Help figuring out a recipe free of allergens

[G. Man]

Hello, I'm trying to figure out a recipe using any of the following oils. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated

-Apricot oil
-grapeseed oil
-rice bran oil
-castor oil
-almond oil?

Can I make a decent CP soap using any combination from these oils? I'm making a soap for someone that is allergic to coconut, olive, canola, avocado, and sunflower :shock:. Any other suggestions or thoughts welcome. Thanks!

 

[judymoody]

Are you willing to use animal fats?

Rice bran oil is a reasonably good substitute for olive oil.

What about cocoa butter or shea butter to make the soap harder?

You could also try various additives (sugars/milks) to enhance lather.

 

[G. Man]

Thanks for the tips! I'm glad to hear the rice bran oil is a good substitution for olive.

I am open to using tallow.

I like the idea of the shea and cocoa butter for hardening the bar too.

With the options I have, what combinations would make the best bar of soap?

 

[Soapy Gurl]

What about palm and palm kernel? Palm kernel is a replacement for coconut oil.

 

[G. Man]

What about palm and palm kernel? Palm kernel is a replacement for coconut oil.

Well coconut comes from the palm tree so I'm avoiding palm oil also.

 

[debbism]

My bad for the response I just deleted from myself....I apparently missed some of the info.

The oils you listed are great oils but you would want a hard oil to balance it out....could you get some babasu oil? maybe mango, kokum or illipe butters?

 

[Hazel]

The only problem with substituting rice bran for olive is that it won't cure hard like olive.

I've used up to about 30% shea in a bar with almost an equal amount of apricot kernel oil. I also used babassu in it. It took longer to cure but eventually became very hard. You could use less shea and substitute some tallow in its place since shea costs more.

Personally, I wouldn't use this amount of shea again in soap. I'd rather use it for body butters or lotions. (I was low on supplies and really, really wanted to make a batch.) :wink:

 

[fiddletree]

30% shea makes a really lovely, hard soap. Some people are allergic to it, though, so make sure they are ok with it. 10% cocoa butter hardens up soap really nicely, as well (same with the allergy issues. Some folks have chocolate allergies). People who are ok with animal fats swear by tallow.

If you use just the oils you have above, you'll probably end up with a really soft soap. You'll want to watch your fatty acid profiles in soap calc (or whatever you use), and it's best to keep the Linoleic at under 15 to avoid DOS.

 

[G. Man]

Thanks for the reply's everyone.

So If I was to do 50% rice bran, 25% tallow, and 25% apricot I should have a decent bar of soap?
I haven't ran this through the lye calculator, but I will when I get a min.

I'm glad I checked with you guys, I probably would have ended up with a really soft bar of soap lol.

 

[judymoody]

Thanks for the reply's everyone.

So If I was to do 50% rice bran, 25% tallow, and 25% apricot I should have a decent bar of soap?
I haven't ran this through the lye calculator, but I will when I get a min.

I'm glad I checked with you guys, I probably would have ended up with a really soft bar of soap lol.

I assume you mean apricot kernel oil?

You might want to up your tallow to 30-40%, play around in soapcalc and see what looks good to you.

Also, palm oil trees and coconut trees are different species. They are both palm trees but produce different fruits and different oils. Palm and palm kernel are from the same tree but from different parts of the fruit (the flesh and the kernel/nut respectively).

 

[G. Man]

Yes, apricot kernel.

Thanks for the advice on the tallow. I will play around on the lye calculator.

I'm actually making this soap for my girlfriend. She just had her food sensitivity test done (this is different than a food allergy test for anaphylactic reactions which are immediate reactions). The sensitivity is a blood test, and you can react to these foods up to 3 days later. Any chronic health condition could be a food sensitivity. She was tested for 200 foods, 50 functional foods and medicinal herbs, 10 food additives, and 10 food colorings. 270 in total. She had been consistently sick, one cold after another, and finally decided to spend the $700+ for this test. She's been mostly free of these allergens for about 2 weeks and feels better than she has in years. We have been worried about the palm because it's relationship to the coconut. Some people might have an issue. After some reading today though, I think palm would be fine especially for external use.

So if I'm able to use palm, how would I ratio that in? Can I replace the tallow with palm?

 

[dirrdee]

I had that testing done too. I thought maybe I had celiacs, but after the allergy testing I eliminated those foods I was sensitive to and viola! no more problems (well at least almost no problems). Its kind of a drag tho cause I cant eat chicken anymore, and I used to eat it all the time

 

[Hazel]

So if I'm able to use palm, how would I ratio that in? Can I replace the tallow with palm?

You can use palm to replace tallow and palm kernel to replace coconut.

I’m not an expert soapmaker but I played around on soapcalc and came up with this recipe. I thought it seemed like it might make a nice soap. I don’t have RBO, PKO or AKO so I can’t make it to see how it might turn out. However, if I had these oils, I would definitely try it because I liked the values. This might give you a starting point to figure out what you might want to do.

I think this might need a longer curing time since Palm is the only oil which is going to help with hardness. Also, maybe someone would be kind and give an opinion on this recipe.

15% Apricot Kernel Oil
35% Palm Oil
25% Palm Kernel Oil
15% Rice Bran Oil
10% Castor Oil

Hardness 41
Cleansing 17
Conditioning 56
Bubbly 26
Creamy 33
Iodine 64
INS 141

Lauric 12
Myristic 5
Palmitic 22
Stearic 3
Ricinoleic 9
Oleic 34
Linoleic 13
Linolenic 0

 

[G. Man]

dirrdee- Glad you figured out your problem, that's excellent. We just barely had the test done and have good results so far. It is really hard to grocery shop lol, but whatever it takes.

Hazel- I like that recipe, and thanks for going to so much trouble. My problem is I have a hard enough time finding palm oil, let alone palm kernel oil. I don't buy on-line, so that's probably why haha. Do you know anywhere that would sell it? I doubt the grocery stores would have it, but open to suggestions.

 

[Hazel]

I'm not sure if groceries would have palm oil. You could check in the aisle where they have the Asian food. Do you have a WalMart near you? I came up with this recipe but I'm not happy with it. I don't know how the lather would turn out or how nice of a soap it would make.

15% Apricot Kernel Oil
35% Tallow
25% Walmart GV Shortening (beef tallow, palm)
15% Rice Bran Oil
10% Castor Oil


I also tried this combo but again I don't know how it will turn out.

15% Apricot Kernel Oil
63% Tallow
15% Rice Bran Oil
7% Castor Oil

or

15% Apricot Kernel Oil
60% Tallow
15% Rice Bran Oil
10% Castor Oil

I don't know what else to suggest. Also, you don't really want to trust my suggeted recipes because the percentages could be wildly off the mark for a nice soap. Hopefully an experienced soaper will see this thread and have some suggestions.

Is there a reason you don't buy online? I buy oils from Columbus Foods/Soaperschoice and they're reasonably priced.

http://www.soaperschoice.com/

 

[Kansas Farm Girl]

I have found palm oil in organic grocery stores sold as organic shortening. Check Crisco, some of it has palm oil, but the bars seem fairly soft. You would need to check the other oils in it to see if your friend can use it. I do like beef tallow in my soap. If I can't get that, then lard. Lard is easier for me to get locally, unless I render the tallow myself.

 

[Lilahblossom]

I would go with the tallow. And don't add much fragrance as some people are sensitive to that too. I would think that non virgin olive oil would give a nice fragrance and add that to the soap as an add on? It would give color as well? Less is more with allergies. Just a thought.

 

[G. Man]

I don't buy on-line because I don't have a bank, so no credit/debit cards lol. If I ever really get into this I will buying online though. You just can't find what you need locally, without spending a fortune.

I think I'm going to try a rice bran, apricot kernel, and palm oil combo. I just need to get on the lye calculator and figure out percentages.

But right now I'm going to make a olive, coconut, palm soap. With anise EO for scent, and charcoal for color. Licorice anyone?

 

[desarae19]

I think it would be worth looking into getting a visa/mc or amex gift card that you can load/reload.

The savings of buying at a good supplier are worth it. And you don't need a bank for gift cards... and can find several options at most grocery stores/walmart

 

[G. Man]

Quick question....

I found a silicone baking pan, and have never used one of these. Do I need to coat it with oil or anything? Or just pour it in? Thanks!