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Please help me with this recipe for a dishwashing soap

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Startree

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Good day any help please. I made a Tallow 60% Coconut oil 40% dish soap. 27%Water/Lye and 0%SF. It bubbles way better than the 100% Tallow bar I used to make except that after a few uses (days), fine lines start appearing which develop into cracks and eventually breaks off after a bit more use.

I am wondering if its the the Ccocnut Oil / Tallow ratio cos my 100% Tallow bar didnt crack.
Or is it the water / lye ratio?

The dish soap is for hard water conditions so I need to add CO.

Use Conditions:
I use it at the kitchen sink intermittently throughout the day. So wet/dry in between uses. It sits on a soap tray. The soaps were made in cavity molds so no cutting was involved.

re: Cracks:
After only a few uses (few days) it starts shows sign that its going to crack.

Hoping you can help me.

Thanks in advance
 

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earlene

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Hi, Startree. I am responding to this thread in hopes the other one (goes away.) If you go to the one that has the earlier post time and EDIT it to say "duplicate, please remove" then one of the admins can delete it, hide it or whatever to prevent multiple responses to both threads. Or you can send a message to one of the admins and request its removal.

Regarding your question:
I have another question: What was the lye:water ratio for the 100% tallow dishsoap? Was it the same?
I see with this one it is a 36.7% Lye Concentration or 1:1.7 (lye:water).

Also did you use Sheep Tallow in the 100% tallow soap as you did in this one?
How long did you let this soap cure before you started using it? And, was it the same length of time you let the Only Tallow soap cure before use?
 

DeeAnna

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The cracks happen because there there are layers of different types of soap molecules. Layers of soap that are more water soluble are sandwiched between layers of soap that are less soluble. The more-soluble soap liquefies easier and washes away faster. This causes the cracks you see.

Frequent wetting and drying can make soap more likely to have these cracks. Be sure the soap can drain well and dry as much as possible between uses.

Also, the way you make the soap may affect how likely the soap is to crack like this. Can you explain how you make the soap, please?
 

Startree

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The cracks happen because there there are layers of different types of soap molecules. Layers of soap that are more water soluble are sandwiched between layers of soap that are less soluble. The more-soluble soap liquefies easier and washes away faster. This causes the cracks you see.

Frequent wetting and drying can make soap more likely to have these cracks. Be sure the soap can drain well and dry as much as possible between uses.

Also, the way you make the soap may affect how likely the soap is to crack like this. Can you explain how you make the soap, please?
Hi DeeAnna thanks for reply, I use the cold process method.
 

Startree

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Hi, Startree. I am responding to this thread in hopes the other one (goes away.) If you go to the one that has the earlier post time and EDIT it to say "duplicate, please remove" then one of the admins can delete it, hide it or whatever to prevent multiple responses to both threads. Or you can send a message to one of the admins and request its removal.

Regarding your question:
I have another question: What was the lye:water ratio for the 100% tallow dishsoap? Was it the same?
I see with this one it is a 36.7% Lye Concentration or 1:1.7 (lye:water).

Also did you use Sheep Tallow in the 100% tallow soap as you did in this one?
How long did you let this soap cure before you started using it? And, was it the same length of time you let the Only Tallow soap cure before use?
Hi Earlene
The Lye / Water ratio was set at 27% for the 100% Tallow. OMG! I only saw now that I am stating the % Water to Oils all the time. I'm sorry for misleading you, it seems I've been interpreting things wrong all the time as I usuallu just change the "Water as % of Oil" number and think I am changing the Water/Lye ratio. I'm so happy for posting here cos it teaches me so fast. Ok so I;ll post the Soap calc image for the 100% Tallow.

Previous was the same Tallow yes and I used it after 4-6 weeks. This batch is 3 weeks old. So 1 week difference before use.

Thanks for your dedicated assistance
 

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DeeAnna

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Hi DeeAnna thanks for reply, I use the cold process method.
Problem is there are as many ways of making cold process soap as there are soap makers. Knowing this is okay, but more details are needed when trying to troubleshoot a problem.

I am asking about how YOU make soap.

For example -- Do you fully melt the fats before starting to make the soap? How warm is the soap batter when you start? Do you use a whisk or a stick blender to mix the soap batter? Do you try to get the soap to go into gel or do you keep it cold? Do you add fragrance? What are any other additives? Information like that.
 

Startree

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Problem is there are as many ways of making cold process soap as there are soap makers. Knowing this is okay, but more details are needed when trying to troubleshoot a problem.

I am asking about how YOU make soap.

For example -- Do you fully melt the fats before starting to make the soap? How warm is the soap batter when you start? Do you use a whisk or a stick blender to mix the soap batter? Do you try to get the soap to go into gel or do you keep it cold? Do you add fragrance? What are any other additives? Information like that.
Oh Ok, thank you I understand...

I melt the oils. Leave them to cool down to room temp (still liquid). Ps. I dont have a thermometer. The lye water is also left to cool down to room temp. I combine and stick blend until emulsified and light trace. Thereafter i remove stick blend. I pour at medium trace. I place a box over the molds but no further towels or anything. This particular soap has no additives - No colour, No scent.

Thank you for your help. I'm really desperate cos this bacth needs to go to a customer and I need to remake fast but unsure how to proceed.

Thank you so much again


DeeAnna now that I understand the mistake Imade in reading the soap calc, would you say more or less water?
I'm also wondering if the ratio of Coconut Oil to Tallow is too high. SHould I take it down to mayne 80% Tallow / 20% Coconut oil? Change the Water/Lye ratio maybe? [This is with reference to my 1st recipe attached in my start of this thread]
 

DeeAnna

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There is a lot of tallow in this soap. It needs to be melted until it is fully clear, not milky, before you start to make the soap. You might be doing this, but it wasn't clear from your description.

I would also soap a little warmer than room temperature to ensure the tallow stays fully melted in the soap batter. I would suggest soaping around 100 F / 40 C. This will be pleasantly warm to the touch, but while you are troubleshooting and learning, it would be best to use a thermometer so you have a clear idea about what temps work best for this recipe.

Another thought to try -- Continue to stick blend the soap batter until you are ready to pour the soap into the mold. I don't think it needs a lot of mixing -- just a second or two every so often -- but it needs more than you're giving it. I suspect (not sure -- this is just a guess) that your soap is "stratifying" (forming layers) and needs a bit of intense mixing to break those layers up.
 

Startree

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Yes I do melt it completely until it is clear. Thanks. I will take all your advice. :thumbup: :);)
 
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