Very slow moving recipe please...

Discussion in 'Lye-Based Soap Forum' started by KiwiMoose, Jan 9, 2019.

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  1. Jan 9, 2019 #1

    KiwiMoose

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    I don't know if I'm allowed to post this here - but I am entering the January challenge. I need a recipe for mixing into different colour lots so that I can use it to 'paint' my soap. And I need it to stay runny, but I still want it to be soap ( ie with lye in it). It doesn't matter about any of the other properties of the recipe because it is essentially to be used as 'paint'.

    Do I just use 100% OO?

    TIA :)
     
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  2. Jan 9, 2019 #2

    Ethanperine@gmail

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    I am new to all of this but was wondering if you could use MP and color it to use for paint?
     
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  3. Jan 9, 2019 #3

    penelopejane

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    Yes 100% OO is slow moving especially around 30% lye concentration.
    But so is anything that doesn’t contain Shea butter or CO.
     
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  4. Jan 9, 2019 #4

    jcandleattic

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    100% lard soap is also a very very slow moving recipe AND your batter will be easier to color because it won't have the yellow or even green hue that a lot of olive oils do.
     
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  5. Jan 9, 2019 #5

    KiwiMoose

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    Thanks PJ - just as an aside for another purpose, does cocoa butter work differently to shea butter in terms of batter movement?
     
  6. Jan 9, 2019 #6

    dixiedragon

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    in my experience cocoa butter thickens much faster. I have a 50% shea butter recipe and I'm able to do a swirl.

    I think almost anything liquid will do. Because you'll be able to soap it at a very low temp. I'd suggest soybean or something cheap, vs OO.
     
  7. Jan 9, 2019 #7

    KiwiMoose

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    Rice bran and canola are the cheapest here
     
  8. Jan 9, 2019 #8

    dixiedragon

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    I'd do one of those, then. Let your lye water cool to room temp and add it to room-temp oils.
     
  9. Jan 9, 2019 #9

    SaltedFig

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    That's REALLY odd! My Winnie "soap painting" was made with a batter that was very heavy on the cocoa butter, and it stayed workable for well over an hour (but it did have a lot of olive in it, and it was kept cool and I didn't mix it much to start with).

    Sweet almond is slow, and doesn't change the colour of soap much (although not nearly as white as lard of course, it make more of a pale creamy color soap).

    Hi-oleic sunflower could be used instead of olive (it's a little bit paler than olive).

    Canola is going to come out a little paler than rice bran oil (although rice bran does add a nice sheen to the soap).
     
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  10. Jan 9, 2019 #10

    KiwiMoose

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    I can see why people buy canola for cooking - I can get 2 litres for $5! That's so cheap - that's about $US3.
    I don't think its very healthy oil for eating, so i won't touch it . I only cook in coconut oil. But for soap - let's do it!
     
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  11. Jan 9, 2019 #11

    Chris_S

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    Sorry kiwi moose can i just highjack very quickly. If i want to test fo instead of making a complex or rather my usual recipe i have oo pomace and canola oil blend could i make say 500ml of that oil and lye solution both at room temp? just to test fo? when i say test i mean see if they will accelerate trace and to what degree it does this. iv never soaped at room temp so not sure what the deal is. And how long is the lye solution safe to sit could i make it tonight then just mix and make ect in the morning? Sorry again kiwi
     
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  12. Jan 9, 2019 #12

    SaltedFig

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    @Chris_S
    That sounds like an excellent test! You could also split the batch (once you've made it) into individual soap bar sizes to test more fragrances in one go :)

    Room temperature means that there's no added heat to the oils, and the lye solution is left to cool (until it is just warm to the touch is fine). Soaping cool is one way to make the soap batter go a bit slower (saponification is exothermic, so it will still heat as you mix it).

    If you are leaving your lye solution overnight, you will need to treat it like you are storing it, and protect it from reacting with the carbon dioxide in the air (put it in a lye-safe air-tight container marked with warning labels)
     
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  13. Jan 10, 2019 #13

    Chris_S

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    That was the plan i did some test batches last week with different fo but i used my regular recipe mixed a batch then using a ladle poured enough into jugs to then mix the fo into a jug each with the batter then poured and made a record of what behaved ect. Then this thread gave me the idea of just using one oil and soaping at room temp. iv got about 15 different individual molds then one multi thing of about 12 smaller molds then i drew a diagram for what scent was where so i knew what was what when i got round to releasing them from the molds.

    Thanks @SaltedFig not got any air tight containers so i think ill just make it in the morning put it out of harms way for a few hours then get cracking its just me and 2 cats in the house and where i was going to put it is well out of reach of the cats and its somewhere i only use for my lye storage container so i would know what it was for also all these jugs are only for soaping none will ever be used for foods so they are easily distinguishable as not safe for human consumption. But if i was to put it in a container overnight i would definatly label it for safety. I only ever soap with the cats outside even if it means telling them to go outside i just wont risk them getting into the room and getting hurt in some way they are far too precise to me to risk :)
     
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  14. Jan 10, 2019 #14

    penelopejane

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    To both Kiwis and Chris:
    The thing with single oil soaps (other than OO) is that they aren't that great generally.
    See:
    http://alchemyandashes.blogspot.com/2014/03/single-oil-soap-experiment-phase-3-one.html
    than look for phase 1 and 2.

    What I do is make a cavity mold soap with a nice recipe and then give the different scented soaps away. Or I use a tiny amount in a smiley face mold that is 3 cm across and I still give them away as presents.

    Kiwi your soap is going to be fab so maybe you will want to give them away too?
     
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  15. Jan 10, 2019 #15

    KiwiMoose

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    Gosh that was interesting read ^!

    I'm not using single oil for the soap itself - I'll use my regular recipe. But the single oil is just for the painting on top. And if they do turn out fabulous I will put them in a glass case and keep them forever - one day I can donate them to an art museum.;)
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
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  16. Jan 10, 2019 #16

    Chris_S

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    Mine is purely for testing the fo and eo to see what works and whats naughty to get some record of them. I probably wont even use them as soap once set they will probably just get thrown out its basically just to save using the oils and butters that are in my regular recipe :) thanks for the warning though :thumbs:
     
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  17. Jan 10, 2019 #17

    penelopejane

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    Yes I get the idea. I’m just too stingy to throw soap out unless it’s a complete failure. I use the forum FO list and read all the reviews on the wholesalers websites before buying. Ive also found someone who likes one of the same FOs that I do and I know her “nose” is the same as mine so I go on her judgement.

    After all that I figure my boys can get use out of the soap even if it smells yuck (because there is not accounting for taste with some FOs).

    Even using a cavity molds if an FO accelerates or rices you sure know!!
     
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  18. Jan 10, 2019 #18

    shunt2011

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    Just keep in mind, sometimes recipes will affect how the fo plays too. I've had FO cause problems in one recipe but not another. It doesn't happen offen but is has happened.
     
  19. Jan 10, 2019 #19

    Chris_S

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    Oh yes i have experienced this a couple times already my coffee fo is a nightmare to work with i just about got it into the small molds an apple candy one which actually completely siezed i somehow not sure how i did it but i managed to salvage it despite using a loaf mold and it looks and smells pretty darn good but both smell awesome in candles and melts so i can use it in that. I know what you mean about throwing soap away but the oil was very cheap and i didnt check what it had in it and only when i got home did i notice it was a blend so in all honestly im not overly keen on the idea of using it with soap because iv heard bad things about canola oil in soap so i have no issues with throwing the majority of the soap away ill keep some to test though id prefer to waste than oil than use a more expensive and time consuming recipe that i usually use just too much faffinflg about for it just be a test

    I wasnt aware of this fo and eo list on the forum ill have to have a search for that, being in england though not sure how much help that will be though but will absolutly have a search see what i can find.

    @shunt2011 that had crossed my mind and some of the test batches iv done have been with a edited recipe to see if they still accelerated trace and they did im guessing the temp you soap at could also maybe make a difference? Iv also tried and tested different times to add the fo to see how that effected the reaction so i added it right before pour, in the hot oils and in the batch after and before trace all as experiments, i normally try to soap at 100-110F but iv also tried changing this to see how much difference it makes. Might sound like a waste but i absolutly love the experimenting of soap making obviously id prefer it to be a sucess but even if its a failed batch i just enjoy the process and learning curve iv achieved from the whole process :)
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
  20. Jan 10, 2019 #20

    MGM

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    Fragrance preferences are SO personal....I seem to be surrounded by people who like food scents in their candles/air fresheners and soaps (cinnamon latte, pumpkin spice, cinnamon bun, blueberry muffin, cupcake, cotton candy, etc etc). I find all of that insanely cloying, but love crisp fresh fruits and florals. That being said, I think familiarity is breeding tolerance for me....I recently bought Ginger EO from 3 different companies online to test them. Two were very good and I didn't like the 3rd at all. Yesterday when I made the shampoo bars, I used Orange-Ginger FO, but bumped it up with Cedarwood, Orange 5-Fold and Patchouli EOs and decided to throw in my 3rd-place Ginger EO. I immediately regretted it, as all I could smell was that soil-like Ginger, but by evening I had come to terms with it and this morning, I actually sought out the bars for their dirt-Ginger smell! Now, if others don't agree with me, well, I've got a LOT of shampoo bars to get through...
     
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