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Discussion in 'SMF Announcements, Comments, Help & Rules' started by penelopejane, Mar 13, 2019.

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  1. Mar 15, 2019 #21

    penelopejane

    penelopejane

    penelopejane

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    Dean,
    There were two issues with the closure of the thread.

    One was OT posts.
    I think that an OT (off topic post) is considered to be any post not directly referring to (in this case) Pure Castile (100% OO) soap. So posts referring to using the soda bicarb and Almond oil might be considered to be OT.

    This doesn't bother me but it obviously bothers Zany.
    OT posts can't be deleted by anyone but the original poster of that post.
    All the original poster of the thread can do is to request that the thread be closed down.
    Hence, Zany requested some posters to remove their posts and start another thread.
     
  2. Mar 15, 2019 #22

    IrishLass

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    For what it's worth, The SMF Rules state this in Rule #5 in regard to staying on topic:

    5 - Staying On Topic – It is not unusual for a thread to sometimes stray a little, but valid responses to questions that cover points or areas that were not implied in the original question but have an appropriate relationship/connection to it, are allowed, as long as the responses are generally relevant. If the responses are not generally relevant/completely unrelated altogether, it is naturally acceptable for the original poster to steer it back on course or suggest a new thread be started to address the unrelated matters. But if generally relevant answers are being offered, it is considered bad form of the person asking the original question to dictate what the responses should be. Such 'dictatorship' will not be tolerated.


    IrishLass :)
     
  3. Mar 15, 2019 #23

    Ravens Craig Apothecary

    Ravens Craig Apothecary

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    If I have offended anyone by trailing off topic or posting on old threads or the wrong threads i do apologize.... I can barely figure out how to post on here and sometimes cant figure out how to start a new thread. In my defense, I am a survivor of Transient Global Amnesia and a small stroke, so on certain days I cant even figure out my socks lol. Please bear with me because I love it here. That is the main reason I dont post often- I dont know if I am doing it correctly. Everyone seems so experienced and I am kinda fumbling :)
     
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  4. Mar 15, 2019 #24

    Steve85569

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    I am tempted to hijack this thread....



    :nodding::beatinghead::rolling:
     
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  5. Mar 15, 2019 #25

    Susie

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    I think if one objectively looks at most of the truly helpful threads, the really helpful bits start at the OT part of it. I don't think this is an accident. I think the most helpful threads start where someone says, "Yes, but...". Just sayin'.
     
  6. Mar 15, 2019 #26

    amd

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    I don't have a problem with OT posts that are soap related - especially if it's generated from the original post idea. Someone coming in and asking an unrelated question is hijacking, not OT. The OT posts that I find troublesome are the back and forths about David Cassidy and the Partridge family (or whatever nonsense that was that happened recently in another thread) that carries on for half a page or more. Yes, I get that some are here to forge friendships with like minded people - and I have certainly made my own friendships here as well - but some things are better left to PM's or a general chat thread - again, link up what sparked the connection to the Partridge family, but don't keep it in a soapmaking thread. Not all of us are interested in reading through it and wondering if the thread ever gets back to soapmaking - Oh, look at that it did! Oh, no wait... the nonsoapy stuff is back.

    Sorry if I come across as a grumpy old man yelling at the neighborhood kids to stay off his lawn. I just wanted to state that there are two types of OT posts, and no one should be second guessing an OT post for the greater soapy good.
     
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  7. Mar 15, 2019 #27

    dibbles

    dibbles

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    ^^^ this. @amd I so agree with you, and I can't say it any better.
     
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  8. Mar 15, 2019 #28

    cmzaha

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    Whew, I am so glad I never posted in the No Slime thread, since sometimes I get a bit OT, heck I get OT in my own threads at times, and just do not mind it generally. Although I do agree the videos and the very off topic tend to be bothersome. A video directly relating to a topic does not bother me, such as the video for making M&P posted in the threads for making m&p by scratch. ;)
     
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  9. Mar 15, 2019 #29

    Dean

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    “The OT posts that I find troublesome are the back andforths about David Cassidy and the Partridgefamily (or whatever nonsense that was thathappened recently in another thread) that carries on for half a page or more.“

    OMG those OTs were the absolute worse! I’m just spittin’ mad bout that too. If only SMF had a fx to report those vile rule-breakers, I could get off the complain-train and back to soaping.
     
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  10. Mar 15, 2019 #30

    amd

    amd

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    ^^This is exactly the abuse that should be reported. I'm less inclined more than ever to participate in this forum, directly related to this user's continued attacks towards me.
     
  11. Mar 15, 2019 #31

    Steve85569

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    If my post in this thread offended anyone please do accept my apologies.
    My only intent was to try and "lighten up" the thread that I felt was getting a bit intense.

    My apologies.
     
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  12. Mar 15, 2019 #32

    Dahila

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    yep it discouraged me too
     
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  13. Mar 15, 2019 #33

    dibbles

    dibbles

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    I think you are fine, Steve. Your intent was clear, at least to me, and gave me a good laugh. I think there is room for a bit of this kind of thing.
     
  14. Mar 15, 2019 #34

    amd

    amd

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    It was a great mood lightener - quick to the point and much needed. It also did not disparage anyone else or make insinuating insults. There is a time and place for this type of humor, and you Sir have learned it well. Others... not so much...
     
  15. Mar 15, 2019 #35

    Hendejm

    Hendejm

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    For what it’s worth - I don’t mind OT comments in a thread. I can quickly scroll through information/posts that don’t interest me or aren’t relevant. I can also skip to the end to see if it’s got back on track. All takes only seconds.

    I find the practice of closing and deleting threads particularly offensive. It would seem that if you post something that someone doesn’t like - you get censored by deletion or locking of thread. Rules seem to have written and enforced to further a particular agenda and in the light of contradiction - you can be banned or throttled (I speak from first hand experience on multiple occasions).

    As long as we are not attacking each other verbally, are staying on topic as it relates to Soaping - all points of view should be encouraged. That is not been my experience.

    I never posted in Zany’s thread - but if I had I would have probably gone off topic at some point. Some of my greatest learnings have been as a result of OT conversations. It’s a conversation - 2 two sided (or more) discussion. People are going to disagree. That should be what makes this forum great. As of late - I fear it is going down the road of a dictatorship and of a particular point of view to the detriment of everyone.

    Deleting or locking threads simply because someone doesn’t like it or takes offense should not be allowed in my opinion. We aren’t 6 years old where everyone gets a participation trophy. I would like to see people lighten up and just relax...a bit. Aren’t we here to enjoy the craft/art of soaping?

    And to add: we all have the ability to block or ignore posters that we don’t want to see. If someone’s content offends or bothers us - simply click “ignore” in their profile and we don’t need to see their comments. Easy and sell-policing and problem solved
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 16, 2019 at 11:46 PM
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  16. Mar 15, 2019 #36

    Dean

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    AMD dahling, u must have misread my post! I clearly was referring to myself. You certainly must know that I’m ur number one fan. No one is as creative with recipie formulation as u. Who else could think of making breast milk and snake skin soap? Ingenious! Some may think thats a lil odd but not us soapers. ;) Whoops...I fear that I’ve slid OT again. Appologies! :)
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2019 at 12:15 AM
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  17. Mar 15, 2019 #37

    Hendejm

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    Here, here!! Agree on all counts!!
     
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  18. Mar 16, 2019 at 12:33 AM #38

    cmzaha

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    Not sure but I think I was one of the first here to make Mommy Soap with the milk. Approx 3 years ago. Sorry OT...and this is how it happens;):eek:
     
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  19. Mar 20, 2019 at 7:20 AM #39

    Zany_in_CO

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    Okay Peeps, I'm late to the party, but better late than never. So here’s where things went awry:

    I asked Admin/Mods to edit Post #1 at the top with the words, "This thread is locked. Copy the link and add it to the beginning of a new thread where you can ask questions or share your experience. Thank you." ... or something along those lines."

    The actual post by Admin/Mod was worded differently. I can’t remember if it included the word “Hijack” or not, but the real reason for closing the thread was quite benign. The thread had reached 16 pages – long enough – all the bases had pretty much been covered.

    Unfortunately, it was about to take a turn and become uber long, in my estimation, when PJ introduced the topic of “Castile Cure Time”. PJ's comment about "9-12 months cure time for castile" was well intentioned. She meant it to be helpful, but it simply isn’t true IME (in my experience) and is a debate that I think needs to be moved to another thread where all interested parties can contribute.

    Also there was a discussion about Dawni’s experiments using “Faux Sea Water in formulas other than No Slime Castile”. Both were topics of interest that merited their own threads, to my mind at least -- where others could learn, comment and contribute -- and most importantly, find again without having to go through upteen pages.

    My mistake was having the Lock Notice inserted into Post #1 instead of at the end where PJ and Dawni would see it! Not "hostile" at all. Had it been done so, it would have saved a lot of aggravation. Due to my current circumstances, I'm sorry I'm not able to be on the Forum every day... the brouhaha was well out of hand before I even learned what was going on. What a mess.

    Lesson learned: If you're going to close a thread, post the notice at the end, not the beginning.
     
  20. Mar 20, 2019 at 7:35 AM #40

    Zany_in_CO

    Zany_in_CO

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    There's really no need to be offended when asked to start a new thread. I do it to provide access to other members to what I think will be a good discussion. It actually works quite well and keeps the original thread intact without getting too long. For example, check out this link, Post #2:
    Mineral Oil Facial Cleansing (1 page so far)
    https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/mineral-oil-facial-cleansing.74277/#post-757070

    I started a thread "Zany's Deep Cleansing Oil" (3 pages) based on DHC's pricey cleansing oil. Irish Lass tried it, liked it, but wanted to tweak it (don't we all? LOL) So when asked, she happily started a new thread: "Emulsified Oil Cleansers" (2 pages)

    So now there are three threads -- quick reads, I might add -- covering a variety of options to the original recipe. It's a good thing!

    Now take a look at Zany’s No Slime Castile (15 pages):
    https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/zanys-no-slime-castile.72620/

    Related Thread #1
    Citric Acid in Zany's No Slime Castile (2 pages) The
    https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/zanys-no-slime-castile.72620/

    Related Thread #2
    HP Zany's No Slime Castile (1 page)
    https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/i-tried-to-hp-zanys-no-slime-castile.73361/

    The above threads are linked to each other to make it easy for members to read more without having to slog through the information in the original, plus it keeps the original thread to a manageable size. Am I "controlling"? Guilty as charged, but for a good reason. :)

    ETA: Whenever I've asked someone to start a new thread, they just do it. No fuss. I've only had one person refuse because they felt publicly embarrassed. Not much I can do about that. Not my intent; no hostility in play at all.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2019 at 7:43 AM
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