New soaper needs advice about local ingredients

Discussion in 'Soap Making Recipes & Tutorials' started by prionoo, Mar 10, 2015.

Help Support Soapmaking Forum by donating:

  1. Mar 10, 2015 #1

    prionoo

    prionoo

    prionoo

    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2015
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi. I am very new to all that but I am keen to get over my first failure. I would like to create a recipe from just local ingredients.
    As I live in UK and we don't have palm or olive or whatever oil I mostly think about canola/rapeseed, sunflowers and as a hobby beekeeper as well as beeswax and honey. Rape would be my top choice.

    Unfortunately both of them don't give me values on soapcalc to achieve a well balanced soup. So I started compromising and thought that my soup needs to have at least 51% local ingredients. So here is my question: which oils would you suggest to get a balanced recipe/ result with as little as possible foreign ingredients. Thanks a million...
     
  2. Mar 10, 2015 #2

    Susie

    Susie

    Susie

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2013
    Messages:
    9,218
    Likes Received:
    8,417
    Location:
    Texas
    I think you should be able to purchase lard and/or tallow there. I know they have cattle and pigs, and those are a part of the diet. Therefore, you should at least be able to contact your local butchers to see if they carry it. But, you truly should be able to purchase it in your local stores.
     
    Lye-h20-oil likes this.
  3. Mar 10, 2015 #3

    dixiedragon

    dixiedragon

    dixiedragon

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2013
    Messages:
    6,111
    Likes Received:
    4,603
    Location:
    Birmingham, Alabama, USA
    Millersoap.com has a lot of recipes.

    Canola/rapeseed is not a great choice, I think sunflower is better.

    I would do something like:
    Lard/tallow 45%
    Sunflower or rapeseed 25%
    Beeswax 5%
    Coconut 20% (I know this isn't local, but coconut is sooo important for lather!)
    Castor 5% (again, not local but awesome for lather)
    I use 1 tablespoon of honey per pound of oils. So in UK terms, one spoonful of honey for ever 500 grams of oil.
     
  4. Mar 10, 2015 #4

    prionoo

    prionoo

    prionoo

    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2015
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi. Thanks a lot. I didn't want to use animal fat as I want the soap as a gift for my honey costumers but some of them are veggies. Dixie: lb and oz is imperial. British empire... Still in use as ever. (16lb in a stone)
    Thank you for the advice on amount of honey to oil.

    So I assume that rape and sunflower have similar properties. And I assume that there is no veggie oil which can compensate solely the lack of rape or sunflower? My second choice would be European oils like olive before I would need to cross the water.
     
  5. Mar 10, 2015 #5

    dixiedragon

    dixiedragon

    dixiedragon

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2013
    Messages:
    6,111
    Likes Received:
    4,603
    Location:
    Birmingham, Alabama, USA
    IMO, rapeseed oil doesn't really bring anything to the soap. I consider it a filler oil. It doesn't contribute to hardness, cleansing or bubbles. It adds some conditioning, but so will every other oil except maybe coconut. Sunflower adds to lather somewhat and is not prone to rancidity like rapeseed.

    You could make a soap that's mostly rapeseed, but it will be a soft soap that does not lather well or clean well.

    Check out this link:
    http://www.zensoaps.com/singleoil.htm

    Here's a starting point for an all-veggie recipe:
    20% coconut
    40% rapeseed or sunflower
    5% beeswax
    30% olive
    5% castor
    Olive oil is one of the "holy trinity" of soap making oils (palm, olive and coconut for veggie soapers or lard/tallow, olive and coconut for non-veggies). I left it out of the first recipe in the interest of getting in as many local ingredients as possible.

    PS: Get high oleic sunflower and rapeseed to help prolong shelflife. Also maybe add some ROE - rosemary oleirin extract to fight oxidation. I don't use it b/c I don't use rapeseed and I only use 5% sunflower, but many soapers swear by it.

    If I were you, I'd offer a veggie and a non veggie soap.

    Are you absolutely committed to no palm?
     
    Susie likes this.
  6. Mar 10, 2015 #6

    Trix

    Trix

    Trix

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2015
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    48
    Is ordering from a UK based supplier also out of the question?
    I'm gathering a list of UK suppliers atm, but these guys seem to have everything and are bad in Bideford, Devon, but naturally ship all over
    http://www.thesoapkitchen.co.uk
     
  7. Mar 10, 2015 #7

    prionoo

    prionoo

    prionoo

    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2015
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hey Dixie. Thanks again. I am fine with palm as long as the main ingredient/s is local. I already ordered some coconut oil as I recognised that I couldn't live without it. Palm - I don't really have an opinion about it but a lot of forest is being chopped down for alternative palm oil fuel. Perhaps there are people saying the same about coconut. And huge mono culture rapeseed fields are not good either. I am not that conscious but some people are and I am rather a back to nature beekeeper too. But open to suggestions. My priority is to get a decently working and satisfying basic recipe as I already had some disappointments and 4 weeks curing time don't make the learning curve steep. I am not inpatient just trying to avoid more tapping in the dark.

    Rancidity. I read that rape keeps quite well. 1-2 years as a soap. I guess that is not true then.

    Hi tgool. Thank you for that. It doesn't make a difference if I order palm oil from a UK supplier or get it myself. Its still foreign. I checked the website. Plenty things like hemp, wheat, plum, rosehip and so on are grown in Europe or UK but this website doesn't say where they source it from. That is rather important to me.
     
  8. Mar 10, 2015 #8

    dixiedragon

    dixiedragon

    dixiedragon

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2013
    Messages:
    6,111
    Likes Received:
    4,603
    Location:
    Birmingham, Alabama, USA
    You may have to email individual companies and ask them where they get their ingredients.

    Other options for UK sourced items to include in your soaps could include lavender (I know there are lavender farms in the UK), oats, barley and milk.
     
  9. Mar 11, 2015 #9

    The Efficacious Gentleman

    The Efficacious Gentleman

    The Efficacious Gentleman

    Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    8,930
    Likes Received:
    8,867
    Location:
    Austria
    You might well just have to live with a less than wonderful bar if you want a veggie, mostly local UK soap. Or go 10% CO, 39% palm, 51% local oil.

    If you are giving it to customers, I am not sure if you would still need to get an SA and register it on the EU portal - I think that trading standards would want you to do so as these people might be classed (to the TA office, anyway) more as customers than friends.
     
  10. Mar 11, 2015 #10

    Birdie Wife

    Birdie Wife

    Birdie Wife

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2012
    Messages:
    131
    Likes Received:
    71
    I'm also UK based. I use local wherever possible too, but from necessity I've had to make compromises. I render tallow (beef fat) from a local butcher, who would otherwise throw it away, instead of palm oil because I feel it's both more local and more ethical. For veggies I use coconut, olive and castor oils. Fortunately I live in an area with few vegetarians and I've rarely been asked for a veggie bar. I steer them towards my salt bars which are mostly coconut with a high sf. Olive is good and relatively local - how about doing a castile/bastile bar?

    Local additives I use are oatmeal, honey, milk, beer, and carrots. I gather and dry seaweed, nettles, dandelions too and I'm hoping to grow enough calendulas this year to add those to the list. The most popular ones are the oatmeal/honey combo, and seaweed.
     
    Nanette likes this.
  11. Mar 11, 2015 #11

    The Efficacious Gentleman

    The Efficacious Gentleman

    The Efficacious Gentleman

    Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    8,930
    Likes Received:
    8,867
    Location:
    Austria
    Just a little semi-hijack - how did your SA view self-rendered tallow?
     
  12. Mar 11, 2015 #12

    dixiedragon

    dixiedragon

    dixiedragon

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2013
    Messages:
    6,111
    Likes Received:
    4,603
    Location:
    Birmingham, Alabama, USA
    I am wondering if you use Fair Trade palm and coconut if it might "balance out" the fact that they aren't local? And if you use tallow and lard from free-range pigs and cows?

    If I were you, I'd start experimenting. Your customers maybe happy with a soap that's 5% beeswax and 95% canola. Not everyone is is picky about soap as soapers.

    For example - it chaps my hide when I visit family and they have a bar of Dial by the sink.
     
  13. Mar 12, 2015 #13

    Melodyuk

    Melodyuk

    Melodyuk

    Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2015
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    5
  14. Apr 8, 2015 #14

    zolveria

    zolveria

    zolveria

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2015
    Messages:
    420
    Likes Received:
    197
    Location:
    Hudson Vally NY
    here is one
    40% coconut oil
    25% rice bran oil ( replaces olive oil )
    2% soybean oil ( vegetable Oil) look at the ingirdients
    2% Stearic Acid ( hardener )
    8 % Lard ( pig or beef) Local grocery store should have this. ( beef tallow or pig lard)
    run that through http://soapcalc.net/calc/SoapCalcWP.asp
     
  15. Oct 23, 2018 #15

    Mica Hamilton

    Mica Hamilton

    Mica Hamilton

    Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    London
    Depending on where in the UK you are, I strongly suggest checking the foods of the world isle for 2.45 p/500g jars of coconut oil (it's the same brand that sells on amazon/ebay for 7/8 quid a jar) and checking small middle eastern corner shops for olive oil, I manage to get mine for 9.99 p/5 litres in London.
     
  16. Oct 23, 2018 #16

    IrishLass

    IrishLass

    IrishLass

    Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2008
    Messages:
    15,019
    Likes Received:
    8,907
    Location:
    Right here, silly!
    Hi Mica- you may want to check the dates of threads before posting. This is a very old thread. MelodyUK who you quoted has not been active on the forum for almost 2 years, and unfortunately will not have seen your answer. And also the OP, Prionoo, hasn't been on the forum since 2015.


    IrishLass :)
     
  17. Oct 23, 2018 #17

    Mica Hamilton

    Mica Hamilton

    Mica Hamilton

    Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    London
    Apologies, I didn't think to check the date. I'd gone too far back in the forums and hadn't realised.
     
  18. Oct 23, 2018 #18

    IrishLass

    IrishLass

    IrishLass

    Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2008
    Messages:
    15,019
    Likes Received:
    8,907
    Location:
    Right here, silly!
    No worries! :)


    IrishLass :)
     
  19. Mar 24, 2019 #19

    Gnat

    Gnat

    Gnat

    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2018
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    switzerland
    Hello everyone. I have a question concerning selling soap at the market. Can cold process soap melt????? I live in Switzerland so the tempertures are never really that hot. But in a sunny spot on the market someone asked me if I wasn't worried about my soap melting.
    Good question.
     
  20. Mar 24, 2019 #20

    artemis

    artemis

    artemis

    Mostly Harmless

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2016
    Messages:
    1,469
    Likes Received:
    2,033
    Location:
    Sol system, Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
    I think if you take this question (just copy and paste it) into a new thread of it's own, you will get the attention of a lot of long-time soapers with market experience.
     

Share This Page