[newbie] I finally made decent soap !

[Gaspar Navarrete]

Hello everyone,

Just wanted to say that I successfully made a 2lb hot-process batch of castile soap (just pomace olive oil) ! I was beaming. I took several samples from the batch and tested them (in a water & alcohol solution) with phenolphtalein, and it was clear. So chances are it is not caustic !


Some thoughts and reflections.

When the soap was ready to go into the mold, it had the texture and viscosity of mashed potatoes. Doing color swirls in the mold would be impossible with my soap. Here's why I think it had this texture: There was a dark area that started at the edge of the mixture and over time it expanded toward the center of the mixture. After about 2 hours of slow cooking on "low" in the crock-pot, the entire mixture was dark. I suppose that is when the mixture is ready to be poured into the mold. Is that right ? As far as I can tell, the only way to do swirls is to forego this color transformation of the mixture and pour it into the mold sooner, when it is more liquid. But then you are defeating the purpose of the hot-process !

Someone remarked that there was a strong smell when the soap was put into the mold. The smell did go away after a while.

Since the phenolphtalein solution was clear (I never saw a red flash), the guidelines say that the pH of my soap is between 7 and 8.2. However, people have said that phenolphtalein is not all that accurate, and can be off by as much as two points. This means that my soap's pH is between 5 and 10(which is still the safe range) Once I saw that it was clear, I did a zap test with my tongue - no zap. I think I can say that my soap is safe to use, is that right ? I hope I'm testing my soap correctly.

I used pomace olive oil and Roebic Drain Opener lye (which is industrial grade). Both the lye and oil probably have chemical impurities in them. I wonder how much. I was thinking of switching to 100% virgin olive oil and food grade lye. This way, I will have much less impurities in my soap. My soap will be healthier for the skin. As an aside, I could then use a 4% (or maybe 3%) lye discount.

Since the ingredients are olive oil, lye, and water, my soap does not have any preservatives. I might have to refrigerate the soaps, until I am ready to use them.

For your reference: The recipe was 2lb Sadaf brand pomace olive oil, 4 oz Roebic lye (6% discount), and 10 oz water.

Thanks for your input.


PS: In the picture below, the holes in the middle of some of the slices was where I gouged out several samples of soap to use for the pH test. The white spots embedded in the soap were from the heated sides of the crock pot. They dried up before the rest of the mixture and got mixed in.

 

[Obsidian]

Your soap looks good. If it passed the zap test then yes, its safe to use but you still need to let it cure for at least 4 weeks.

I wouldn't use virgin olive oil, its makes a greenish colored soap and is usually more expensive. Pomice olive oil is actually the best for soap. If you can go to Costco, kirkland olive oil has tested pure and is used by many soapers including me.
Drain cleaner lye is perfectly safe for soap, no need to use food grade unless you really want to or the price is right.

 

[Susie]

Congratulations! Good job! I think swirls are usually reserved for CP. I just don't see how you could swirl HP soap.

I use(still have a tiny bit) Roebic Lye. It is 100% sodium hydroxide. Nothing else. I researched it before buying it, and have further researched it since. I can buy it cheaper through Essential Depot(and have a brand new bottle waiting on me), but if I were to run out, then it is easy enough to dash to Lowe's to pick up more. So, while you can make the swap easily, you just won't get more pure than the Roebic.

 

[grayceworks]

I use EVOO, but I'm just kinda picky that way, and don't mind the yellowish cast -- it cures to a barely cream color usually, and if I want white, I add TD. I got scared off of using pomace by reading some of the labels with what other oils they had in them. I might try that one you mentioned Obsidian, I do have a Costco membership, so I'll check it out.

I have decided that I much prefer HP castile to CP castile. I think you will too! And your soaps turned out great!


You can color your soap all one color by adding the color into the lye-water or the oils from the start, or add it with your fragrance at the end, or anywhere in between. If I want a kinda swirly marble effect, I sprinkle it on top while it's doing its "folding over" stage, right before it's finished. It will pretty much mix and swirl itself in. I haven't really tried any other types of swirls with HP, but I've seen some articles where other people do.

 

[seven]

you can swirl your hp soap. there's a lady on youtube who does it. she did a hanger swirl you'll need sodium lactate though. it'll make the batter into a more workable consistency.

 

[shunt2011]

I too use the olive oil from Costco and have been doing so for many years with no problem. I get 2- 3 liter bottles for 26.00. Your soap looks good. Also your PH isn't accurate as handmade soap normally has a ph of 8-10.5. I would just make sure it doesn't zap an you will be fine. There are soapers who have beautiful swirled HP. Congratulations on your first soap!

 

[Obsidian]

Pomice has more unsaponifiables in it so will produce a more conditioning soap then other grades of OO. I would use pomice but I can get regular OO cheaper.
Almost all OO tested in America has came back as adulterated with other oils, only kirkland OO from costco tested as pure OO. I use it for soap and cooking.

 

[yadonm]

I always use police and I've never been unhappy with the outcome.

 

[pattime]

Congratulations, looks great!

 

[grayceworks]

Sounds like I need to put my costco card to use.

 

[judymoody]

Congratulations on your soap! Your Castille will still benefit from a nice long cure, even though you did HP. Enjoy!

 

[Gaspar Navarrete]

To

Hello everyone,

I have to wait 4 weeks for the soap to cure ? I thought that hot-process soap was ready to use one day afterwards. Or seven days at the most, if I wanted most of the water to evaporate and leave a harder bar. I thought that only cold-process soaps need a minimum of 4 weeks to cure.

I will take a look at the Kirkland Olive Oil at Costco. I did not know about this.

I was apprehensive and reticent about pomace olive oil because people said that some of the chemicals that are used to extract the olive oil from the meat of the olive (the pomace) get left behind in the olive oil. I also heard that some of these lyes that are not food-grade have heavy metals in them, like arsenic. Your reponses are reassuring.

 

[Seawolfe]

I bought some of the Cosco Kirkland OO (not the EVOO, just the OO) and Im very happy with it.

The general consensus seems to be that while HP soaps go through saponification by the end of the cook, and CAN be used as soap, its qualities will be much better for curing a few weeks. Just like beer can be drunk after fermentation, its much better for aging a few months. I read one post that HP really only saves you about 2-4 days in the cure, which kind of makes sense - compare a CP bar a and an HP bar at 4 days or a week and there is not much difference. That said, I am an impatient little weasel and have been known to use scraps of all my soaps quite early just to see the improvement.

Edit to add: I dont think its a good idea to get hung up on pH indicators unless you have access to a lab or some professional equipment for the simple fact that you don't want to rely on an unreliable method. I've seen many a post where people report happily that their soap is around pH 7, and that is simply impossible unless you forgot the lye. By its very nature soap is alkaline, if it wasn't it wouldn't clean.

 

[Gaspar Navarrete]

Seawolfe,

So if one wants good soap, then there really is no point in doing the hot-process. One would have to wait more or less the same amount of time.

Regarding phenolphthalein. Yes, I also have heard that it is inaccurate. The guidelines say that pheno will be clear when the pH is less than 8.2. However, the pheno inaccuracy is plus or minus 2 points (from what I gather). That means that the pheno could be clear when the pH is actually 8.2+(2points) or 10.2 or less ! Well that is still in the safe pH range for soaps. So wouldn't clear pheno (with no red flash) at least indicate that the soap is somewhere in the safe range ?

 

[Seawolfe]

Hot process has it's uses. It allows you to decide which fat is the superfat, for instance. And there's fewer things to go wrong after the cook.

I've never used pheno with soap, perhaps if the sampling technique is sound you are correct. Just sounds like a lot of trouble to me - I'm a zap test kinda gal.

Seawolfe,

So if one wants good soap, then there really is no point in doing the hot-process. One would have to wait more or less the same amount of time.

Regarding phenolphthalein. Yes, I also have heard that it is inaccurate. The guidelines say that pheno will be clear when the pH is less than 8.2. However, the pheno inaccuracy is plus or minus 2 points (from what I gather). That means that the pheno could be clear when the pH is actually 8.2+(2points) or 10.2 or less ! Well that is still in the safe pH range for soaps. So wouldn't clear pheno (with no red flash) at least indicate that the soap is somewhere in the safe range ?

 

[Gaspar Navarrete]

JudyMoody mentioned that my soap would benefit from a nice long cure.

I thought that my soap was fully saponified because it gelled completely. What does "curing" mean ? Does it mean all the water evaporating out of the soap and the bar hardening ?

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

It means water evaporating and the bar hardening, yes. But also it just mellows out a lot in general - an older bar will lather better and last longer than a young bar.

I do HP and cure for 4 weeks. I use a bar after 2 weeks regardless of the method used, just because I want to play with it! But for the other bars I wait 4 weeks.

A Castile can require even longer. Some people don't use a Castile until it is 1 YEAR old!

CP soap is also ready quite early on, just not as soon as HP. HP is great for adding things that we don't want the lye to react with, such as a butter or scents - some FOs can cause issues when making CP soap, but adding them to the soap in HP after it has cooled down removes that worry.

 

[BabyPickles106]

I think the soap looks really nice.

After reading the post I feel like I've a lot more studying to do. Why do some let Castille soap cure for a year or more?

 

[Gaspar Navarrete]

What about refrigeration ?

Since my soap doesn't have preservatives, it will spoil sooner than the store-bought soap. Should I put the bars into the fridge ?

Also, do anyone know of a website that lists the shelf life of typical kinds of handmade soaps ?

Thanks

 

[Gaspar Navarrete]

Also,

Someone remarked that there was a strong smell when my soap was put into the mold. The smell did go away after a while.

Do you know what this might be ?

Thanks