My soap doesn’t contain lye and nasty cheap palm oil

[DelightSociety]

What am I supposed say to soap makers who tell me that at markets?

Obviously there isn’t any lye left in his soap or he’d be the world’s worst soaper but what’s with making it sound like Palm oil is cheap and nasty stuff? He went on and on about how rubbish Palm oil is and tried to make it seem like he didn’t use lye at all and that it’s a bad thing to add to soap.

I dislike talking to people who use scare tactics. For the record he made soap using just OO but there was no ingredients list anywhere.

I almost said “Wow! You figured out a way to make soap without using lye? That’s amazing, a world first!!” But just shut the heck up instead...I didn’t know what to say.

*Edited to make the heading make more sense*

 

[topcat]

Hmmm.....I guess his tactics will backfire on him one day.....it also gives you something to think about as far as promoting your own products - educating your customers correctly. It sounds like he has heard of the palm oil debate and yes, is definitely using scare tactics. They don't work in the long run.

Tanya

 

[DelightSociety]

It was a shame because his actual soap looked great and smelt divine. All he had to do was sit back and sell what was great about his soap rather than the stuff that wasn't in it.

 

[Vinca Leaf]

I had a similar experience recently...and the "sellers" seemed very uninformed. I talked to them as a customer, not with them knowing I sold soap. I was appalled at their sales tactics. And the lye-bashing. :roll:

The only thing I can think with that guy saying he "doesn't use lye" is that he's making M&P...which is fine, whatever you're comfortable with. But we all know the skill involved is minimal when you melt, mix, cut, ship. I like to see M&P with some style to it, you know?

 

[AshleyR]

I hate when people do that! I see a lot of people selling online who give out misinformation. I cringe when I watch soapmaking videos on youtube by a particular lady who acts like she knows her stuff but really doesn't. It ruins it for the rest of us!

I also find that people insist their products are "all natural" when they are not. My sister in law sells Arbonne skincare products and she tells everyone that they are "TOTALLY NATURAL!" When looking at the ingredients there are preservatives and a bunch of other crap in them. But she tells everyone they are 100% natural and people who don't bother to look at the ingredients (or know what they mean) don't know any better! That ticks me off!

 

[xraygrl]

Could it possibly have been an Olive Oil MP base? If that were the case, then he would be "making" it without lye.

I hate when people are bashing something when they obviously don't have a clue! Gives reputable soapers a bad name.

 

[carebear]

the lye thing is BS - you can simply say that you are sad that he clearly doesn't make the soap himself. or to put it differently say the soaps are beautiful and that his supplier is a true artist.

the palm thing is a different issue and I kinda agree with that (sometimes).

 

[Tabitha]

My sister in law sells Arbonne skincare products and she tells everyone that they are "TOTALLY NATURAL!"

I had a craft booth next to an Arbonne lady once. That must have been the logest day of my life. I did not say a word to her. I just listeened to her blow smoke up everyones behind all day.

 

[honor435]

i would have asked how he made soap without lye? m&p is made with lye! dumb selling tactics.

 

[Guest]

He surely must be a magician to be able to make soap without lye . People that put products down and blow smoke , can't be to sure that their product is fantastic , imho .
If you ever had to be next to him again at a market , I would be very tempted to give everyone that bought his soap a small sample of yours to try and decide which is better .

Kitn

 

[LomondSoap]

There's a soapmaker over here that does the same type of thing only they try to put down anyone else who is competing with them. It's a poor tactic IMO, if you can't sell your soap on its merits but have to diss someone else's.

 

[heartsong]

x

there's just no excuse for bad manners!

catherine failor has a marvelous book MAKING TRANSPARENT SOAPS and here's the list of ingredients to make glycerine soaps:

water
caustic soda (sodium hydroxide)
palm, tallow or lard
coconut oil
castor oil
ethanol
glycerine
sugar

i would copy this down on a small card and next time this occurs i would hand them the card and gently tell them "pardon me, but your ignorance is showing. this is the list of ingredients that goes into your soap, and if you don't shut up and act like an adult-i've got a big piece of poster board and i'm going to list your soaps ingredients so the rest of the world can see what an ignorant liar you truly are."

then smile sweetly and walk away!

 

[artisan soaps]

..

 

[zeoplum]

Here's my dilemma. I have a co-worker who has severely sensitive skin and her dermatologist told her she has to use soap that is made WITHOUT sodium hydroxide or postassium hydroxide. She found a supplier (http://www.naturesbouquet.com) who told her their Vegetable soap base isn't made with either so she's been buying from them ever since and hasn't had a problem.

I wrote to the company and asked them what agent they use to saponify their oils and they wrote back stating they purchase in bulk from another company and that they do not know the details of that companies manufacturing process. :shock: :shock:

I educated my friend on how it all works. But here's where I'm stumped. She has tried homemade soap and found that transparent (aka clear glycerin) soap doesn't bother her but the opaque stuff does. She's even tried Castile and had problems. So that only reinforced what she thought to be true info she got from her doc. And her reaction is so severe that she's not willing to try anything else (which I totally understand) but it irks me that this company gets her money because they misled her. She said it was a man that she spoke with...probably a couple years ago...and he specifically assured her the soap was not made with lye or potash.

zeo


Edited to correct typos.

 

[Sibi]

I don't think I could stop myself asking exactly how he saponifies without a caustic, and brought up the orangutang issue to add fuel to the fire ..

But that's just me

On a similar note, I recently borrowed Paula Begoun's highly regarded book 'Don't Go To The Cosmetics Counter Without Me' which is in it's 7th or so printing out of the library, and was very surprised to read 'soap is terrible for skin' and 'even Clinique and Nutregina facial soap contains harsh chemicals like caustic soda' (not direct quotes because I didn't write her exact words but the gist is the same and a few name brands were mentioned) ..

That one line showed poor research, ignorance, and discredited her to the point I put the book down and returned it the following day!

I didn't know half of what I do now about soap just a few months back, but I certainly never went around talking like I did, so these people leave me most unimpressed ..

Wow, I find it soooo hard to believe that someone who obviously does not understand the soaping process can say such a thing AND get it published without someone pointing that out! Doesn't the average person know that you can't make soap w/out lye? I guess not.......

 

[artisan soaps]

..

 

[AshleyR]

THIS is how the public are being 'educated' to pay attention to what they put on their skin
:cry:

WOW! What is she suggesting people use then? She is bashing the most natural products. What are people supposed to use if "our" soap is so bad?

 

[artisan soaps]

..

 

[donniej]

*We* all know that natural soaps are made with lye, but lye is a scary word and it's easy for a less-than-honest person to take advantage of that. Anyone who says there product is better than yours becuase you are using lye and they are not is a liar, we all know it but obviously you can't get into a hissy fit with a rival seller in front of customers about it.

Luckily people who use those sort of tactics to make sales are sleezy and customers will figure it out eventually. All you can do is be honest and and fair and in the long run you will most likely win.

The easiest thing is by changing your ingredient list from "plam oil, lye, water, etc..." to "saponified palm oil, etc...". It's simple, it's honest and it gets around the word lye. But a simple tactic like that probably isn't going to stop a heckler, a good heckler will *always* find some reason to attack you. If the same person kept heckling me then I'd make a product nearly indentical to theirs, with nearly identical packaging and sell it for quarter the price they sell it for. If anyone asks why you sell it so cheap then let them know that "it's not as good a product as my other line", "it's made with less expensive ingredients than my other soaps" or that it's "more of a mass market product" but don't say a word about your competitor.

Paying some old lady to wear a Nun outfit and walk around telling people that she bought a bar of his soap and it had a razor blade in it couldn't hurt either (That was a joke!)!

 

[IrishLass]

Here's my dilemma. I have a co-worker who has severely sensitive skin and her dermatologist told her she has to use soap that is made WITHOUT sodium hydroxide or postassium hydroxide. She found a supplier (http://www.naturesbouquet.com) who told her their Vegetable soap base isn't made with either so she's been buying from them ever since and hasn't had a problem.

zeo

Zeo- it could very well be that your friend has specific skin sensitivities to pH. Soaps made with lye (whether store bought or handmade) are higher in pH than detergent-based soaps made mostly with surfacants like sodium laurel sulphate, etc..., so maybe that's why the problem went away when she switched soaps.

On an aside- what really bugs me is when people who write books completely run with the idea that lye based soap is bad for everyone just because it causes problems for a few with special sensitivities. That's like saying that strawberries are bad for everyone because so-and-so breaks out in a rash and can't breathe everytime he or she eats them, so stawberries must be poison!. No.... they are not poison or bad for everyone- it's just that so-and-so has a specific sensitivity to them that many, many others do not share in common with him or her.

I know I can't speak for everyone, for everyone's skin is different in what it likes and dislikes, but in defense of the humble and much maligned lye soap- my handmade lye soap has been very good to me and my family and friends, and we love it so much better than storebought.

One of the biggest proponents of my CP soap is a friend of mine who used to break out in rashes whenever she bathed with store-bought soap. Ever since she started using my handmade CP soap exclusively about a year and a half ago, her rashes completely cleared up and they haven't been back since. I didn't formulate my soap to anti-rash or anything- it's just regular CP made with vegetable and animal fats, but she covets my soap and she feels its like it's Christmas whenever I send her a care package.

Although her experience with my soap is a wonderful testimony that I cherish, I know all too well that not everyone will share the same experience with my soap that she does. But it's definitely goes to show that lye soap is not in any way bad for everyone like some seem to (mistakenly) insist upon.

IrishLass