What oil(s) should I add for more slip and silkiness?

Discussion in 'Beginners Soap Making Forum' started by milky, May 29, 2017.

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  1. May 29, 2017 #1

    milky

    milky

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    Hi you all! I've been experimenting with different proportions of lard, coconut, olive, and castor oils in my CP goat milk soap. So far the only negative review I've received is that it isn't as "slippery" as the soap my dad is used to. Looked it up and saw that adding avocado oil is good to help with that. Or maybe rice bran oil. Or high oleic sunflower...

    So my question is, what oil(s) should I add to the recipe next? Avocado, RBO, HO sunflower, or a different one? HO canola or PKO? What is the best bang-for-your-buck place to buy the one you suggest? I'm also looking for a cheaper place to buy castor oil since I've been getting the little bottles at Walmart. Thanks!
     
  2. May 29, 2017 #2

    The Efficacious Gentleman

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    What is the rest of your recipe? That night have an impact on the suggestions
     
  3. May 29, 2017 #3

    milky

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    The last soap I made contains 55% lard, 22% coconut, 18% olive, 5% castor, all goat milk for the liquid, a 33% lye concentration, and a 5% superfat.

    I really don't know what the exact recipe was of the bar that he was referring to but it contained the same ingredients and the order of the oils, by proportion, was the same. Probably the same superfat.
     
  4. May 29, 2017 #4

    anjouwu

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    I agree with Craig (aka the E.G.) that a recipe would help.

    I do love Avocado, with its relatively high percentage of unsaponifiables, but for "slip" I generally rely on clay (usually either Bentonite or Kaolin) which does the trick. Some people find it overly drying, however.
     
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  5. May 29, 2017 #5

    shunt2011

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    I would try replacing the olive with avocado and see if that helps. I don't use clay in my soaps as I it too drying. Didn't notice any extra slip but it may be me.
     
  6. May 29, 2017 #6

    milky

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    Thanks, I'd forgotten about clay being good for that. I have bentonite clay but was under the impression that it wasn't the greatest to use in soap. Problem with mixing, I think.. Does it behave well for you?
     
  7. May 29, 2017 #7

    toxikon

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    There are a few additives that can help create a silky feel.

    Tussah silk is one, and clays can help too. A tempered egg yolk can add creaminess, not sure about "slip" though.

    I've used 1 tsp bentonite clay PPO with great results.
     
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  8. May 29, 2017 #8

    milky

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    I'm sure the best thing would be for me to try them all out but, you know, instant gratification.. I need to go through again and read everything I can find about the different oil I mentioned. If not slip, I don't know what they might add to or detract from what I've been making. Is it the unsaponifiables in avocado oil that make it more slippery, like how clay works?
     
  9. May 29, 2017 #9

    ngian

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    Well after many experiments I have a list of things that can make silkier suds.

    Avocado
    Macadamia
    Shea Butter
    Aloe vera gel (instead of water)
    Oatmeal flour

    Here is one recipe;
    Avocado 45%
    Coconut 25%
    Shea Butter 25%
    Castor 5%
     
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  10. May 29, 2017 #10

    anjouwu

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    I've had a few issues, but once I stopped adding it to the lye water and started adding it to the oils directly (and mixing it thoroughly) everything smoothed out (so to speak). Tussah silk, in my experience, did nothing but drain the bank account.
     
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  11. May 29, 2017 #11

    BrewerGeorge

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    I'm guessing that he might be used to detergents and real soap with its accompanying scummy 'squeak' could be described as 'not slick.' I'd try some chelator like EDTA or sodium citrate before changing oils. Oil differences will be subtle, soap scum is not.
     
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  12. May 29, 2017 #12

    The Efficacious Gentleman

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    I was also thinking along those lines - is it just this soap, or lye soaps in general? A chelator might well help
     
  13. May 29, 2017 #13

    earlene

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    Where do you live? And do you prefer local stores or online? Do you have an Amazon Prime account?

    In the USA, I have found larger bottles of Castor Oil in some grocery stores (HEB in Texas, for example). Also the same product is available on Amazon and with an Amazon Prime account delivery is fast and no extra shipping, and although the price is lower per ounce than at the drugstore, it's still not cheap. The best buy I've found is at Soaper's Choice at $2.67 per pound. The smallest bottle is 7 pounds at $18.69 plus shipping. If you want to make a lot of soap, that's a good buy. But if you only want to make a few small batches of soap, this deal might be a good one. It's an offer of buy one 8 oz. bottle and no shipping using this code: FREESGD but the offer ends today.
     
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  14. May 29, 2017 #14

    DeeAnna

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    "...A tempered egg yolk can add creaminess..."

    I think it does do that, but I don't think it adds slip in the sense that the OP is talking about.
     
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  15. May 29, 2017 #15

    Obsidian

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    I found lard to produce the slickest lather but it can also be the worse for producing soap scum. Using a chelator will definitely help with that.
    One of my favorite recipes is 80% lard, 15% coconut and 5% castor with 5% SF. I use citric acid in it, hard, smooth slick bar. It doesn't produce a lot of lather but its a pretty awesome bar. Next time I make it, I will probably add a little KOH to help with lather.
     
  16. May 30, 2017 #16

    lenarenee

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    Wow...I find any recipe I've ever made to make a slipperier (really? is that spelled right?) bar than any store bought I used - I'm forever dropping them.
    Makes me wonder if there's more to what your dad means and it's just hard to explain since he's a non-soap maker.

    If your water is even moderately hard I'd think about using a chelator for a couple of reasons; it rinses better, leaves less scum, and sodium citrate and edta help stave of dos. (not sure about citric acid). It may not fix the slippery problem, but I think its a valuable additive regardless.

    My favorite recipe is very similar to the one you stated except I rarely use olive oil but use 10 - 20% high oleic sunflower or safflower, almond, or avocado. I love lots of lard, but do find the lather to be "dry" in feel and appearance. The liquid oils fix that. Almond is more expensive, but I think it adds the most benefit.

    So many people like to add clay for "slip", but I used to use it make my bars less slippery! Go figure!
     
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  17. May 30, 2017 #17

    shunt2011

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    I use lard and also add tussah silk and have really slippery bars.
     
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  18. May 30, 2017 #18

    Seawolfe

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    When I want a slippery soap I add clay, but this recipe also makes a slippery soap with fabulous lather, despite the lack of castor oil:
    Lard 65%
    Coconut oil 15%
    Sweet Almond oil 20%
    5% superfat AND I used citric acid in the recipe because hard water, so I recalculated the lye to accommodate that. Oh and 1 tsp sugar ppo in the lye water.

    It seems like all my soaps with sweet almond oil are a bit slippy now that I think about it.
     
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  19. May 30, 2017 #19

    Arimara

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    While I can use bentonite clay, I prefer kaolin as it is less harsh on the skin. Bentonite can clear my skin faster if I have a breakout but I run a risk of drier skin.

    I use Avocado and RBO for extra slip. They have served me fine. Clays can help but I tend to forget about them.
     
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  20. May 30, 2017 #20

    Obsidian

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    I'm not a fan of clay but if I do use it, I very much prefer kaolin. I've been using a salt bar with kaolin in it and the feel of the lather is incredible, really thick and slick, not super fluffy like a regular salt bar.
     
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