Soap too soft and creamy day 2 – after saponification process

[kchaystack]

Okay, that would save me a lot of time. It starts out at around 80 °C/176 °F. Can I mix it with the oil at that temperature? And do I need to heat the oil?

No need to heat the oils. I would make the lye, set it aside as I measure my oils and get my mold and sb ready, then carefully pour the lye in the oils and blend in short pulses using the sb to stir between.

Of course if you want to add color or scent - then I would change this up a bit, but for plain soap it will work fine.

 

[alexanderte]

No need to heat the oils. I would make the lye, set it aside as I measure my oils and get my mold and sb ready, then carefully pour the lye in the oils and blend in short pulses using the sb to stir between.

Of course if you want to add color or scent - then I would change this up a bit, but for plain soap it will work fine.

That’s a time saver. Is there any use at all to measure temperature when doing CP soapmaking?

How would you do it different if adding scent. If I’m going to add a scent, then it will be an EO of some kind.

 

[kchaystack]

That’s a time saver. Is there any use at all to measure temperature when doing CP soapmaking?

How would you do it different if adding scent. If I’m going to add a scent, then it will be an EO of some kind.

I have found that usually there is no need to measure temps for soap. I use my thermometer for lotion making.

Depends on the blend. Mostly I would add the EO to the oils before the lye and give it a blitz to combine. Then pour the lye in the oils from there.

If my scent is an accelerator or causes heating, I'd probably let my lye cool to room temp. This is because I would not want it to overheat and crack or volcano out of the mold. But the EO's would still go into the oils before anything else.

You can make you lye up the day before - if you have a safe place to keep it so it dose not get knocked over, and something to cover the container.

I masterbatch my lye as a 50% solution (1:1 lye to water) which is about 1.5 liters at a time. When I want to make soap I our out the amount I need of my solution and then add extra liquid to create my desired concentration. It is a bit more math but it is not that hard to do.

 

[alexanderte]

I have found that usually there is no need to measure temps for soap. I use my thermometer for lotion making.

Depends on the blend. Mostly I would add the EO to the oils before the lye and give it a blitz to combine. Then pour the lye in the oils from there.

What do you mean by giving it a blitz? I’m Norwegian. Don’t understand much. :mrgreen:

If my scent is an accelerator or causes heating, I'd probably let my lye cool to room temp. This is because I would not want it to overheat and crack or volcano out of the mold. But the EO's would still go into the oils before anything else.

How do I know if an EO is an accelerator or causes heating? Do you pour all of the EO in the oils – or do you save some amount for right after the trace?

What is usually going to happen with a 50% Lye Concentration 1:1 is the fact it is going to trace much faster and I find in some recipes it can leave the soap dry and brittle. Yes, I have played with 50% concentrations, lol sometimes accidently. I do find a 50% works well in pure light olive oil, will usually trace very quickly with pomace, I do not use EVOO so no help there.
Theresa, I do not find any difference between a 30% solution versus a 50% solution or even straight lye crystals when it comes to acquiring a burn on the skin. It all burns equally in my opinion. Unfortunately I am a great one for getting bit by lye, since it can get above my short nitrile gloves

I think I for now will stick to the max 40% guidelines that I’ve read previously in this thread – unless I get another soft batter to cut tomorrow.

 

[kchaystack]

What do you mean by giving it a blitz? I’m Norwegian. Don’t understand much. :mrgreen:

A quick pulse with your stick blender. Or with your whisk.

How do I know if an EO is an accelerator or causes heating? Do you pour all of the EO in the oils – or do you save some amount for right after the trace?

You can check reviews on soap sites. Mostly it is things like clove and cinnamon (things you can't use much of anyway because they are irritants at larger amounts). I am not an expert on EO's as I don't use many, I like the versatility of FO's.

And no, dump them all in up front. No need to save anything to add at trace.

I think I for now will stick to the max 40% guidelines that I’ve read previously in this thread – unless I get another soft batter to cut tomorrow.

If you press on the side of your soap gently and it dents, do not cut it. Let it sit another day.

 

[alexanderte]

Thanks for the clarifications and advice, kchaystack. This is really helpful.

 

[doriettefarm]

Just be careful about adding EOs at high temps . . . if it's too hot all your lovely scent will evaporate! Same for some fragrance oils so check the flashpoint of whatever scent you decide to use.

 

[penelopejane]

If you use butters and hard oils you might find you need to soap at 110*F to keep them from solidifying into spots or swirls of unsaponified oil
EOs are not necessarily "better". I am allergic to most EOs. DH can't have any fragrance - hence the mild Castile.

 

[alexanderte]

No need to heat the oils. I would make the lye, set it aside as I measure my oils and get my mold and sb ready, then carefully pour the lye in the oils and blend in short pulses using the sb to stir between.

Of course if you want to add color or scent - then I would change this up a bit, but for plain soap it will work fine.

I just need to bring this one up another time. If the lye water is at 180 °F and my oils are not heated – will this cause any problems when mixing the two?

When making a Castile yesterday, I used non-heated olive oil, but was afraid to mix it straight away with the lye water – so I waited until the lye water was at 100 °F. I don’t think I got a medium–thick trace – only a light–medium (I guess). I’m a bit concerned about the saponification process for this batch – it seems very floaty still, one day after. This is the first time I’m using silicone molds, so that might slow down the saponification process?

What would comfort me was if there were an ideal temperature for mixing lye water into oils for this RT CP method.

Edit: I’m googling and it seems like falce trace (not sure if that has happened to any of my batches) seems to happen more often when mixing at colder temperatures. I know nothing about this – I’m just a bit concerned.

Edit 2: False trace is probably not a problem when using only olive oil, as it doesn’t turn solid at colder temperatures like coconut oil do. Right?

 

[alexanderte]

http://www.soap-making-essentials.com/how-to-make-soap-roomtemp.html

This page pretty much explains it when there are hard oils involved. But I’m a bit confused when it comes to a Castile with only olive oil.

 

[Susie]

No worries about false trace with just olive oil. No hard oils to set back up.

I never worry about temperature with my recipes, as I do not do fancy swirls or anything. I mix the oils, mix the NaOH with the water, then dump the hot NaOH/water mixture into the oils.

 

[alexanderte]

No worries about false trace with just olive oil. No hard oils to set back up.

Great! One thing less to worry about.

I never worry about temperature with my recipes, as I do not do fancy swirls or anything. I mix the oils, mix the NaOH with the water, then dump the hot NaOH/water mixture into the oils.

I’m currently not into the decorative aspect of soap making, which means that I have even one less thing to worry about.

But when making a Castile, i.e. only having olive oil, when using the room temperature method – can I mix when the lye water is at 180 °F? There is nothing to prepare, so there is little that I can occupy my time with while waiting for it to cool down – I only have one oil.

 

[penelopejane]

I would be a bit concerned that your Castile hasn't set one day later.

 

[Seawolfe]

Are you using a stick blender? It takes a looong time to get to trace, or even emulsion if you are making castile soap and not using a stick blender. And is your scale pretty accurate? You can check by weighing coins of known weight. Also, silicone loaf molds seem to take longer for the soap to harden up in some cases.

And yes, you can use the really hot lye solution, some people even use that heat transfer to melt solid fats. When working with liquid oils I prefer to let the lye cool a bit (say 130-150 deg F), just so I don't have hot lava soap batter.

 

[alexanderte]

I would be a bit concerned that your Castile hasn't set one day later.

I hope it’s because of the silicon molds – first time I’ve ever used them. Other than that I remember that the trace felt a bit thin. And – as I might already have mentioned, I mixed when lye water was at 95 ºF. What will happen if the trace is too thin? Will it take a longer to saponify – or will it not saponify at all?

Are you using a stick blender? It takes a looong time to get to trace, or even emulsion if you are making castile soap and not using a stick blender.

I’m using a stick blender.

And is your scale pretty accurate? You can check by weighing coins of known weight. Also, silicone loaf molds seem to take longer for the soap to harden up in some cases.

I think so. I paid around $40 for it. I remember on the packaging it said that it was precise down to +/- 1 gram.

And yes, you can use the really hot lye solution, some people even use that heat transfer to melt solid fats. When working with liquid oils I prefer to let the lye cool a bit (say 130-150 deg F), just so I don't have hot lava soap batter.

Thanks! Very good to know that I don’t need to worry about the temperature for this particular recipe.

 

[Arimara]

Are you using a stick blender? It takes a looong time to get to trace, or even emulsion if you are making castile soap and not using a stick blender. And is your scale pretty accurate? You can check by weighing coins of known weight. Also, silicone loaf molds seem to take longer for the soap to harden up in some cases.

And yes, you can use the really hot lye solution, some people even use that heat transfer to melt solid fats. When working with liquid oils I prefer to let the lye cool a bit (say 130-150 deg F), just so I don't have hot lava soap batter.

Better than me. I just pour the lye as soon as the temp starts to decrease and mix it with my oils until they're all melted. I only heat up my oils if I use cocoa butter or any of the solid palms.

 

[topofmurrayhill]

Other than that I remember that the trace felt a bit thin. What will happen if the trace is too thin? Will it take a longer to saponify – or will it not saponify at all?

Very thin trace can slow down saponification, but whether this is noticeable depends on your recipe and procedure. It can become important when you are making a recipe that saponifies slowly by its nature.

Trace is a convenient approximation of the point at which the soap batter is not likely to separate when you stop mixing. This applies best to recipes that contain a balance of hard and soft oils. Extra measures are called for in the case of a soft-oil recipe like castile. At 25% lye concentration or a very light trace the batter is likely to separate to some extent. For castile you should use a water discount and be sure to get a good trace.

Separation at least results in the soap on top being slightly different from the soap on the bottom. In more extreme cases the soap can be oily on top and lye heavy at the bottom, or the batch can fail entirely.

 

[ngian]

Thanks! Very good to know that I don’t need to worry about the temperature for this particular recipe.

Well in case you are using Virgin Olive oil, you should only use a whisk while mixing with high temperature.

 

[Susie]

Well in case you are using Virgin Olive oil, you should only use a whisk while mixing with high temperature.

Not that I would spend the extra money for VOO or EVOO, but why?

 

[earlene]

Not that I would spend the extra money for VOO or EVOO, but why?

Sometimes it is actually cheaper.