White spots in melt and pour glycerine soap

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Korban

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I have an issue with my melt and pour base. I have been using this recipe for a while and sometimes get this issue, please see the attached photo. I believe it might be undissolved sodium stearate/laurate or stearic/lauric acid. Has anyone experienced this issue before? Could it be that I am adding too much water or not enough NaOH? My other solvents are propylene glycol, sorbitol and obviously glycerine. I also add TEA as a clearing agent and SLES is my surfactant.
IMG_20210518_114017.jpg
 
I'm tempted to tell you that I find these spots actually very beautiful! But as long as we cannot be sure that they are indeed skin safe, let's better not upgrade it to a design feature too early.

Your diagnosis (undissolved lauric/stearic acid) sounds sensible, and you're asking the right questions! For a definite answer, we would need precise numbers of the recipe (amount of lye, amount of oils and fatty acids). Which superfat/lye discount does a lye calculator tell you your recipe has? M&P soap has quite high demands on precision, particularly when free stearic acid is used. The source of the stearic acid can make a difference too (saponification values differ between derived from palm, animal fats, or hydrogenated soy).

In fact, your spots look quite similar to the troubles described there. These turned out to be a combination of unsound calculations and too short saponification (cook) time. Especially once the solvents are added into the hot soap paste, the completion of the reaction is difficult to observe by eye. And it doesn't exactly help that recipes with large fraction of free fatty acids behave strange at times.
If I understand you correctly, your recipe is sometimes well-behaving, but this time not. That might point to incomplete reaction. Melt up a portion and keep it fluid for another hour or so (thermos flask?), and pour again. If the spots don't reappear, then you just were a bit hurried in the first place.
 
Thanks for your response!
I have tried remelting and cooking for longer before, which did not resolve the issue.
I have tried using lye calculaters but could not find all of my ingredients, so I resulted to calculating the exact molar mass of the fatty acids and then adding the appropriate amount of NaOH. I added the exact molar amount of NaOH though, is it supposed to be in excess? If so, how much excess. I suppose I need to get a pH meter to be certain saponification is complete.
Could too much water be an issue, because as I understand the sodium salt of the fatty acids that forms has quite low solubility in water at room temperarure?
Thanks for your support.
 
It is not possible to be more precise than calculating the amounts from molecular masses. IF you know them for sure. AFAIK, aiming for exact neutralisation is ideal for M&P soap (too much lye and it will attack skin, too much acids and they won't dissolve and form turbidity and lumps).

Several factors might impede this precision: Lye purity for one (99.9% NaOH isn't 99.9% pure any more when the container has been opened/exposed to air multiple times). Same for TEA (I don't have experience with it).
And possibly much more serious: what is sold as “cosmetic-grade stearic acid” is often not pure stearic acid (C₁₇H₃₅COOH, M=284.5 Da), but a blend of stearic and palmitic acid, with a lower molecular mass = higher lye demand. When in doubt, look at the label/data sheet of your stearic acid package. Final certainty only from titration, but that's tedious and you need the tools and chemicals for it.

That solubility thingie is complicated. It is true that sodium stearate is next to insoluble in (pure, cold, distilled) water. But you don't have pure water, but only a few % water in between a ton of propylene glycol, glycerol and sorbitol. Those alter the solubility dramatically. Pure sodium stearate is freely soluble in hot propylene glycol with a few % of water – when the solution cools down, it solidifies into what one would call M&P soap, but it doesn't form opaque crystals like you observed.

And finally, you're adding syndets (SLES). I can't help you with that, since I don't use it and don't know about the quirks it might bring.
 
I have the same proplem I use SLES in glycerin melt and pour base the I get white spots inside my glycerin soap
How can I solve this problem??
 
Korban if you dissolve the proplem please help me

I'm pretty sure they are talking about melt and pour base that @Korban made themselves. Is that what you are talking about? Or, are you using a base that you purchased?

If it is a base you purchased, you should go to the melt and pour area of the forum and start a new thread so it will be seen by the right people.

Even if you are talking about a homemade base, a new thread is a good idea, since @Korban has not been on the forum since 2021
 

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