Failed Infinity Swirl - suggestions?

[Grantxw8]

Hi Everyone,

I have a few batches of soap under my belt since I returned to soap making. I've been watching a few YouTube videos for inspiration and thought I'd try something new (to me). I've done a few batches in the past with swirls but never anything intricate. Anyway, I set up a loaf mould with 2 longitudinal dividers ready to pour 3 sections of colours. My plan was to try a "Infinity Swirl".

My method was as follows:

• Mix/melt oils
• Make Lye solution
  • moderate discount of water; 2:1 ratio.
• Measure fragrance oil (Mango from Escentials of Australia ) @ 3%
• Add lye to oils
• Stick blend briefly to emulsion
• Add fragrance and stick blend briefly
• Split batter into 3rds
• Add 3 different colours, 1 to each ⅓ (same brand of water-based colour diluted into 10ml water)
• Stick blend/stir to thin trace
• Pour each ⅓ into its section of the mould. (By the time i was doing the 3rd one it was thickening up)
• Remove the dividers and use a wooden skewer to perform the figure-8/infinity swirl
• Cover and insulate

After 2 days I un-moulded the soap. I was very interested to see the results of the swirl. However, each of the 3 sections of soap was a completely different consistency. One was super soft, one was normal and the 3rd was chalky. Despite this, I tried cutting it into bars, mostly to see the pattern.

This is the mould that I used:

These are photos of the results:

My main concern is to find out what went wrong! I don't want to repeat my mistake. I am baffled about why each of these is so different.

Any and all advice gratefully received.

 

[KiwiMoose]

Did you cut it the right way? I can't actually see any swirl at all, but you would have seen that at the time of swirling if there was no swirl, surely? What tool did you use for the swirl? Maybe it was too thin? Maybe better to try a chopstick or similar. I can't actually figure out what happened here TBH.

 

[Blufuz]

What colors did you use for each third? You mentioned they reached trace at different speeds, and then ended up different levels of softness; was the chalky one the one that reached trace fastest?

 

[Grantxw8]

Hi Guys,

I ran out of time to play with this batch. I thought I'd have infinite time when I retired but that's not how it's turning out. I did my first ever rebatch by popping it all in a pot and cooking it for a while. I had to sieve it to get the gritty bits out but otherwise it went as expected. According to my litmus paper it is ph8 so I'll leave it for a while and try it on my skin once it's a little harder.

Apologies for not responding sooner but... life.

 

[AliOop]

@Grantxw8 glad you were able to successfully rebatch.

FYI re pH testing: the strips are notoriously inaccurate, often indicating several points lower than the real pH value. Your results showing pH of 8 are a perfect example, bc true soap is going to start separating into a blobby mess of fatty acids when the pH goes below 9.

Also, pH testing does not tell you whether the soap is lye-heavy (the reason most people think they need to test). The zap test is a more accurate measure of that. Here is a great article that explains more about this.

 

[Grantxw8]

@Grantxw8 glad you were able to successfully rebatch.

FYI re pH testing: the strips are notoriously inaccurate, often indicating several points lower than the real pH value. Your results showing pH of 8 are a perfect example, bc true soap is going to start separating into a blobby mess of fatty acids when the pH goes below 9.

Also, pH testing does not tell you whether the soap is lye-heavy (the reason most people think they need to test). The zap test is a more accurate measure of that. Here is a great article that explains more about this.

@AliOop That's a great article - if a little depressing. My reading of it can be summed up as - "don't bother ph testing your soap as the results are meaningless". Instead we should just do the 'zap-test'. It at least tells us if the soap is lye heavy.

To be honest, my colour perception is not great (especially green/blue) so there's a bit of guesswork in my reading the litmus paper strips. I got my wife to look at a repeated test and she said it indicated ph9 this time. Just another inaccuracy to add to the list.

Good news though; the zap test says this batch is fine.

 

[dmcgee5034]

I’m still curious about the cause of the different consistency of your batch, @Grantxw8. Was it different in each color or a different sections of the loaf? If it was the colors, what colors did you use?

 

[ScentimentallyYours]

Has anyone used high ph testing kits used by aquarium hobbyists? (Yes, I tried that before.) My thought was that dissolving soap in distilled water and then using solution to test ph would give more accurate results than strips. My DH the geologist, who performed water testing for his work, supervised my process. If memory serves, the soap had a ph of about 8. I performed the zap test prior to testing for ph, but I was still curious to see a number result. It’s a good thing I’m not a cat, or I’d be dead.*


*Curiosity would have killed me long ago!

 

[ScentimentallyYours]

each of the 3 sections of soap was a completely different consistency. One was super soft, one was normal and the 3rd was chalky.

This sounds like your ratios of oils to lye got mixed up when splitting the three section of soap. The super soft section was short on lye, the chalky one lye heavy. Is the chalky layer zappy?

 

[Grantxw8]

This sounds like your ratios of oils to lye got mixed up when splitting the three section of soap. The super soft section was short on lye, the chalky one lye heavy. Is the chalky layer zappy?

Interesting. I’d agree if I’d split the oils and Lye before combining each with a colour. However, I combined the oils and lye then added the fragrance before splitting to colour each jug then pouring. I’ll check the colours again in case I stuffed something up. I’m 90% sure I’ve used them before without an issue.

Confused.

 

[ScentimentallyYours]

Interesting. I’d agree if I’d split the oils and Lye before combining each with a colour. However, I combined the oils and lye then added the fragrance before splitting to colour each jug then pouring. I’ll check the colours again in case I stuffed something up. I’m 90% sure I’ve used them before without an issue.

Confused.

Was that batch at full emulsion or light trace before you split them? Could your batter have separated as you split them?

I get nervous splitting soap batter at emulsion instead of very light trace.

 

[AliOop]

My experience (take that FWIW) is that the chalkiness usually comes from one of two things:

1. Using sodium lactate (which perhaps settled in one part of the batch more than another), or
2. My trace was too thin to remain stable when I poured.

I rarely get chalkiness anymore now. I stopped using SL for the most part in my CP soaps (still use it in HP and other non-soap formulas), and I also gel all my soaps using a heating pad under the molds. I find this much easier than using an oven to CPOP, and it definitely helps the soap batter remain more uniform after pouring, especially if I did pour at thin trace or just at emulsion. HTH!

 

[Grantxw8]

I think this could be the issue. I don’t do complicated colour swirls as a rule. This was me trying something new for me and I knew I’d need time to get it all done. I probably split the batter too early and/or was inconsistent in how I treated each ‘split’ in terms of trace. I don’t use Sodium Lactate and I only sometimes force gel on a heating pad.

The good news is I’m learning from it thanks to you guys.

I have no idea how someone can have time to pour six, seven, or eight colours. I can’t manage 3 consistently. I’m fairly controlled in my temperatures. Always mixing oils and lye at 40 - 42 centigrade. Perhaps that’s too hot for the complicated stuff? My recipe contains, in order of quantity, olive oil, palm oil, coconut oil, shea butter, and castor oil so I feel I should keep it around this temp to keep the solid oils/butter melted.

 

[Shelley D]

I think this could be the issue. I don’t do complicated colour swirls as a rule. This was me trying something new for me and I knew I’d need time to get it all done. I probably split the batter too early and/or was inconsistent in how I treated each ‘split’ in terms of trace. I don’t use Sodium Lactate and I only sometimes force gel on a heating pad.

The good news is I’m learning from it thanks to you guys.

I have no idea how someone can have time to pour six, seven, or eight colours. I can’t manage 3 consistently. I’m fairly controlled in my temperatures. Always mixing oils and lye at 40 - 42 centigrade. Perhaps that’s too hot for the complicated stuff? My recipe contains, in order of quantity, olive oil, palm oil, coconut oil, shea butter, and castor oil so I feel I should keep it around this temp to keep the solid oils/butter melted.

Personally, I am fascinated by it, artistically speaking, but as a soaper I avoid it because I avoid dyes and colorants due to allergies and skin issues.
That being said, there is thread where the gang discussed how to achieve fluidity for longer periods to achieve the more detailed patterns of layers and/or swirls. Perhaps someone has that link?