liquid soap problem

[fireweed]

Hi there!

Anyone know why my liquid soap paste (hot process a'la Failor) went from salt water taffy consistency back to pudding... and NOT budging!

I've used lots of heat, blending, KOH (not the other lye)-- everything was fine until it all kind of fell apart. The recipe was from the book, and contained lots of olive oil with a smaller percentage of coconut oil.

I posted this problem in the intro section but thought no one might see it there.. hope it's okay to double post!

Cheers,
Lisa

 

[gardengoat]

I have had the consistancy go from the thick taffy to sort of an applesauce. When it turned translucent like vasoline & passed the clear water test it made wonderful soap.

 

[fireweed]

Thanks Gardengoat-- how long did you have to cook it before it went translucent? Mine is still as though it has just traced, after hours of cooking!

 

[Bigmoose]

If your soap got thick like taffy you did reach trace. I try to cook my paste till it gets clear then one more hour. Most of the time I just cook it 3 hours and they turn out good. High amounts of coconut oil can sometimes cause some trouble but you said that you used a small amout. If you cooked it long enough I would not worry, sometimes doing liquid soaps will look as if they are trying to seperate but turn out fine. Did you go with KOH X3 for your water amount? Also when cooking the paste did you try to simmer it or cook it as hot as you can? I try to stir mine often while cooking the paste. The hardest part is usually dissolving the paste, I use a crockpot on the warm setting for this.

Bruce

 

[gardengoat]

I make mine in the crockpot - can take 6-12 hours; pretty sure mine takes so long is because my batch is too large for the pot be efficient.

 

[fireweed]

Thanks again for the replies--

I used the recipe in Failor's book: 33 oz olive oil, 14 oz coconut oil, 11 oz KOH and 33 oz water. It's actually one of her gel recipes.

It was thick, pudding like trace, then taffy like paste for about an hour or so, then back to pudding! Totally opaque as well, very frustrating. The only potential problem I can think of is that I used a very small amount of the local water because I didn't have quite enough distilled-- the water is VERY hard here, could that be the problem?

 

[Bigmoose]

I suppose the water could be the problem but I am not sure. I always use distilled.

Bruce

 

[gardengoat]

yes it could, can't use my well water for the test because it clouds. When you do the test, is there anything floating on top of the water? --sometimes it is hard to see--would be a bit of oil sometimes it appears like it it almost thicker than the water.

Sometimes I have to add a bit more lye solution, especially if my Koh is older--do believe it just absorbs that much more water to have to compensate.

 

[fireweed]

I'll try adding a bit more lye... it doesn't past the test-- makes the water very milky and does have a trace of oil on the surface...

 

[gardengoat]

I generally add 2% extra at a time. Let it cook for at least 30 minutes & test again.

 

[fireweed]

Well, I was about to throw out the pudding-like batch of goo and then it occurred to me that it's worth it to experiment first.

I added about an ounce or two extra of lye which I wasn't worried about, since the plan was to add Borax later to neutralize and thicken (I added the maximum amount recommended). Nothing much happened, so I added a couple of ounces of isopropyl alchohol (99%) and the pudding instantly turned into mashed potatoes, still opaque.

Frustrated, I decided to add the recommended amount of boiling water to make gel (borax added to a soft oil based paste theoretically makes gel) and it sat in the pot overnight.

When I got up and looked I was amazed to find clear, almost dissolved gel soap! As well, it is beautiful to use and feels great-- nice lather considering how hard our water is and that the recipe is predominantly olive oil. Right now I'm just playing with the viscosity...

I highly recommend trying the liquid soaps

Thanks for the tips!

L

 

[gardengoat]

Good for you! I find it really hard to mess up LS . If you get frustrated you can just let the paste sit for weeks at a time if you wanted
and pick back up where you left off when you're ready.

The Koh itself is usually my largest problem, have some right now I've had awhile & doesn't snap, crackle, & pop as it should when it hits the water. So I know it has absorbed more moisture out of the air & have to increase the percentage to compensate. If it's leaving an oil slick, ya know you haven't gotten to 0%.

I've always just used the borax to neutralize.....this weekend I've finally gotten around to trying the citric acid in some, and do believe it does a better job at least can tell it has a different feel.
If you have any glycerin it will help fluff out the creamy lather plus add a nice feel. Sooooo many things to try & do

 

[fireweed]

You're so right, the one thing I love about soap making is, as they say, almost every problem is fixable-- I have yet to actually throw out a batch. Luckily I have three kids so any soap I don't care for just goes towards doing laundry!

I've been doing CP for a couple of years now, so it's nice to try something different.

My KOH doesn't really snap crackle and pop, it just sort of grumbles-- it's much louder than sodium, though. It came in a plastic bag, so I want to find an empty pail of some sort to keep it in as I'm afraid it will tear.

There are so many additives I want to try, but I have to pace myself on the shopping or I will have so much soap I won't know what to do with it! The next thing I get WILL be glycerin, though. How much do you usually add to a batch of soap, say 6 pounds of paste (50 oz. oil)?

 

[gardengoat]

Failor recommends using up to 2 ounces per pound of paste. I've only tried half that much; but my recipes have been a majority of coconut and now PKO.

My Koh is in a small pail...my next shipment I'll probably put in a plastic bag tightly fasten around it & in the pail to see if that will help keep it from absorbing the water left in the air space.