Lumps in my recipe?

mechanolatry · Dec 13, 2012

OK, someone clue me in here cause I'm getting really frustrated. For some reason I'm getting small lumps in my CP soap! They're always natural-colored, which is weird because I mix my pigments in very well, and before the lumps form the soap batter is clearly well mixed. But whats really funky is that the lumps only happen after the batter has mixed perfectly with everything: the lye-water, the colors, and the fragrance. It seems to happen when the trace becomes thicker, and right when I'm about to pour it into the mold. Is my s. lactate too high?? Am I using too many solid oils?? It gets very cold in my house, so maybe the oils are solidifying as the soap batter becomes thicker? But that doesn't make sense, right? My recipe has evolved since the summer, but I never had these issues then, which makes me think maybe its a temp issue?? I really dont know.

Things I've tried: Lowering the percent of castor oil; soaping at higher and lower temps. (between 100 to 125); adding s. lactate to the h20; adding it to the lye/water; not adding s. lactate at all; different fragrance oils; higher and lower h2o percentages, no pigments....

What in the world is going on with my soap?? lol

Genny · Dec 13, 2012

Do you have a pics of the lumps?

mechanolatry · Dec 13, 2012

You know, I wish I had some action shots from yesterday, but I didn't think of it. Here's a photo of what it looks like in a cured soap. The lumps look a bit grey in the photo, but in real life they look like bits of naturally colored soap. Any thoughts? I'm going to try uping my thermostat a few hours before I soap tomorrow, but other than that I'm out of ideas.

Oh and don't judge by the texture of that soap, it had FO issues. My usual soap is smooth and creamy-looking, but the lumps look the same as this one. So weird. I'll try to take a variety of photos if that will help.

Genny · Dec 13, 2012

It does kind of look like your solid oils are becoming solid again.

mechanolatry · Dec 13, 2012

Which is weird, right? Have you ever heard of that happening to someone? What would you suggest I do?

Genny · Dec 14, 2012

mechanolatry said:
Which is weird, right? Have you ever heard of that happening to someone? What would you suggest I do?

I've heard that happen to a lot of soapers actually, especially with recipes with high amounts of hard oils and with some Room Temp soapers.

Ooh, I just saw that you said you use pomace olive oil, for me that has always sped up trace. I know some people use it and have no problems though.

Can you stick your mold in the oven? You could do CPOP, maybe that would work?

mechanolatry · Dec 14, 2012

Genny said:
I've heard that happen to a lot of soapers actually, especially with recipes with high amounts of hard oils and with some Room Temp soapers.

Oh thank goodness, at least that makes me feel better that I'm not alone with my lumps.

I've never had issues with the olive pomace oil before, and I've been using the same brand since I started soapmaking. But I think next time I will grab a different type of olive oil and see if that changes things up. And I'm definitely cranking up the heat in here before I soap next. Thank you Genny! I feel less frustrated now.

soap_rat · Dec 14, 2012

I've noticed this as well, and meant to research it. I've been HPing a lot, so I blamed it on that, but recently I did a CPOP batch where I poured the soap at light/medium trace and saw those lumps as it poured out of my pot. I used to use pomace-grade, but am not using it currently (I'm using Costco olive oil). The pot did sit a few minutes as I pulled out and colored a small amount for one mold, but it sat on a still-hot (not on) burner).

mechanolatry · Dec 14, 2012

Soap_rat do you remember if your room temperature was low when you had that lumpy cpop batch? If not, do we have anything in common that might cause soap lumps?

Elfknight · Dec 14, 2012

I think we need an abbreviation decoder. What is CPOP? I got the cold process, but OP?

Rich

Cosmo · Dec 14, 2012

CPOP = Cold Process Oven Process

soap_rat · Dec 14, 2012

The room temp was probably fairly low, as the kitchen stays cooler than the rest of the house. Could have been somewhere between 69-73 degrees?

My recipe is 47% olive oil, the rest coconut, palm, 3% castor, 5% total cocoa butter and shea butter.

Hazel · Dec 14, 2012

I had lumps like this in a batch in which I used coconut and palm plus soaped at a cooler temp. I came to the conclusion it was the CO and/or PO resolidifying because the temp was too cool to keep them liquid. The soap was fine (lathered good and got me clean :wink: ). I actually thought the creamy colored lumps made the bars more visually interesting.

mechanolatry · Dec 16, 2012

soap_rat said:
The room temp was probably fairly low, as the kitchen stays cooler than the rest of the house. Could have been somewhere between 69-73 degrees?

My kitchen has the same problem, it's the coldest room and it's usually around the same temp. I'm cranking up the heat tonight to soap, so I will update this thread to see if this fixes the problem. Thank you everyone for the input! This forum always makes me feel better when I hit a snag in my soap journey.

soap_rat · Dec 16, 2012

I don't know the next time I will soap, but I think instead of my metal pot I'll try using the crock pot for a CP batch. I'll keep it on low and just let it sit a few minutes, and see if there are any lumps when I pour it.

mechanolatry · Jan 26, 2013

EUREKA!

I know it's taking me awhile to posts my results, but it was quite a bit of expensive trial and error. Turns out it was a few different things going against me. Besides the soap lumps, I'd had a lot of issues with false trace which I believe had to do with room temperature. My house has been too cold, so I got a space heater which helped a lot.

But the biggest thing was switching from Olive Pomace oil to Olive Grade A oil. HUGE difference. I really think what was happening was the unsaponifiable bits were solidifying as the soap was thickening and cooling. I'd noticed if I let part of the batter sit while I was working on a separate section, it would really get lumpy at that point. I guess it (sort of) makes sense that the unsaponifiable lumps wouldn't pick up the pigment, since the pigments are water-dispersible, not oil-dispersible.

I've also noticed a huge difference in my colors. They pop, and seem less cloudy, if that makes sense.

Huge sigh of relief!!!

Lumps in my recipe?

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