, because the scent is also evaporating.
Hope this help.

 

[lapetite66]

Sorry for your problems. Here are some ideas, first you do not melt MP soap in the oven. You can use a microwave or put the MP base on a container and the container in another container with hot water. I know there is a name for that, but I do not know it, maybe somebody else can help you with that.

Second, the major problem is that you added water to the soap. That is probably the reason that is not hardening. If you add too much water probably the only solution is to throw it away and start again.

Finally, MP soaps do not need to cure. Basically, an MP soap has a lot of water, so what happened after you take it away from the mold is that the water starts to evaporate and the soap get harder and harder. But you do not need that to happen in order to use the soap. You can use an MP soap as soon as you made it, the only problem is that it will not last a long time. But also remember, that while you wait for the soap to get harder, the more you wait the less fragrance it will have, because the scent is also evaporating.
Hope this help.

Hi fasanis100:

Thanks for answering I was about to give up as I hadn't gotten any replies the last time I looked.

fasanis100 - Second, the major problem is that you added water to the soap. That is probably the reason that is not hardening. If you add too much water probably the only solution is to throw it away and start again.

I can't afford don't want to throw away the soap! :cry: You said that I added too much water and I agree with that but can't I try to do it over by re-melting the soap and repouring it into a mold?

fasanis100 You can use an MP soap as soon as you made it, the only problem is that it will not last a long time.

So, basically you're saying the longer I let the soap harden the longer the soap will last?

fasanis100 - But also remember, that while you wait for the soap to get harder, the more you wait the less fragrance it will have, because the scent is also evaporating.

I did add some Lavender etc. EO. So, the aroma/frangrance will evaporate huh? Well, I can deal with that as I know the oatmeal I added will still be there.

I am starting to wonder if I would have been better off trying to make some CP soap .

Thanks for your advice and suggestions.

 

[fasanis100]

Hi I don't know if your soap has water that you can see. If that is the case, then try to throw away the water and remelted again. Once the soap is melted put it back in the mold and see if it hardens. It if works fine it should be no more than 12 hours at the most for the soap to be ready in the mold. If after 12 hours it is not yet hard, then sorry, in my opinion you will have to throw it away. Remember to melted as I told you before.
Yes, the more you wait and the hardest the soap gets the more it will last when using it. MP soap bases have a high percentage of water so basically when you wait, the water evaporates from the base and that is why the soaps starts to harden.
I do not recommend you to try CP soaps yet. Those are more difficult to make, and more costly because there are more ingredients to use. Instead, I will recommend you to go to the internet and look for soap suppliers. Some of them have instructions for making MP soap. For what I read, I think your problem was because you had bad instructions on how to make a glycerin soap.
Best of luck

 

[Deda]

Sorry for your problems. Here are some ideas, first you do not melt MP soap in the oven. You can use a microwave or put the MP base on a container and the container in another container with hot water. I know there is a name for that, but I do not know it, maybe somebody else can help you with that.
Second, the major problem is that you added water to the soap. That is probably the reason that is not hardening. If you add too much water probably the only solution is to throw it away and start again.
Finally, MP soaps do not need to cure. Basically, an MP soap has a lot of water, so what happened after you take it away from the mold is that the water starts to evaporate and the soap get harder and harder. But you do not need that to happen in order to use the soap. You can use an MP soap as soon as you made it, the only problem is that it will not last a long time. But also remember, that while you wait for the soap to get harder, the more you wait the less fragrance it will have, because the scent is also evaporating.
Hope this help.

1. Bain Marie or double boiler. Too much trouble, just nuke it for 20 seconds at a time.

2. Exactly, throw it out, don't add water next time.

3. Sorry, but MP doesn't "have a lot of water". There's no need to cure MP. It's as good as it's going to get as soon as it's firmed back up. If you stick it somewhere cool, like the fridge, it will firm up quickly, about 20 mintues. Or less.

 

[fasanis100]

Bain Marie or double boiler. Those were the words I was looking for!!!

 

[carebear]

I guess you could try melting your soap in a double boiler and letting it sit over the heat for an extended period to try to evaporate off some water - but I personally don't think it'll work, and MP soap doesn't really like heat that much.

As for trying CP - well I'm pretty good at CP but suck at MP so if you wish to try it, you should. The ingredients can be very cheap (with the exception of the lye) and even something as simple as a cardboard box lined with freezer paper or a garbage bag can serve as a mold. But be sure you know exactly what the steps are before you start - mucking up MP soap is no biggie, but lye CAN be dangerous if not dealt with properly.

I do find that leaving my MP soap in the mold longer helps it come out better (I'm talking overnight, not days) but then again, I suck at MP as mentioned above. As for a "cure" period - unless you live somewhere quite arid you want your soap out and wrapped or it can start sweating. Ick.

 

[BJBJ]

So-I'm interested in learning more about the MP - couple of questions after reading this:

~so can I just use a decent microwavable container to melt the soap (not as conscious of glass or plastic or whatever as with the lye in CP I assume)?

~do you add lye to the bases if you use the bases (that's the only way I've seen MP-start with a base...which to me would mean the lye was int he base)?

~Is it just personal preference as to which soap they like (CP or MP)-seems they both would be fun-but is one more, um, "elegant"?

 

[lapetite66]

Sorry for your problems. Here are some ideas, first you do not melt MP soap in the oven. You can use a microwave or put the MP base on a container and the container in another container with hot water. I know there is a name for that, but I do not know it, maybe somebody else can help you with that.
Second, the major problem is that you added water to the soap. That is probably the reason that is not hardening. If you add too much water probably the only solution is to throw it away and start again.
Finally, MP soaps do not need to cure. Basically, an MP soap has a lot of water, so what happened after you take it away from the mold is that the water starts to evaporate and the soap get harder and harder. But you do not need that to happen in order to use the soap. You can use an MP soap as soon as you made it, the only problem is that it will not last a long time. But also remember, that while you wait for the soap to get harder, the more you wait the less fragrance it will have, because the scent is also evaporating.
Hope this help.

Hello Fansis100:

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner. Thank you all for your advice and suggestions.

I did redo the soap that I added the water to, it was just a little batch...thank God that I had sense not to muck up a bigger amount otherwise I would have even more to cry about right now then just my computer issues. :cry:

Anyway, the soap I remelted...yet again turned out okay but the batch I made last Thursday turned out great! I melted in the microwave like you said and poured it into the mold and took it out the next day(12 hours +) and cut it into bars and put into the cellar to harden. In the mean time, I am using the soap that I jacked up (less-firm) to give my other batch time to cure/harden even more.

 

[lapetite66]

Sorry for your problems. Here are some ideas, first you do not melt MP soap in the oven. You can use a microwave or put the MP base on a container and the container in another container with hot water. I know there is a name for that, but I do not know it, maybe somebody else can help you with that.
Second, the major problem is that you added water to the soap. That is probably the reason that is not hardening. If you add too much water probably the only solution is to throw it away and start again.
Finally, MP soaps do not need to cure. Basically, an MP soap has a lot of water, so what happened after you take it away from the mold is that the water starts to evaporate and the soap get harder and harder. But you do not need that to happen in order to use the soap. You can use an MP soap as soon as you made it, the only problem is that it will not last a long time. But also remember, that while you wait for the soap to get harder, the more you wait the less fragrance it will have, because the scent is also evaporating.
Hope this help.

1. Bain Marie or double boiler. Too much trouble, just nuke it for 20 seconds at a time.

2. Exactly, throw it out, don't add water next time.

3. Sorry, but MP doesn't "have a lot of water". There's no need to cure MP. It's as good as it's going to get as soon as it's firmed back up. If you stick it somewhere cool, like the fridge, it will firm up quickly, about 20 mintues. Or less.

Hi Deda:

I didn't add water to my last batch. I learned my lesson.

Thanks for your input.

 

[lapetite66]

I guess you could try melting your soap in a double boiler and letting it sit over the heat for an extended period to try to evaporate off some water - but I personally don't think it'll work, and MP soap doesn't really like heat that much.

As for trying CP - well I'm pretty good at CP but suck at MP so if you wish to try it, you should. The ingredients can be very cheap (with the exception of the lye) and even something as simple as a cardboard box lined with freezer paper or a garbage bag can serve as a mold. But be sure you know exactly what the steps are before you start - mucking up MP soap is no biggie, but lye CAN be dangerous if not dealt with properly.

I do find that leaving my MP soap in the mold longer helps it come out better (I'm talking overnight, not days) but then again, I suck at MP as mentioned above. As for a "cure" period - unless you live somewhere quite arid you want your soap out and wrapped or it can start sweating. Ick.

Hi Carebear:

I actually manage to evaporate some of the water in the microwave BUT I guess not all since the soap hasn't firmed up as well as the good batch I made. Still I have no intentions of throwing it away and I'm in the process of using that "not-as-firm" soap until my good batch hardens up more (it was a week yesterday).

Thank you for you encouragement about CP and your warnings about the dangers. I might be a newbie at this but I am no fool when it comes to lye. Before I attempt CP I will make sure that I have all the necessary tools etc. because I don't want to hurt myself or anyone else.

Question: after my good batch has cured what do you suggest that I wrap it in until I'm ready to use it. Is wax paper a bad idea?

 

[sygrid]

MP dilemmas

So-I'm interested in learning more about the MP - couple of questions after reading this:

~so can I just use a decent microwavable container to melt the soap (not as conscious of glass or plastic or whatever as with the lye in CP I assume)?
'
Any micro-wave container will do. Glass measuring cups work really well and allow you to see what is going on. Go slowly on half power. Mp will burn if overheated.

~do you add lye to the bases if you use the bases (that's the only way I've seen MP-start with a base...which to me would mean the lye was int he base)?

MP is a commercially produced soap base. DO NOT ADD LYE. EVER.
Mp does not need to neutralize. It is ready to use as soon as it hardens.
If you want to add extra oils and fillers do so at a rate of 1/4 cup per lb. More than that and you start to mess and diminish the lather.

~Is it just personal preference as to which soap they like (CP or MP)-seems they both would be fun-but is one more, um, "elegant"?

Because we have a store here we have the perfect barometer to preference and the reasons our customers buy:

Here is the breakdown:

Cp: The Educated soap buyer.
She knows exactly what she is looking for: Handcrafted, no chemicals, no preservatives, colour/special ingredients etc. It is not likely that this customer will buy mp, she is savvy and has her list of priorities.

MP: The 'Impulse" soap buyer:

Most Mp purchases are based on appearance and fragrance. They are attracted to the colour, texture, shape and smell.

We split our sales in cp/mp to 60/40. All of our soaps are molded with patterns or sayings so it is an equal playing field for appearance.

There is huge market for both so the best thing you can do if you are wanting to sell your soap is to offer both. We often combine our cp and mp in a soap. You get the best qualities of both!


Hope this helps.

Lorie Martin

 

[Tabitha]

So-I'm interested in learning more about the MP - couple of questions after reading this:

~so can I just use a decent microwavable container to melt the soap (not as conscious of glass or plastic or whatever as with the lye in CP I assume)?

~do you add lye to the bases if you use the bases (that's the only way I've seen MP-start with a base...which to me would mean the lye was int he base)?

~Is it just personal preference as to which soap they like (CP or MP)-seems they both would be fun-but is one more, um, "elegant

NEVER add lye to M&P base.

I use pyrex measuring cups to melt M&P base.

 

[BJBJ]

Haha-thanks guys. I like the NEVER...easy to remember....

I'm not particular to selling as I barely started-but as my friends range from one end to the other-I was trying to gauge the difference in opinions, and why that is. I appreciate the customer description-VERY helpful.

I am not entirely clear as how one can mold singly CP-as most info I've found is on log molding...or very large batches....but I'm researching it-because I like the idea of the designs on the gifts-but prefer the CP method....

ANyway-thanks for the info/responses.

 

[Mandarin]

I do find that leaving my MP soap in the mold longer helps it come out better (I'm talking overnight, not days)

I find that MP is much better a couple of weeks out of the mold. It gets very firm. There is shrinkage, so I tend to make my bars larger to compensate for this. Also the sheen of the soap diminishes, but that is okay and no big deal.

 

[tracey11474]

I did m&p for the first time and made cute little ice cube sized pumpkins and skulls to sell alongside my cp soap at a craft show. Of course they are sweating. What can I wipe them with that won't scratch them?