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using wort in beer soap

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houseofwool

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So, a few months ago, I had asked the owner of a local brewery if it was okay if I used the name of his beer on the label of our soap using that beer. He agreed and this week we have been commissioned to make 2 kinds of soap using beer. He gave me a growler each of two kinds of beer (1/2 gallon bottles), plus a jar of wort. He has specifically asked that we use the wort in the soap.

In reading about it, it doesn't sound like it contains any yeast yet, so I don't think that is an issue.

I planned on reducing the beer down by 50% to remove the alcohol and concentrate the goodness. I was planning on added the wort at ~ 1 tbsp ppo, but have no real idea...

Has anyone used wort before?

I am so excited do make these soaps. One is just a plain brown beer - not to dark, not too light. The other is scrumptious - Java Lava - it is dark and coffee flavored with very little hops - so this one is going to be the main liquid for a soap with espresso powder and and powdered goats milk. It should smell divine!
 

boyago

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If its just the wort it's pretty much just grain tea. The booze comes after you set the yeast to work so no alcohol yet. I'd just use it as replacement water. It will have all the carbs and sugars though so maybe watch out for that when considering the reduction?
 

boyago

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Also, that kicks ass. Will they sell them for you at the brewery too?
 

Seawolfe

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Some worts are really sweet - is this one sweet to taste? If so I guess I'd dilute it a bit, or maybe freeze it in cubes before mixing with the lye to avoid a lye volcano. Then add the cooked down beer. On the advice from here I cooked half of the beer down to a syrup and added that at trace, and that worked out really well. I essentially was able to add a whole bottle of Arrogant Bastard to a 2 lb loaf that way for lots of beery goodness.
 

LBussy

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You are correct, the wort is sugar, proteins, and hops in water. It is perishable so I hope it's in the fridge!

They might give you the specific gravity of the wort and that way you can treat it like sugar in water. A common range would be 1.040 to 1.045 for a and that converts to 1040 to 1045 g/l (see how that works?). 1000 of those grams is water so there's ~43g sugar in 1 liter of wort. At a 33% lye concentration, if you used the wort as a straight replacement for water, that would mean 117.27 ml of wort PPO and that works out to ~5 grams of sugar PPO. A common conversion is 13g per Tbsp so that's a little less than half a Tbsp.

The wort will absolutely have other bubble producing characteristics, mostly the proteins. The hops are a natural antiseptic and an astringent. All in all it sounds like a great idea for a soap.
 

houseofwool

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I tasted it last night and it is not sweet, even though it smells sweet. I'm guessing that the sugar molecules are not glucose...

Because I need to use the beer as the primary liquid and I think it will definitely stink like crazy to add the lye to the wort, I am going to add it to the oils, before adding the lye.

Seeing as how I have a half gallon of each beer and they only want a dozen bars of each type... Even with concentrating it, I will have a lot let over for sampling.
 
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Obsidian

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I'd take around 16oz of the beer and concentrate it down to 2 oz or so. That way you get a lot of beer into the soap but can still use the wort or water to mix up the lye. I really dislike adding beer to lye, it smells terrible.
 

houseofwool

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I have taken my total liquid weight, 600 gm, as beer and am simmering it down now.

I used 100 gm of distilled water to mix with the instant coffee and goats milk (this is my cafe au lait made with their coffee stout).

I want to get the beer down to around 100 grams, use distilled water to make a 50:50 lye solution, then make up the balance of water with wort. In retrospect, I could have used the wort to mix the instant coffee and gm.

The wort is not from this particular beer, so I want to reserve the majority of it for the other batch.
 

LBussy

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I tasted it last night and it is not sweet, even though it smells sweet. I'm guessing that the sugar molecules are not glucose...
Wort is sometimes described as disgustingly sweet. If it does not taste sweet it's not wort (I brew beer). It's basically maltose and some other stuff so if it's wort it should taste like malt (a malted) and the bitter hops.
 

LBussy

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Interesting. Even for a dark beer it would be very sweet?
Definitely. Something that makes a dry stout (think Guinness) may be the least sweet overall, but it will still taste like a sweet coffee. A Pale Ale will have a crushing bitterness but still be sweet.

Is it possible that they just gave you non-carbonated beer from one of the vessels and mentioned wort somewhere along the way and you connected them?
 

houseofwool

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I didn't actually pick it up, but my sister met with the brewmaster, so she took him at his word.
 

LBussy

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I'm trying to think of a scientific kitchen way of telling for sure, but honestly, wort is definitely sweet. If you have to think about it, it's not wort. Wort will be about 4% heavier by volume than water so if you have a really precise volume measure and scale you could do it that way, but I feel very comfortable saying if it's not sweet, it's not wort.

I don't think that's a bad thing, you actually have an easier calculation for adding sugar (if you use it).
 

houseofwool

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Meh, I plan on using what ever it is as part of the liquid and I have boiled the beer itself way down. It should be good.
 

dosco

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Is the collective opinion that the "good stuff" (hops oils, etc.) will survive saponification?

Or is the plan to make the soap using HP and then adding the concentrated wort/beer after saponification is complete?

-Dave
 

houseofwool

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It is mostly for label appeal, the sugars survive saponification, but that is probably all.
 

Seawolfe

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My beer soap still smells nicely beery and hoppy, but theres a lotta beer in my batch because I cooked down 8 ounces to 2 ounces and added at trace. Still, I didn't expect any of the scent to survive, so that was a nice surprise. Mind you I wont be able to tell if it lasts after 16 weeks because the boys all nabbed bars from the 2lb batch, so Ill need to make more...
 
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