Liquid soap from Acapulco Plant

[abiii]

I am a student and we are starting to do our feasibility study. we're going to make a liquid soap using acapulco leaves but no idea where to start. please help us. thank youu!

 

[artemis]

Can you tell us a bit more about:

1. The leaves themselves (benefits, characteristics, safety to humans...)
2. What are any requirements for the project (is there a certain percentage of leaves that needs to be used, restrictions on certain oils, etc)
3. What's the deadline

 

[abiii]

Can you tell us a bit more about:

1. The leaves themselves (benefits, characteristics, safety to humans...)
2. What are any requirements for the project (is there a certain percentage of leaves that needs to be used, restrictions on certain oils, etc)
3. What's the deadline

1. The leaves of acapulco is also known as ringworm bush, It has a lengthy history of medicinal usage and is used to treat various skin diseases such as ringworm, scabies, eczema, insect bites, and skin itchiness/inflammation. The leaves contain chrysophanic acid, which is a fungicide that is used to treat fungal infections. For the most part, the akapulco plant is safe for use, especially for adults.
2. There's no any requirements, it's up to us. that's why we're looking for some help to do this correctly.
3. We're already on chapter 4 of our feasibility study, so we need to do it like personally with correct ingredients and measurements and also correct procedures because it needs to be on the paper and the chapter 4 deadline is on oct. 10th.

If you have any questions, I'm willing to answer it for you to be able to help us. Thank you!

 

[AliOop]

Acidic ingredients (lemon juice, vinegar, citric acid, and apparently acapulco leaves) are typically going to interact with the lye used to make soap. That raises the superfat of the soap, which isn't as a big deal with bar soap (which is made with NaOH). However, a higher superfat in liquid soap (made with KOH) can cause separation, leaving you with a layer of unsaponified fats on top of the soap.

For that reason, you'd want to research the amount of acid present in the amount of leaves you intend to use in the soap, and also research how much KOH each gram of that acid can be expected to neutralize.

Best wishes for a successful outcome!

 

[abiii]

Acidic ingredients (lemon juice, vinegar, citric acid, and apparently acapulco leaves) are typically going to interact with the lye used to make soap. That raises the superfat of the soap, which isn't as a big deal with bar soap (which is made with NaOH). However, a higher superfat in liquid soap (made with KOH) can cause separation, leaving you with a layer of unsaponified fats on top of the soap.

For that reason, you'd want to research the amount of acid present in the amount of leaves you intend to use in the soap, and also research how much KOH each gram of that acid can be expected to neutralize.

Best wishes for a successful outcome!

so the perfect amount of acapulco leaves and grams of KOH will not leave any unsaponified fats? i just want to ask, how am i going to prevent the particles of acapulco leaves to fall out to the bottom of the bottle?

 

[AliOop]

so the perfect amount of acapulco leaves and grams of KOH will not leave any unsaponified fats?

Theoretically yes, assuming the rest of your recipe - including the base oils and other ingredients - were also correctly calculated. Be aware that soap calculators and SAP values are based on averages, and your KOH may not be exactly the number that goes into the soap calculator. Thus, you cannot really come up with "perfect amounts" for any ingredient.

i just want to ask, how am i going to prevent the particles of acapulco leaves to fall out to the bottom of the bottle?

You absolutely must strain out all of the leaves so that no particles remain in the liquid soap. Otherwise, the soap is likely to become rancid, grow mold, etc. I recommend that you infuse the leaves into the oil, and then strain them out before making soap with the oil. Of course, that will make it quite difficult to estimate how much of the acid is present in the oil, so that you know how much extra KOH to add. You have your work cut out for you!

Please don't take this the wrong way but based on your questions, I am concerned that you are not really familiar with how to make liquid soap. Have you developed a base recipe and run it through a soap calculator? If not, you really must do so.

Also, since you will most likely be estimating the amount of acid contributed by the infused acapulco leaves, you are likely to end up with a soap that either has a lye excess, or has an excess superfat. Thus, you should be familiar with how to spot the signs of either problem, and how to fix it. Good luck!

Edited to add: A good resource for the science behind liquid soapmaking is this e-book. A download link arrives immediately via email if you purchase it from that site.

 

[artemis]

I am guessing that you would need to infuse an oil with your leaves and even make a "tea" with the leaves and distilled water.

First, though, you should read up on how to make liquid soap. Here is a thread that may help:

Thread 'My Creamy Cocoa/Shea GLS Tutorial' My Creamy Cocoa/Shea GLS Tutorial

 

[Zany_in_CO]

HI @abiii! Welcome to SMF! This sounds like a fun project. But I have to warn you, learning to make soap is highly addictive! Once you try it, and succeed, you're likely to join the merry band here who are hopelessly beguiled by their wonderful handcrafted soaps. So much better than the store-bought stuff.

First things first. According to the link you provided, "Akapulko herbal medicine uses and preparation has become very popular over the years. It is commercially prepared in the form of capsule, powder and tincture. Some even add it to lotions and soaps."

That means, the best medicinal way to use the leaves would be tincture, a "leave-on" product which is quite a different process from lye-based soap which is a "wash-off" product. That being said, I will share the way I would do it to get the most benefit from Akapulko leaves in soap.

how am i going to prevent the particles of acapulco leaves to fall out to the bottom of the bottle?

Answer: By infusing the leaves (fresh or dried) in oil, hot process -- similar to how I make Carrot Tissue Oil. Pick the leaves early in the day, after the morning dew has evaporated. Gently wash and pat dry. Put them in a stainless steel sauce pan or frying pan -- enough to generously cover the bottom of the pan. Pour sufficient olive oil over the leaves to have enough oil to make the soap. You will will lose about 1/3 of the oil using this method. Once the bubbles no longer rise to the surface, strain the oil as many times as needed to get all the debris out. You don't want any particles clogging the liquid soap pump. I use a cutoff piece of pantyhose stretched over a strainer. Highly technical, I know, but it works!

the perfect amount of acapulco leaves and grams of KOH will not leave any unsaponified fats?

Answer: I would use 50% of the olive oil (conditioning) plus 50% coconut oil (for copious lather) to make a small 450g or 16 oz or liquid soap base. Once the base is made, weigh it. Next you dilute the soap base with distilled water at ratio of 40% soap to 60% water. That basically the process.

In order to get the amount of KOH needed to saponify the oils, go to SoapCalc. Take some time to read the instructions in red at the top and hover your mouse over each step, 1 - 7. Here is what your input should look like:

At the bottom, click on View or Print Recipe - Continued on next page.

Here is the print out of your KOH (lye) calculation. Note: 0% SF (Super Fat) so all the fatty acids get saponified with no leftover oil. There is room at the bottom to add any notes as you go along.

I see @AliOop and I were writing at the same time. Not to worry. It's all good. Botanicals like Alakapulka leaves contain no FAs (fatty acids), so you don't need to be concerned about that. The FAs you will be using are in the Olive and Coconut Oils.

I'm concerned that this project is due October 10 and you may not have enough time to actually make the LS in that short of time -- especially since you've never made soap before.

I am a student and we are starting to do our feasibility study.

So all you need is the process by October 10 and can make it later?

In any case, you need the Directions. In order to follow the directions, you will need a kichen scale or something similar, to weigh everything -- the KOH, the water, the infused olive oil and the coconut oil. You will also need a thermometer to know the temperature of the lye solution and oils before combining them.

You also need time to gather equipment and materials as well as safety gear required when working with lye.

Follow the links in this post to learn more:

https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/new-to-liquid.87740/#post-938737
HTH (Hope This Helps)!

 

[AliOop]

Not to worry. It's all good. Botanicals like Alakapulka leaves contain no FAs (fatty acids), so you don't need to be concerned about that.

Fatty acids in the leaves were not the issue. Post #3 states:

"the leaves contain chrysophanic acid."

Introducing any form of acid (lemon juice, vinegar, citric acid, etc.) requires knowing how much lye (ETA: if any) that acid will neutralize. As I originally stated, this isn't as big of a deal for bar soap, but given the low SF used for LS, it is important to pay attention to this issue and be ready to adjust for it.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

According to Wikipedia, Chrysophanic acid is an anthraquinone (pigment) that was first isolated from Rheum (rhubarb). It don’t think it would cause any problems in soap making.

A quick search for Acapulco/Akapulka (or various other spellings) soap recipes using Google turned up numerous fairly similar or identical recipes on websites and a few YouTube videos. At least some of the recipes use a decoction of the leaves. The leaves are boiled and then strained from the water, like making a strong tea. The water/decoction/tea is used to replace the water in the recipe. I did not spend time trying to figure out if any of the active ingredients in the leaves are water soluble.

I have not made liquid soap so can’t weigh in on the process except to say that I have considered trying one of the recipes linked from this webpage. The author has considerable experience working with herbs and other botanicals in soap making and has made liquid soap using herbal tea instead of water.

 

[AliOop]

That's so good to have more info about chrysophanic acid, @Mobjack Bay. I was hoping one of our scientists would come along and give more info, and you did not disappoint. The link to the LS tutorial on Nerdy Farm Wife is a good one, as well.

 

[abiii]

I edited my reply and is waiting for approval

 

[abiii]

Answer: I would use 50% of the olive oil (conditioning) plus 50% coconut oil (for copious lather) to make a small 450g or 16 oz or liquid soap base. Once the base is made, weigh it. Next you dilute the soap base with distilled water at ratio of 40% soap to 60% water. That basically the process.

In order to get the amount of KOH needed to saponify the oils, go to SoapCalc. Take some time to read the instructions in red at the top and hover your mouse over each step, 1 - 7. Here is what your input should look like:

Good day, I apologize for messaging you personally, but I wanted to thank you directly for your assistance; everything you mentioned enlightens me and makes me want to do it correctly and get the best result. But I also want you to double-check that I did everything right, since we're going to add certain things in addition to the olive and coconut oil. So I just followed the instructions, and this is the output, which I'm not sure is accurate.

For the percent of castor oil and shea butter that we also want to add, is from this website.

Hopefully you see this and again, thank you very much for your help. God bless!