My largest project so far: 5.62 kilo (12.4 lbs.) double batch of soap batter

[Jorah]

Over the long weekend I built a wooden soap mold that will hold about 40 bars of soap (depending on thickness of the bar cut) and I was eager to try it out, so on Monday I made a twin batch, one of pure lard and one of pure tallow, The total batter weight was 5.6 kilos, and I took it out of the mold & cut it this morning. I'm very pleased with the mold and the two test batches; the tallow in particular looks great.

The mold just as I finished working on it.



Showing my first attempt at a freezer-paper lining.


The lid! I'm glad I was able to make this lid up with scraps from the project, it worked out great.



The double batch, revealed as I took the side of the mold off to release the loaf.



Prying the loaves apart (I poured them one after the other and put a layer of freezer paper between them)


The lard bars. I crinkle-cut these so I wouldn't get them mixed up with the tallow bars.


The tallow bars, cut with a wire cutter to 7/8" thickness.


(By the way; can anyone tell me the right gauge wire to use? The .022 I bought is far too fragile.)

If you're curious about the recipe, here you go:

Component	Grams​
Tallow (Beef)	1,925​
	​
	​
Total Oil	1,925​
	​
Sodium Lactate	4 tsp​
Water	560​
Lye	252​

 

[AliOop]

You soaps look great! I love single-color plain soaps - they have such an elegance about them. I love that you made your own molds, too. My DH has made a few soap tools for me, and I cherish them.

Regarding your questions, here are my thoughts:

1. The 22 gauge wire is the correct size. You may not have tightened the wire enough, or (more likely) you are waiting too long to cut the soap. There is no specific time to wait; soap is ready to cut when the loaf is firm to the touch, with just a bit of give when pressed. The most common comparison is the feel of a fridge-cold block of cheddar cheese. The hardness of tallow makes it particularly important to cut as soon as possible, or you will have trouble. My 100% tallow soap is typically ready to cut within 12-18 hours, max. It may or may not still be warm at that time.

2. No need to use sodium lactate with 100% tallow bars. They will be more than hard enough without that. This could also be contributing to your difficulty with cutting. EDIT: for recipes where you do use SL, consider switching to a percentage of oils, rather than teaspoons. For someone who is selling, it is particularly important to be able to scale up and down by percentages, so your batches are more consistent.

3. Since you are in the testing stage, consider making smaller batches. There is a lot of financial loss if something goes wrong with larger batches.

 

[BWt]

Agree with @AliOop. Your soaps are lovely. And your handmade box is amazing. I make 100% tallow soap for my grandson. Did add a bit of white hand spun alpaca yarn into the lye solution just to see if it would affect the soap. It did not discolor the soap. Not sure if it contributed to lather however lather was amazing.
Going to check out making my own soap box. Yours is so marvelous!!!

 

[Jorah]

You soaps look great! I love single-color plain soaps - they have such an elegance about them. I love that you made your own molds, too. My DH has made a few soap tools for me, and I cherish them.

Regarding your questions, here are my thoughts:

1. The 22 gauge wire is the correct size. You may not have tightened the wire enough, or (more likely) you are waiting too long to cut the soap. There is no specific time to wait; soap is ready to cut when the loaf is firm to the touch, with just a bit of give when pressed. The most common comparison is the feel of a fridge-cold block of cheddar cheese. The hardness of tallow makes it particularly important to cut as soon as possible, or you will have trouble. My 100% tallow soap is typically ready to cut within 12-18 hours, max. It may or may not still be warm at that time.

2. No need to use sodium lactate with 100% tallow bars. They will be more than hard enough without that. This could also be contributing to your difficulty with cutting. EDIT: for recipes where you do use SL, consider switching to a percentage of oils, rather than teaspoons. For someone who is selling, it is particularly important to be able to scale up and down by percentages, so your batches are more consistent.

3. Since you are in the testing stage, consider making smaller batches. There is a lot of financial loss if something goes wrong with larger batches.

Thanks, Ali

The trouble I'm having with the wire I got is that it breaks as I'm starting to tighten it, even a little.

Thanks for the tip on the lactate; I thought the hardness scale on the pure lard looked a little soft, so I added that on a hunch. I need to convert from teaspoons to grams, it's on my to-do list (which gets longer every day).

This batch is huge for a beginner, I know, but I wanted to see what making a massive batch was like, since I'm planning to turn this into a business sooner than later, and I'll need to make 40-100 a day at times if this works out. Besides, that mold was crying out to be used.

And your handmade box is amazing.

Going to check out making my own soap box. Yours is so marvelous!!!

Thanks! Let me know if you want any details on how I built it. I tried to keep it dead simple but I used to do carpentry for a living, so 'dead simple' may mean different things for us!

 

[AliOop]

The trouble I'm having with the wire I got is that it breaks as I'm starting to tighten it, even a little.

Hmm, I agree, that doesn't sound right. Is the wire being tightened across something that is bending it too sharply, i.e, a sharp metal edge somewhere, rather than a rounded one? If not, you may have some bad wire. Is there any play in the wire? If not, it is tight enough already, and the issue was probably letting the tallow soap get too hard before cutting it (esp with SL in your recipe).

If you'd like a starting percentage, SL is typically used at 1% to 3% of oils. A very general rule of thumb would be to use the lower end for hard fats, and the higher end for liquid oils. However, it really isn't needed at all for 100% lard, tallow, or CO bars - they firm up quite well on their own, and tend to unmold very cleanly, too.

Since you plan to sell, I'd recommend trying your soap without it and see what you think. Eliminating unnecessary ingredients will reduce costs, simplify your labels, and appeal to buyers looking for the most "natural" soaps - including those who might have a knee-jerk reaction to ingredients with which they are unfamiliar.

Oh, and I totally get the thrill of trying out new tools. That's how I ended up with a YUGE amount of round soaps, after the DH made me some cylinder molds out of ABS pipe, and a wood stand to hold them at the perfect height for me to pour into them. I think it was a total of 7lbs of soap before I had him trim them down to something more manageable! When you are ready to do round soaps, definitely check out the ABS pipe, with an end cap or tester cap. It's so much better than the flimsy and small cylinder molds out there, and should be a piece of cake for someone with your skills.

 

[cmzaha]

As much as I usually agree with Ali I have to disagree with her on additives. I sold all over So Cal for over 11 yrs and sold a lot of soap with additives such as EDTA and Sodium Gluconate, Palm Oil, and lard soap in a Crunch area. Some additives simply make better soap. Never once were my ingredients other than once or twice palm questioned. Then the customers ended up buying the soap. I cannot answer how folks feel about SL because I never used it, I soaped with vinegar to help with demolding in just a few hrs and my recipes were either high palm with shea or high tallow/lard mix so they were hard long-lasting recipes to start with. My soaps were fully labeled and the EDTA/Sodium Gluconate was labeled as a chelator.

Granted it took me a few years to build my customer base and I wish you the best of luck, this is not a business to support families, although my daughter did it for a few years back when started. But it ended after about 4 yrs, too much DIY. My husband and I used it for retirement supplement and entertainment, but we also did not depend on just selling soap to make money.

BTW 100% Tallow soap will not lather well without an approx 6-month cure time and will lather better if you soap 95/5% NaOH/KOH also with a low superfat.

 

[AliOop]

@cmzaha I actually agree with you about the additives not being a big issue for some clientele. However, I've had folks question it even here in Idaho, which isn't the most "crunchy" crowd by any means. Once I explain that it's basically just salt water, they are fine with it.

Regardless, if you don't need an additive, it is silly to spend money on it. Better to design hardness into the recipe, as you did.

 

[Jorah]

Hmm, I agree, that doesn't sound right. Is the wire being tightened across something that is bending it too sharply, i.e, a sharp metal edge somewhere, rather than a rounded one? If not, you may have some bad wire. Is there any play in the wire? If not, it is tight enough already, and the issue was probably letting the tallow soap get too hard before cutting it (esp with SL in your recipe).

I haven't broken a wire yet while cutting a fresh loaf (one, foolishly, I broke on an older bar). The loaf I cut today with a wire cutter was about 10 hours old, and firm enough to handle while fresh enough to cut easily. The wire I broke on the hard loaf is the one I've been trying to replace. I think that part of the problem is the design of the cutter; it doesn't use guitar tuning pegs, but bolts with nuts to tighten on the wire, and you're right; there are many hard edges. I may have to write it off and invest in a better cutter.

 

[cmzaha]

@cmzaha I actually agree with you about the additives not being a big issue for some clientele. However, I've had folks question it even here in Idaho, which isn't the most "crunchy" crowd by any means. Once I explain that it's basically just salt water, they are fine with it.

Regardless, if you don't need an additive, it is silly to spend money on it. Better to design hardness into the recipe, as you did.

But we know chelators are great for stopping soap scum. I never used SL and only used vinegar so I could unmold it quicker and white vinegar is cheap. I usually pulled from my molds in 8-12 hrs sometimes less.

 

[AliOop]

But we know chelators are great for stopping soap scum. I never used SL and only used vinegar so I could unmold it quicker and white vinegar is cheap. I usually pulled from my molds in 8-12 hrs sometimes less.

Totally agree on the chelators - they are 100% worth the money, as well as the extra discussions with customers to teach them why those ingredients are needed.

But... I'm just not sold on adding SL to 100% tallow bars. IME, they don't need the extra hardening, and in fact, they may become too brittle with SL.

Plus, you know I'm with you on Team Vinegar as the secret weapon for quick hardening/unmolding, plus nicer-feeling lather.

 

[BWt]

I haven't broken a wire yet while cutting a fresh loaf (one, foolishly, I broke on an older bar). The loaf I cut today with a wire cutter was about 10 hours old, and firm enough to handle while fresh enough to cut easily. The wire I broke on the hard loaf is the one I've been trying to replace. I think that part of the problem is the design of the cutter; it doesn't use guitar tuning pegs, but bolts with nuts to tighten on the wire, and you're right; there are many hard edges. I may have to write it off and invest in a better cutter.

Is it possible to replace the bolts with tuning pegs?

 

[Savage Daughter]

Plus, you know I'm with you on Team Vinegar as the secret weapon for quick hardening/unmolding, plus nicer-feeling lather.

Something I have not yet run across...what percentage of vinegar are you using? Have you tried vinegar in conjunction with sugar or honey? If so, what were the results?

I am very curious about this!

 

[AliOop]

Something I have not yet run across...what percentage of vinegar are you using? Have you tried vinegar in conjunction with sugar or honey? If so, what were the results?

I am very curious about this!

Before I started master-batching my lye solution, I used white vinegar as 100% of my liquid.

Now I use 50% vinegar when I do use it, which is not as often bc I hate doing the extra lye math, lol. The SMF soap calc doesn’t work well when you use both MB lye and vinegar in the same batch. Individually it’s great, but not both in one batch, unfortunately.

I tried ACV; it darkened the soap but otherwise worked the same as white vinegar. The soap hardens sooner, releases very cleanly from the mold, and has an extra-nice lather feel (to me anyway - not everyone agrees on that).

 

[Savage Daughter]

Before I started master-batching my lye solution, I used white vinegar as 100% of my liquid.

Now I use 50% vinegar when I do use it, which is not as often bc I hate doing the extra lye math, lol. The SMF soap calc doesn’t work well when you use both MB lye and vinegar in the same batch. Individually it’s great, but not both in one batch, unfortunately.

I tried ACV; it darkened the soap but otherwise worked the same as white vinegar. The soap hardens sooner, releases very cleanly from the mold, and has an extra-nice lather feel (to me anyway - not everyone agrees on that).

Yep, just got put on my to-do list of test soap batches I need to make!

So it's possible to use 100% vinegar without recalculating the lye?? Is it possible to simply replace half of my water with vinegar since I'm not masterbatching lye? I am super fascinated by this!

Does the vinegar affect colorants at all? Some people use vinegar as a mordant when dying fabric with plant materials. Good lord....I am going to have to try soaking some of my natural colorants in 100% white vinegar! This is exciting!

How much of a smell of the vinegar remains after unmolding if using 100%? To what degree does it dissipate as it cures? Even the smell of raw apple cider vinegar could be used as an unspoken marketing tool, although it would no longer be 'raw' after the heat generated when soap is gelling.

Are there any downsides to using vinegar?

I don't masterbatch lye, and likely won't, so I would like to try the 100% vinegar in place of water. Raw apple cider vinegar, most likely, but would try white as well just for comparison's sake. I'm thinking that with the addition of a decent amount of kaolin that the color would be a soft caramel, which can be used to my advantage in various designs

Thank you so much!

Agree with @AliOop. Your soaps are lovely. And your handmade box is amazing. I make 100% tallow soap for my grandson. Did add a bit of white hand spun alpaca yarn into the lye solution just to see if it would affect the soap. It did not discolor the soap. Not sure if it contributed to lather however lather was amazing.
Going to check out making my own soap box. Yours is so marvelous!!!

What do you find the wool does for your soap? I'm curious because one of my customers produces wool every year. Are you using the raw wool (cleaned of course), before it's skeined (if that's the proper term)? Something I would like to try. My testing list gets longer & longer

 

[AliOop]

So it's possible to use 100% vinegar without recalculating the lye?? Is it possible to simply replace half of my water with vinegar since I'm not masterbatching lye? I am super fascinated by this!

Sorry, I didn’t mean to confuse you about the lye. You always have to recalculate the lye no matter how much vinegar you use.

The issue for me is that I use the Soapmaking Friend lye calculator. It will do the vinegar-lye calculation for me IF I am not also using MB lye solution. It will not do the calculation for me if I use both vinegar and MB lye solution.

I am very good at math concepts, but often transpose numbers when actually calculating. So it is not good for me to add in separate maths outside the calculator. Since I mostly use MB lye solution, that’s gotten me away from using vinegar very much.

The problem would be easy to solve. I could make myself a little chart for each batch size I normally use, that tells me how much extra lye I’d need if I sub in vinegar for half my water. Just haven’t done it yet.

Anyway, since you don’t use MB lye, you can simply do one calculation for the extra lye needed for whatever amount of vinegar you decide to use. Or if you use SMF, you can tell the program to do it for you.

ACV will definitely change your soap color; white vinegar will not. Neither will leave any smell at all in your soap.

 

[Savage Daughter]

Sorry, I didn’t mean to confuse you about the lye. You always have to recalculate the lye no matter how much vinegar you use.

The issue for me is that I use the Soapmaking Friend lye calculator. It will do the vinegar-lye calculation for me IF I am not also using MB lye solution. It will not do the calculation for me if I use both vinegar and MB lye solution.

I am very good at math concepts, but often transpose numbers when actually calculating. So it is not good for me to add in separate maths outside the calculator. Since I mostly use MB lye solution, that’s gotten me away from using vinegar very much.

The problem would be easy to solve. I could make myself a little chart for each batch size I normally use, that tells me how much extra lye I’d need if I sub in vinegar for half my water. Just haven’t done it yet.

Anyway, since you don’t use MB lye, you can simply do one calculation for the extra lye needed for whatever amount of vinegar you decide to use. Or if you use SMF, you can tell the program to do it for you.

ACV will definitely change your soap color; white vinegar will not. Neither will leave any smell at all in your soap.

Awesome, thanks so much for the response This is clearly something I need to look into more.

 

[gunnyblu]

Sorry, I didn’t mean to confuse you about the lye. You always have to recalculate the lye no matter how much vinegar you use.

The issue for me is that I use the Soapmaking Friend lye calculator. It will do the vinegar-lye calculation for me IF I am not also using MB lye solution. It will not do the calculation for me if I use both vinegar and MB lye solution.

I am very good at math concepts, but often transpose numbers when actually calculating. So it is not good for me to add in separate maths outside the calculator. Since I mostly use MB lye solution, that’s gotten me away from using vinegar very much.

The problem would be easy to solve. I could make myself a little chart for each batch size I normally use, that tells me how much extra lye I’d need if I sub in vinegar for half my water. Just haven’t done it yet.

Anyway, since you don’t use MB lye, you can simply do one calculation for the extra lye needed for whatever amount of vinegar you decide to use. Or if you use SMF, you can tell the program to do it for you.

ACV will definitely change your soap color; white vinegar will not. Neither will leave any smell at all in your soap.

Could you show me how to do the calculation for vinegar only? I don't want to MB lye solution.

 

[Zing]

Good God, Man, quit showing us up!! It's not enough that you're making all these fancy soaps -- but you make your own molds too?! Just kidding. I don't know how I missed this. I like simple, elegant white bars. Those look nice.

Speaking of fancy soaps.... You're new around here. Have we shared our theme song with you yet?!

Never gets old for me!

 

[Jorah]

Don't worry, if I hold true to my normal pattern I will fade at the six-year mark. No matter what success I have, I always fade at the 6 year mark...

So that gives me until April Fool's Day 2029...

 

[Jorah]

Speaking of fancy soaps.... You're new around here. Have we shared our theme song with you yet?!

Never gets old for me!

I love the video!