Lots of organisms thrive on roots.....such as the pearlscale organism, for example. We've had battles with them in our front lawn. They eat the roots of our grass and leave unsightly bare, brown areas.
IrishLass
IrishLass
Vegan soap conundrum
- Thread starter shella
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Well, it seems to me that some folks may be expanding the definition of 'vegan' beyond what the dictionary says. Not containing animal products is all it means to me because that is what the dictionary says. I have eaten vegan (not currently, though) and if I had to look at the possibility of eating food that met all those extended criteria, I am sure I would have starved to death.
I am a vegetarian going on 20 years now, but was vegan for only about half of a year somewhere in the last decade. It was hard work. But it's not hard work making a vegan friendly soap. Not IMO.
I am a vegetarian going on 20 years now, but was vegan for only about half of a year somewhere in the last decade. It was hard work. But it's not hard work making a vegan friendly soap. Not IMO.
That's not quite true ... or rather, this is changing
Hydroponics and Aquaponics are two very compact, stackable systems.
Organic certification is becoming available for these systems (this hasn't always been the case - up until recently organic also meant soil based).
https://www.urbangreenfarms.com.au/...s-Hydroponics-Certified-Organics-in-Australia
You might want to check this out
http://www.modularfarms.com.au/
To my way of thinking, have a sustainable source for as much of our consumables as possible makes massive sense.
I don't believe we need poisons and synthetic fertilizers to achieve that
The world human population increased while I was typing this ...
That's not quite true ... or rather, this is changing
Hydroponics and Aquaponics are two very compact, stackable systems.
Here here! Y'all know how much I love my hydro/aeroponic Tower Garden.
My sis has a mini-farm going on with several of them in her back yard. More and more folks are starting to catch on and are building vertical hydro-farms here in the US. I've even heard of restaurants building them on their roofs, and I hear of some grocery stores doing the same. I have tomatoes coming out my ears right now off of my one and only Tower. I need to start throwing some of them in the freezer to set aside for sauce-making.IrishLass
Hendejm
Well-Known Member
Ok - so taken to the extreme here I know....BUT......
It is known that rats and birds and their feces ends up in our food supply....wine for example. It has been found that wine grapes that are used to press for wine contain rats and birds along with their droppings. The same is said to be true of most/all grains commercially produced. I’m sure it also happens with olives and olive oil. So those vegans that like to drink wine may well be drinking bits of animals....just sayin!
It is known that rats and birds and their feces ends up in our food supply....wine for example. It has been found that wine grapes that are used to press for wine contain rats and birds along with their droppings. The same is said to be true of most/all grains commercially produced. I’m sure it also happens with olives and olive oil. So those vegans that like to drink wine may well be drinking bits of animals....just sayin!
I just threw up a little bit in the back of my throat
Hendejm
Well-Known Member
Haha! But we are ok eating meat/poultry/fish. Go figure!
I think it's less about the microorganisms than it about eating the whole plant...when you harvest seeds or fruits from a tree or plant, the plant goes on living and reproducing. When you pull up a carrot or onion or potato, that plant's life is over.
In the process of cleaning and processing foods, I would venture to guess that many of the aforementioned contaminants would be sufficiently removed or neutralized, except in cases of insufficient cleaning procedures. By processing, I am referring to our own personal processes, not commercial processing, although that should be taken into account as well.
penelopejane
Well-Known Member
Are you confusing vegan and vegetarian?
I don’t know any vegan who will eat honey or dairy milk.
I’m allergic to palm so can’t eat it. I believe products do transfer across the skin barrier so I don’t use it in soap.
Dawni
Well-Known Member
It's them who are confusing me lol
I'm serious though.
I've met several "vegans" who will not eat or use anything that requires killing of the animal.. Meat, leather, etc. but who don't mind ghee and honey and will use wool. I've met several others who won't touch anything from any animal, who step around ants, and happily chase away cockroaches for an hour instead of spraying them with insecticide. And there are the in betweeners.
Of course, it could be semantics? And the way they understand the term? I guess the former fall under the label of "vegetarian" if we were to analyze what they're actually eating.
I've been in the middle of that kind of an argument though.. The "no, you're not vegan," "yes I am" one. To each his own I say.
shella
Member
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Thank you all for your replies a lot of you understand where I am coming from. I have done my research that is why I asked the question. My understanding of stearic acid is that it can be plant based of animal fat based. I have people asking for soap made from no animal derivatives. I grow organic food and yes I do know that nature has chemicals. If you look up what can be classed as organic in the industry you will be surprised.
I would like to thank all who have answered. I look forword to reading all your post.
That is what my question is about How can you make good soap without any animal fats or any animal derivatives. I am old school back in the day you did not have a wide range of different oils. Question if you dont use animal fat in making soap, can you call the product soap.
What do you mean by expanding the definition of vegan .. confused.... my understanding of vegan is no animal products what so ever. but people are using ingredients made from animals and calling it vegan I am not saying its done deliberately. It seams to me to be a case of a person hears that this product is vegan but does not do the research. JMO not set in stone
Thanks yes I have been member a few years but took a long break. I have only made one batch of soap and it was good i gave away the soap just to see if there was a demant ummmm yes i still get asked when are you going to make more soap
health reasons stopped play bit am back. I did not wa\ist time i was researching soap. My sense of humer is a bit out there
its an aquired taste. lol
I have been asked if I can make vegan soap. No animal products what so ever. I have had replys from some wonderful people but still have nt awnsered one main question. People have said theymake vegan soap either coconut oil olive oile tec but does not give me a simple non vegan soap recipe yes I have lookes online but after looking up the ingredients turns out some form of animal fat is hiden in the ingrdiance. I am not looking forAaunt Jamima recipe Just a simple one.
so far this is what I understantyou can use olive oil, coconut oil, butters. You can make some with just one oil. I will be trying that. Just need a little bit more info
I would like to thank all who have answered. I look forword to reading all your post.
That is what my question is about How can you make good soap without any animal fats or any animal derivatives. I am old school back in the day you did not have a wide range of different oils. Question if you dont use animal fat in making soap, can you call the product soap.
What do you mean by expanding the definition of vegan .. confused.... my understanding of vegan is no animal products what so ever. but people are using ingredients made from animals and calling it vegan I am not saying its done deliberately. It seams to me to be a case of a person hears that this product is vegan but does not do the research. JMO not set in stone
Thanks yes I have been member a few years but took a long break. I have only made one batch of soap and it was good i gave away the soap just to see if there was a demant ummmm yes i still get asked when are you going to make more soap
health reasons stopped play bit am back. I did not wa\ist time i was researching soap. My sense of humer is a bit out there
its an aquired taste. lol
I have been asked if I can make vegan soap. No animal products what so ever. I have had replys from some wonderful people but still have nt awnsered one main question. People have said theymake vegan soap either coconut oil olive oile tec but does not give me a simple non vegan soap recipe yes I have lookes online but after looking up the ingredients turns out some form of animal fat is hiden in the ingrdiance. I am not looking forAaunt Jamima recipe Just a simple one.
so far this is what I understantyou can use olive oil, coconut oil, butters. You can make some with just one oil. I will be trying that. Just need a little bit more info
Last edited by a moderator:
Jill B Blasius
Well-Known Member
Yes! It's still soap! Saponification of oils. All soaps, except for the ones with tallow, lard or goats milk (which I replace with coconut milk) qualify as vegan. Oo, EVOo, Co, Avo, Walnut, Sweet Almond oil, Hemp oil, Rice bran, Castor oil, Mango/Shea/Cocoa Butters, Sea salt, clays, essential oils can all be in your soap. You can create a lot of nice soaps with all that stuff!
Try Zany's (faux) sea salt soap! (use the forum search) Olive oil, sea salt, baking soda, water and lye! (I snuck in some Castor oil too) Cures in weeks, not years.
Don't use micas, fragrance oils or package the soap in a non-renewable product (plastic). Use a muslin bag. Use craft/recycled paper for the label. Not sure if they have a problem with certain ink thou!
Soap is soap regardless if it's Vegan or beast. As for recipes, it depends on what oils/butters you have that you want to put into soap. If you tell us what you have and want to use we can help. You can also enter some of what's available to you into a lye calculator to make your own recipe.
I make soap with lard and I make soap with Palm. I have 2 that has neither. I've not had anyone question micas or fragrance in my palm soaps. So I'm thinking most don't care. They like pretty soap. I have vegan relatives and they use my pretty soap without issue. So, I really think it varies on what the individual persons definition of Vegan/Vegetarian is. I think they run the gamut. I make what I want to make. If someone wants to use or buy what I make and have, that's fine with me. But I'm not going to try to appeal to a small group of people. I do most my shows up in farmland country. They eat meat. We have a huge Arabic community us so that's why I make palm based as well as lard based soaps. Most say no to the pig and that's okay to me. I make sure to point out which soaps are lard free.
I make soap with lard and I make soap with Palm. I have 2 that has neither. I've not had anyone question micas or fragrance in my palm soaps. So I'm thinking most don't care. They like pretty soap. I have vegan relatives and they use my pretty soap without issue. So, I really think it varies on what the individual persons definition of Vegan/Vegetarian is. I think they run the gamut. I make what I want to make. If someone wants to use or buy what I make and have, that's fine with me. But I'm not going to try to appeal to a small group of people. I do most my shows up in farmland country. They eat meat. We have a huge Arabic community us so that's why I make palm based as well as lard based soaps. Most say no to the pig and that's okay to me. I make sure to point out which soaps are lard free.
penelopejane
Well-Known Member
Actually a few people (including me) have given you strictly vegan recipes so far.
Pure Castile:
100% olive oil + salt 1tsp ppo
Lindy’s shampoo bar (not used on your hair despite the name)
Avocado Oil: 30%
Castor Oil: 10%
Olive Oil: 40%
Shea Butter: 10%
Soybean Oil: 10%
https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/shampoo-bar-thanks-lindy.30946/
Knowing the availability of oils close to you you can:
Look in last 10 pages of the recipes forum:
https://www.soapmakingforum.com/forums/soap-making-recipes-tutorials.24/
If you search the last 10 pages of new posts you will find 30 or so other strictly vegan recipes.
Pure Castile:
100% olive oil + salt 1tsp ppo
Lindy’s shampoo bar (not used on your hair despite the name)
Avocado Oil: 30%
Castor Oil: 10%
Olive Oil: 40%
Shea Butter: 10%
Soybean Oil: 10%
https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/shampoo-bar-thanks-lindy.30946/
Knowing the availability of oils close to you you can:
Look in last 10 pages of the recipes forum:
https://www.soapmakingforum.com/forums/soap-making-recipes-tutorials.24/
If you search the last 10 pages of new posts you will find 30 or so other strictly vegan recipes.
Alfa_Lazcares
Well-Known Member
You can also make 100% coconut oil soaps with salt on them for a nice salt bar that is vegan. There are tons of recipes on here that wont use palm or animal products. Use the forum search instead of teacher google cause then you will end up in websites that may or may not know what they are talking about.
Ants and frogs and any displaced animals count, sure. But orangutans are endangered and I think that leads to a lot of the focus on that whole issue.
When I grew
Soap is made by combing a caustic with a fat. According to the FDA it is "mainly composed of alkalai salts of fatty acids" (lye + fat). Plenty of good soap is made without animal fats or animal derivatives. Castile soap is old school and considered by many people all over the world to be very good soap. No animal fats or animal derivatives are in olive oil.
Okay, well what I mean is going beyond the simple definition of no animal products used and expanding it to the extreme where nothing that ever touched an animal can be used. Strict veganism is what I mean by expanding the definition. There is nothing wrong with a person choosing to incorporate all environmental concerns into their lifestyle choices, but I don't believe that every person who chooses to eat a vegan diet is as extreme as possible on this topic. Maybe I am wrong about that, but I believe it has evolved to become more exclusive than in the past.
I don't know what you mean by people using products that contain ingredients from animals and calling it vegan. Please give an example so I know what we are talking about.
Incidentally, when I said I followed a vegan diet for about six months, what I meant to say was 'raw vegan' meaning no cooked foods. Not the same as all vegans. Just to clarify. Nothing to do with the topic at hand.
What do you mean by animal fats hidden in the recipe?
Simple vegan recipe:
100% olive oil + NaOH per your lye calculator. That is a castile soap. There is no animal fat in olive oil and none in lye.
Now to make sure you don't introduce animal products via your colorants, you'll have to watch out for some reds as not all are animal free. But with a little research you can easily find colorants that are not made of animal products. Or you can just make non-colored soap.
Soap is made by combing a caustic with a fat. According to the FDA it is "mainly composed of alkalai salts of fatty acids" (lye + fat). Plenty of good soap is made without animal fats or animal derivatives. Castile soap is old school and considered by many people all over the world to be very good soap. No animal fats or animal derivatives are in olive oil.
Okay, well what I mean is going beyond the simple definition of no animal products used and expanding it to the extreme where nothing that ever touched an animal can be used. Strict veganism is what I mean by expanding the definition. There is nothing wrong with a person choosing to incorporate all environmental concerns into their lifestyle choices, but I don't believe that every person who chooses to eat a vegan diet is as extreme as possible on this topic. Maybe I am wrong about that, but I believe it has evolved to become more exclusive than in the past.
I don't know what you mean by people using products that contain ingredients from animals and calling it vegan. Please give an example so I know what we are talking about.
Incidentally, when I said I followed a vegan diet for about six months, what I meant to say was 'raw vegan' meaning no cooked foods. Not the same as all vegans. Just to clarify. Nothing to do with the topic at hand.
What do you mean by animal fats hidden in the recipe?
Simple vegan recipe:
100% olive oil + NaOH per your lye calculator. That is a castile soap. There is no animal fat in olive oil and none in lye.
Now to make sure you don't introduce animal products via your colorants, you'll have to watch out for some reds as not all are animal free. But with a little research you can easily find colorants that are not made of animal products. Or you can just make non-colored soap.
