Vitamin E question

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MommaSoaper

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Hi all! I added .60 oz to my hard butters before adding lye solution. Meant to add it at Trace. Do I need to adjust my calculations for the vitamin e oil since I added it to the butters? If so, how would you add it as vit E is not on soap calc.? Thank you!!
 

kagey

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what exactly did you add?
vitamin E isn't really an "oil." what are the ingredients of your Vit E additive?
 

MommaSoaper

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Right, it was meant to be an additive at trace but I added it to oils thinking it was my castor oil 🤦 The ingredients state soybean oil, vit E, and MCT oil.
 

AliOop

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It doesn't matter when you added it; the soybean oil and MCT oil will saponify just the same regardless. Plus, the amount you added is so small that it unless you are making a very tiny batch of soap, it won't have any appreciable effect on the finished soap, other than possibly helping slow or prevent rancidity.
 

MommaSoaper

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It doesn't matter when you added it; the soybean oil and MCT oil will saponify just the same regardless. Plus, the amount you added is so small that it unless you are making a very tiny batch of soap, it won't have any appreciable effect on the finished soap, other than possibly helping slow or prevent rancidity.
Thank you! Now I'm wondering if it's superfluous to even be adding it at all?
 

earlene

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The problem with adding vit E oil to soap is more about the type of vit E oil you are using. If it's from a vitamin capsule, it's probably more pure than if you are using the kind sold for rubbing onto the skin that has soybean or another carrier oil with only a small amount of vitamin E added. If the latter is used, it's mostly the carrier oil that is added and, yes that will saponify.

Take this product for example. It is sold as vitamin E oil, but in addition to tocopherol, it also contains the following oils: sunflower, grapeseed, sesame, wheatgerm, lemon. I believe lemon oil is really and essential oil, but the others all have SAP values and will saponify.

When you say you poured the vitamin E oil thinking it was your Castor oil. Does that mean you left out your Castor oil altogether?
 

MommaSoaper

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The best time to add Vitamin E (or preferably ROE) is when you initially buy the fats. That helps prevent rancidity prior to use in soaping. Here is a link to more information about that.
Very interesting. I had never heard of ROE before. Is there a recommended usage rate
The problem with adding vit E oil to soap is more about the type of vit E oil you are using. If it's from a vitamin capsule, it's probably more pure than if you are using the kind sold for rubbing onto the skin that has soybean or another carrier oil with only a small amount of vitamin E added. If the latter is used, it's mostly the carrier oil that is added and, yes that will saponify.

Take this product for example. It is sold as vitamin E oil, but in addition to tocopherol, it also contains the following oils: sunflower, grapeseed, sesame, wheatgerm, lemon. I believe lemon oil is really and essential oil, but the others all have SAP values and will saponify.

When you say you poured the vitamin E oil thinking it was your Castor oil. Does that mean you left out your Castor oil altogether?
Thank you for that.

The castor oil was put in with the liquid oils. I just was measuring oils out and stupidly added the vit E to the hard oils. Baby brain bad here. The loaf was hard enough today for me to cut. The bars are curing now. Seem to be fine.
 

DeeAnna

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The problem with using tocopherols (the group of chemicals that includes vitamin E) is that "everybody knows" vit E is an antioxidant, but what most people do not know is you have to choose the right one(s) of 8 different tocopherols that are most appropriate for a given situation. What's good for skin isn't necessarily good for protecting soap making fats.

And then you also have to add the right amount. Too much is actually worse than too little, because a too-high dose of tocopherols can accelerate oxidation (aka pro-oxidation), not prevent it.

To make matters even more complicated, some fats naturally contain tocopherols. There is no way for the average soap maker to know how much is naturally present in a given fat. So when you blindly add even more tocopherols, you take the risk of overdosing the fat and causing pro-oxidation.

That is why ROE (rosemary oleoresin extract) is recommended instead as an antioxidant for soap making fats. It's very effective for this purpose, and it contains a different set of chemicals than tocopherols. You can overdose ROE as well, but the chemicals in ROE aren't naturally found in soap making fats, so it's much easier to add just the right amount of ROE.

edit: Like tocopherols, ROE is used in foods, so it can be added to fats you might also eat. For example, I add it to my home rendered lard and tallow right after rendering.
 
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AliOop

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Very interesting. I had never heard of ROE before. Is there a recommended usage rate
Glad to hear your soap is ok. If you click on the link I provided above, it will take you to @DeeAnna's website, where she discusses usage rates and even more info than what she shared in her response above. :)
 

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