GM smelling 'cheesy'

[soapopera]

Hi there, was wondering if anyone experiencing their GM smelling 'cheesy'. Recently I swap from using powdered GM to fresh GM. The soap made from fresh GM will smell caramel at first, then 'goaty, cheesy'. I know it's not a rancid smell. Is there something wrong with it? When I mix the lye into the milk, it curdled quite fast eventhough I use frozen method with ice water around it. I use Nubian. The powdered GM I used before was from Alpine and no cheesy.

 

[Lindy]

Hi there. Did you freeze your goat milk? In my experience I find it is best to freeze any milk you are going to add lye to. I like to freeze them into ice cube trays as it makes them nice and easy to work with. At that point you would very slowly add your lye to the frozen milk while having your container sit in an ice bath. As I said you are going to add it slowly, stirring constantly until the lye you've added has dissolved and carry on that way until you have it all incorporated.

How old is the soap that you feeling is smelly cheesey? It can take some time for it to smell better, but I am really, really concerned about the milk curdling. Have you done a zap test yet?

 

[soapopera]

Hi Lindy,
Yes the milk is frozen. But it's in larger chunks than in small pieces. Normally I waited to become slightly slushy before I add the lye. And I make sure I stir until the lye dissolves. The thing is, once I stir all the lye in, the solution is fine and liquid, but if I let it sit too long, the milk started curdling in tiny bits (it's not burnt, just slight orange). I thought that the lye may be saponifying the milk fats coz Nubians have higher fat content. I did use a sieve before pouring the curdle solution into the oil just incase there's undissolved lye. The sieve will catch the curdles and I press it through the sieve and it appears sticky spongey. The soap smells caramel-like in the first month and turn kinda goatty cheesey in 2 month. I gave some to my friends to smell, some dont smell anything but some gave a face and say it smelled like cheese. Btw... it's full goat's milk soap. I've tried in the past with Nubian but in 50% and it doesn't smell cheesy.

 

[green soap]

Hi Lindy,
Yes the milk is frozen. But it's in larger chunks than in small pieces. Normally I waited to become slightly slushy before I add the lye. And I make sure I stir until the lye dissolves. The thing is, once I stir all the lye in, the solution is fine and liquid, but if I let it sit too long, the milk started curdling in tiny bits (it's not burnt, just slight orange). I thought that the lye may be saponifying the milk fats coz Nubians have higher fat content. I did use a sieve before pouring the curdle solution into the oil just incase there's undissolved lye. The sieve will catch the curdles and I press it through the sieve and it appears sticky spongey. The soap smells caramel-like in the first month and turn kinda goatty cheesey in 2 month. I gave some to my friends to smell, some dont smell anything but some gave a face and say it smelled like cheese. Btw... it's full goat's milk soap. I've tried in the past with Nubian but in 50% and it doesn't smell cheesy.

Your technique is identical to mine (except I freeze in ice cube trays) and I also use Nubian goat's milk. I filter (sieve) to catch any potential undissolved lye and to sieve the goat cream soap. This forms spontaneously with the lye in the lye container. Exactly as you describe. The result is even higher superfatting.

I make two different unscented GM soaps. One has calendula infusion, the other is a goat castille. They smell to me like dried milk powder, the type you can take camping. Definitely not cheese. Hey I love cheese but not in my soap! Some of them are older than 2 months (the unscented do not sell as fast as the scented) and they still smell the same. Different than an unscented non goat soap, but not unpleasant.

I am wondering if the goat milk is not fresh enough when you freeze it. My supplier raises the goats 1/2 mile from my house and she tells me exactly how many days it was since milking. I have used some refrigerated 3-4 days, and frozen after that. They were fine.

Not sure what else it could be without going into details of your recipe. Could your SF% be too high?

 

[thefarmerdaughter]

I am wondering if the goat milk is not fresh enough when you freeze it. My supplier raises the goats 1/2 mile from my house and she tells me exactly how many days it was since milking. I have used some refrigerated 3-4 days, and frozen after that. They were fine.

I've soaped with GM that was over a week old. There was no off odor, certainly no cheese smell. But my milk is pasteurized. If it's old and raw that might be a problem. Something else to consider, I admit this maybe a stretch, But the goats diet plays a large role in the the flavor (and sometimes odor) of the milk. If my goats gorge on certain weeds their milk can be so unpleasant, I wont even bring it in the house. The dogs love it thou

 

[soapopera]

green soap: I superfat at 10%. maybe this could be it. Too much milk coz I use a 28% lye concentration. I'm gonna try the ice cube tray for the next batch. I have one curing now using the same recipe and it's currently smelling like milk powder.

thefarmerdaughter: yeah I've read that the milk sometimes got to do with their diet.

I'm thinking to lower the superfat and see how it does in a test batch. Thanks ladies. Very much appreciate the insights.

 

[green soap]

I use 6% Sf (in soapcalc) but I figured that it is really 7.5 or 8% if one accounts for the fat in the milk. This varies with time of year too. Good luck with your next batch.

 

[noskiveez]

This might sound a bit odd, but this may not have anything to do with your soap at all. I have a small herd of goats and I will experience this same smell you are describing if I have a Buck of sexual maturity in the same pen with a doe in milk. If I move the buck and clean the pen down to fresh dirt, the odor is gone within a week. My nose is very sensitive to any type of goat smells.

 

[Lindy]

As your GM sits with the lye in it you will often see it go orange, no biggie mine does that all the time and I don't worry about it. I'm really not sure why you would be getting a cheesy scent a few weeks in.

I find it interesting to read about the raw gm - I've not used any yet so this is really valuable info for me - thank you....

 

[thefarmerdaughter]

Thank you noskiveez for mentioning that. A buck Especially this time of the year (its breeding season in the US) will be very musky. Nubians are notorious. Wondering what did you think of the milk before you soaped with it?