MiniBee
Member
Thank you so much Craig. That is exactly what I'm doing. I can't wait to try it out. 
My first shaving soap is a success!
- Thread starter songwind
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DanielCoffey
Well-Known Member
Well as promised, here is a picture and review of my first shaving soap batch. It was a resounding success and has resulted in the exile of several tubs of Proraso to the local charity shop.
I based the proportions in the recipe to match the guide on Lee's Silver Fox 1.0 blog. Many thanks, Lee, for taking so much time to post pictures and write up the process so thoroughly.
I bought myself a small 2L crockpot and used the excuse of soap making to treat myself to some new scales... a 6000x1g set and a 500x0.1g one for weighing the small quantities of things like KOH and butters. Apart from that, all I needed was to rummage in the kitchen for unused spatulas, steel spoons and similar.
Due to water loss in the long time in the crockpot the finished "taters" lump was opaque white. Folks were right in that it is pretty difficult to transfer to its new home without getting it all over the sides of the tubs. As it aged over the first week it went from a slightly creamy white to a pure white.
Thanks are due to DeeAnna for her suggestion of Lavender, Rosemary and Wild Mint EOs. We really like the fresh and slightly herbal result.
Fats were 45% Stearic Acid, 25% Coconut Oil, 20% Tallow, 5% Lanolin, 5% Shea Butter and 5% super-fatted. Total fats in this batch were scaled to to 400g. I added 11% Glycerin. The lye was just 90% pure KOH at 33% strength of course. The only additive was 0.5% tetrasodium EDTA.
Final yield was four tubs of about 165g. I used some clean round tubs with 300ml capacity which allows me to use them for brush loading. No labels since it is for personal use only.
I made myself promise to leave it for a full week and ceremonially cleaned my shaving brush (Kent BK8) ready for the switch-over. As expected it was very keen to lather and made a rich, dense and smooth lather that was very, very persistent. Folks who have showed it on the brushes have said it is stable for a long time and I certainly agree with that.
Cleaning up was easy and it rinsed out well. We are in a soft water area and it did leave the expected soap ring. Since my old Proraso also included EDTA (along with a few other things), I was anticipating a ring on our stainless steel basins. It was very simple to clean.
I always moisturise after a shave anyway but I did feel that this shaving soap resulted in a less harsh shave than the Proraso. I know the blade was new and I was being careful but after washing my skin felt less tight. A quick moisturise later and I was comfortable.
The end result certainly passed the wifely "kiss test", so a resounding success in my opinion!
Once again, thanks everyone for the comments throughout this thread. It was most useful. I promise to keep going with soaps. Once we have moved I definitely need some laundry soap and some CP soap for hand-washing. Since we are moving in a month or so I figured it would be better to wait till we were in the new place rather than trying to transport some part-cured bars.
I based the proportions in the recipe to match the guide on Lee's Silver Fox 1.0 blog. Many thanks, Lee, for taking so much time to post pictures and write up the process so thoroughly.
I bought myself a small 2L crockpot and used the excuse of soap making to treat myself to some new scales... a 6000x1g set and a 500x0.1g one for weighing the small quantities of things like KOH and butters. Apart from that, all I needed was to rummage in the kitchen for unused spatulas, steel spoons and similar.
Due to water loss in the long time in the crockpot the finished "taters" lump was opaque white. Folks were right in that it is pretty difficult to transfer to its new home without getting it all over the sides of the tubs. As it aged over the first week it went from a slightly creamy white to a pure white.
Thanks are due to DeeAnna for her suggestion of Lavender, Rosemary and Wild Mint EOs. We really like the fresh and slightly herbal result.
Fats were 45% Stearic Acid, 25% Coconut Oil, 20% Tallow, 5% Lanolin, 5% Shea Butter and 5% super-fatted. Total fats in this batch were scaled to to 400g. I added 11% Glycerin. The lye was just 90% pure KOH at 33% strength of course. The only additive was 0.5% tetrasodium EDTA.
Final yield was four tubs of about 165g. I used some clean round tubs with 300ml capacity which allows me to use them for brush loading. No labels since it is for personal use only.
I made myself promise to leave it for a full week and ceremonially cleaned my shaving brush (Kent BK8) ready for the switch-over. As expected it was very keen to lather and made a rich, dense and smooth lather that was very, very persistent. Folks who have showed it on the brushes have said it is stable for a long time and I certainly agree with that.
Cleaning up was easy and it rinsed out well. We are in a soft water area and it did leave the expected soap ring. Since my old Proraso also included EDTA (along with a few other things), I was anticipating a ring on our stainless steel basins. It was very simple to clean.
I always moisturise after a shave anyway but I did feel that this shaving soap resulted in a less harsh shave than the Proraso. I know the blade was new and I was being careful but after washing my skin felt less tight. A quick moisturise later and I was comfortable.
The end result certainly passed the wifely "kiss test", so a resounding success in my opinion!
Once again, thanks everyone for the comments throughout this thread. It was most useful. I promise to keep going with soaps. Once we have moved I definitely need some laundry soap and some CP soap for hand-washing. Since we are moving in a month or so I figured it would be better to wait till we were in the new place rather than trying to transport some part-cured bars.
Yay! Congratulations on your first success! :clap:
IrishLass
IrishLass
It is a somewhat sticky soap if you made Songwind's original recipe or the variations later in this thread. It's just the nature of the beast.
The added glycerin compensates for the lack of "natural" glycerin that comes from using stearic acid. I've added 12% ppo as well and that much works fine, IMO.
Furthermore, you're less than halfway through the cure period, so I also counsel patience, grasshopper. Don't be in a hurry to do something to the soap to "fix" it. With time, the soap will cure into a waxy firm paste.
The added glycerin compensates for the lack of "natural" glycerin that comes from using stearic acid. I've added 12% ppo as well and that much works fine, IMO.
Furthermore, you're less than halfway through the cure period, so I also counsel patience, grasshopper. Don't be in a hurry to do something to the soap to "fix" it. With time, the soap will cure into a waxy firm paste.
MiniBee
Member
Love it!!!
After reading thru the entire thread I have made my first attempt of Songwind's awesome shaving recipe. I did a few alterations from recommendations I found in the thread. 75 KOH/25 NaOH, added some shea and castor oil to the original recipe. Melted the oils and added the lye first, got it to a pudding like trace and then added the stearic acid (thank you Deanna for that suggestion). Reserved some of the shea for a super fat after the cook and I also added 15% glycerin and 1% sodium lactate at the very end. Scented it with just a simple Lavender Essential. Got it in some 8 oz jar and let it sit for a week so far. Let me just say WOW!!!! I love it. As Mark the Box Guy said " it lathers itself when I walk by it and wink." Thank you to all!!!
After reading thru the entire thread I have made my first attempt of Songwind's awesome shaving recipe. I did a few alterations from recommendations I found in the thread. 75 KOH/25 NaOH, added some shea and castor oil to the original recipe. Melted the oils and added the lye first, got it to a pudding like trace and then added the stearic acid (thank you Deanna for that suggestion). Reserved some of the shea for a super fat after the cook and I also added 15% glycerin and 1% sodium lactate at the very end. Scented it with just a simple Lavender Essential. Got it in some 8 oz jar and let it sit for a week so far. Let me just say WOW!!!! I love it. As Mark the Box Guy said " it lathers itself when I walk by it and wink."
Thank you to all!!!
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Okay, it's late and I'm tired, but I'll try to make this as coherent as possible.
I've made CP soap for about 23 years, and have recently decided, after numerous requests, to try to formulate a shaving soap.
Here's what I've formulated so far;
Stearic acid 45%
Palm kernel oil. 5%
Coconut oil. 5%
Sweet almond oil. 5%
Tallow. 30%
Castor oil. 5%
Kuikui nut oil. 5%
And now, surprise, surprise, I have questions!
I will be using potassium hydroxide. Is superfatting/lye discount something to be considered for shaving soap?
How does the recipe look to those of you not newbies to making shaving soap? I understand glycerin is another potential ingredient. How much of that is considered a good amount? Or is any at all considered a good thing?
What is the purpose of the Stearic acid?
Does it matter what kind of liquid is used? I make mostly goatsmilk soap, with an occasional beer or straight water (for the lovely EO blend that overheats really fast if I use anything BUT water!).Is goatsmilk a good thing to have in shaving soap?
Are there any other ingredients that might contribute to a lovely formula?
Any links to a good tutorial on HP soap making? I did hie myself to a local thrift store and get a crock pot, so I'm at least that far along.
Is curing time about the same for HP as CP, four to six weeks minimum?
Fragrance levels? What percentage is recommended for shaving soap? I use about 6% for my "bath" soaps. Should that be a lesser amount for shaving soap, particularly for facial shaving soap?
That's all I can think of for now. Anybody have any suggestions, hints, tips, or advice, whether what to do or what NOT to do, please speak up.
And my own thanks to all who have contributed to this thread.
Anita
I've made CP soap for about 23 years, and have recently decided, after numerous requests, to try to formulate a shaving soap.
Here's what I've formulated so far;
Stearic acid 45%
Palm kernel oil. 5%
Coconut oil. 5%
Sweet almond oil. 5%
Tallow. 30%
Castor oil. 5%
Kuikui nut oil. 5%
And now, surprise, surprise, I have questions!
I will be using potassium hydroxide. Is superfatting/lye discount something to be considered for shaving soap?
How does the recipe look to those of you not newbies to making shaving soap? I understand glycerin is another potential ingredient. How much of that is considered a good amount? Or is any at all considered a good thing?
What is the purpose of the Stearic acid?
Does it matter what kind of liquid is used? I make mostly goatsmilk soap, with an occasional beer or straight water (for the lovely EO blend that overheats really fast if I use anything BUT water!).Is goatsmilk a good thing to have in shaving soap?
Are there any other ingredients that might contribute to a lovely formula?
Any links to a good tutorial on HP soap making? I did hie myself to a local thrift store and get a crock pot, so I'm at least that far along.
Is curing time about the same for HP as CP, four to six weeks minimum?
Fragrance levels? What percentage is recommended for shaving soap? I use about 6% for my "bath" soaps. Should that be a lesser amount for shaving soap, particularly for facial shaving soap?
That's all I can think of for now. Anybody have any suggestions, hints, tips, or advice, whether what to do or what NOT to do, please speak up.
And my own thanks to all who have contributed to this thread.
Anita
LBussy
Well-Known Member
Absolutely. About 5% is what I use. As a consumer of shaving soaps, and having made my own for several years, I find I prefer soap made from KOH.
It strikes me as a little on the heavy side. I use a little more CO to assist getting the lather whipped up. 25% is what I use.
I use 11% of the oil weight in glycerin. More would not be horrible.
It provides a very dense, stable lather.
Yes, but not for why you would think. I know a good number of men might not really want to smear goat's milk on their faces. Beer might be okay. Remember it's not only about what makes a nice soap, but what will sell. Water works fine in my soap.
No, but there's no need for the castor oil ... it contributes properties that are at odds with what a man wants in a shave soap. IMHO of course.
Here's one I put together some time back:
http://www.silverfoxcrafts.com/shaving-soap/
Maybe. A longer cure is nice, but I have used soap that's a week old. If I were selling I'd wait a month.
Depends on the FO of course. Also, doing a HP you may lose more so you need to take that into consideration. This part will take some testing, but I'd start on the low side. One thing I dislike is my soap competing with my after shave or cologne.
Finally, a bit of advice you did not ask for: Find a known good shaving soap recipe and make that first. THEN, based on facts and real experience, diverge from that. Don't apply CP B&B experience here because for the most part it does not apply. What you think you like in soap may have nothing to do with what I as a man would want so also find someone who doesn't need to keep you happy and get some feedback. A husband or SO has to like what you do.
Have a look at that tutorial then come back and ask more questions. It's not the only way, but it does make a good soap and will serve as a starting point for your consideration regarding formulation and process.
I suggest that you actually read a thread before posting on it - a lot of those questions are answered in the previous posts!
DanielCoffey
Well-Known Member
Mind you, it did take me a few days to wade through the thousand or so posts when I tried to do that.
Lee's shaving soap above is a very good starting point and I did appreciate the pictures when I made mine a couple of months ago. I waited a week before using it and I did notice that in that time it changed colour from off-white to "whiter". It seemed to crystallise somewhat until it was all white.
DeeAnna suggests 3% for an EO in this soap and she likes Rosemary, Lavender and Wild Mint as a blend. It does add a nice fresh smell to the soap. Folks have mentioned the proportions in this thread somewhere. Search for Wild Mint and you should find it.
As for additives, I did add tetra-sodium EDTA at 0.5% of the overall weight to help suppress soap scum. It also works as a preventer of DOS.
I don't sell my soaps but my Dad immediately threw away his Prosaso soap in preference to mine which I would count as a success. It took me long enough to get him off the Supermarket spray-foam cans onto pucks of proper soap. He won't give up his disposable razor but at least he was using nicer soap. Now he is on Lee's Silver Fox recipe and loves it.
Lee's shaving soap above is a very good starting point and I did appreciate the pictures when I made mine a couple of months ago. I waited a week before using it and I did notice that in that time it changed colour from off-white to "whiter". It seemed to crystallise somewhat until it was all white.
DeeAnna suggests 3% for an EO in this soap and she likes Rosemary, Lavender and Wild Mint as a blend. It does add a nice fresh smell to the soap. Folks have mentioned the proportions in this thread somewhere. Search for Wild Mint and you should find it.
As for additives, I did add tetra-sodium EDTA at 0.5% of the overall weight to help suppress soap scum. It also works as a preventer of DOS.
I don't sell my soaps but my Dad immediately threw away his Prosaso soap in preference to mine which I would count as a success. It took me long enough to get him off the Supermarket spray-foam cans onto pucks of proper soap. He won't give up his disposable razor but at least he was using nicer soap. Now he is on Lee's Silver Fox recipe and loves it.
I have had very good luck with Lee Bussy's basic recipe. You can modify it some to suit, but stay close to the ratio of stearic acid to other fats.
Do not use olive oil, it's not really a good thing in shaving soap, wrong kind of lather.
I also suggest you decide what you want as superfat and hold those fats out of the pot until saponification is done (you will be hot processing due to the free stearic acid content) as adding them late helps insure that those specific fats are left after most of the rest are consumed by the lye. I use cocoa butter and shea butter, but lanolin is also nice.
What you are aiming for is a fatty acid profile of 50 to 60% stearic and palmitic acids, some myristic from the coconut oil, and around 15% oleic and linoleic aicds. Lots of ways to get there, but that high palmitic/stearic acid content is what makes the lather.
I don't particularly care for castor oil in my shaving soap, it seems to leave my face feeling sticky after shaving, but small amounts won't hurt anything.
My personal favorites are 50% SA, 20% coconut oil, 20% lard, and 5% each cocoa butter and shea butter, or 50% SA, 30% tallow, 10% coconut oil, and 5% each cocoa butter and shea butter. Complicated recipes aren't necessary, the heart and soul of shaving soap is very high stearic/palmitic acid with enough oleic and myristic to make it easy to lather up.
Use at least 60% KOH as lye (you can use 100%) and hot process.
As far a scent goes, I only want enough that I can't smell the tallow (although it's not really offensive), but that's me. Do remember that the lather will normally be applied to the upper lip and stay there for several minutes -- what's fine for body soap may be a bit much right under the nose!
Do not use olive oil, it's not really a good thing in shaving soap, wrong kind of lather.
I also suggest you decide what you want as superfat and hold those fats out of the pot until saponification is done (you will be hot processing due to the free stearic acid content) as adding them late helps insure that those specific fats are left after most of the rest are consumed by the lye. I use cocoa butter and shea butter, but lanolin is also nice.
What you are aiming for is a fatty acid profile of 50 to 60% stearic and palmitic acids, some myristic from the coconut oil, and around 15% oleic and linoleic aicds. Lots of ways to get there, but that high palmitic/stearic acid content is what makes the lather.
I don't particularly care for castor oil in my shaving soap, it seems to leave my face feeling sticky after shaving, but small amounts won't hurt anything.
My personal favorites are 50% SA, 20% coconut oil, 20% lard, and 5% each cocoa butter and shea butter, or 50% SA, 30% tallow, 10% coconut oil, and 5% each cocoa butter and shea butter. Complicated recipes aren't necessary, the heart and soul of shaving soap is very high stearic/palmitic acid with enough oleic and myristic to make it easy to lather up.
Use at least 60% KOH as lye (you can use 100%) and hot process.
As far a scent goes, I only want enough that I can't smell the tallow (although it's not really offensive), but that's me. Do remember that the lather will normally be applied to the upper lip and stay there for several minutes -- what's fine for body soap may be a bit much right under the nose!
CTAnton
Well-Known Member
I LOVE my shave soap. My friends LOVE my shave soap. I only have one small problem.
THEY LAST FOREVER!
I made several batches, each with a different combination of ingredients ,some with stearic acid, some with tallow. I think I got less than a dozen pucks out of each recipe.
That was back in March. I'm still on my first puck.I shave 2 or 3 times a week as do most of my friends and they're still on THEIR first puck. If,like me, you'd like to play around with different recipes, forget making small batches, make MICRO batches.
THEY LAST FOREVER!
I made several batches, each with a different combination of ingredients ,some with stearic acid, some with tallow. I think I got less than a dozen pucks out of each recipe.
That was back in March. I'm still on my first puck.I shave 2 or 3 times a week as do most of my friends and they're still on THEIR first puck. If,like me, you'd like to play around with different recipes, forget making small batches, make MICRO batches.
It takes very little soap to make good shaving lather when the soap is right, indeed. I've used my second batch 18 times, and the puck still has the lumpy surface visible and does not appear to be any smaller.
I figure each small (100 gr of oils) batch will last me at least a year of daily shaves.
Very easy to make a lifetime supply while fine tuning a recipe.
Shavers that insist on a quarter inch thick layer of hard foam instead of a thin layer of super slick, wet lather will use it up much faster though.
I figure each small (100 gr of oils) batch will last me at least a year of daily shaves.
Very easy to make a lifetime supply while fine tuning a recipe.
Shavers that insist on a quarter inch thick layer of hard foam instead of a thin layer of super slick, wet lather will use it up much faster though.
A
amd
I have made Windsong's original recipe, and now use a variation of Skatergirl46's recipe in post #97 with a few tweaks: I use aloe vera juice as my liquid, OO instead of hemp, and dropped castor down to 3% (I found more than that to be too sticky) and replaced the difference with CO, and no clay or fragrance. I love it.
I came across this thread a week or so ago at the suggestion of someone else (wish I could remember the thread) and ever since I've been waiting to find some time to make this recipe.
Well today was the day and I followed Windsong's exact recipe, although I only HP'd it for about 45min. I could have gone longer but it was looking done and I'm always in a hurry. Couldn't decide whether to add any fragrance or not... so I did both... I filled up two of the containers without and then added a combo of 2/5th Cedarwood EO and 3/5 Lemon EO... but only about 1/5th of an oz total... very faint smelling but I wanted to contrast it with the fragrance free. I can't wait to try them! -Many Thanks Windsong!
Well today was the day and I followed Windsong's exact recipe, although I only HP'd it for about 45min. I could have gone longer but it was looking done and I'm always in a hurry. Couldn't decide whether to add any fragrance or not... so I did both... I filled up two of the containers without and then added a combo of 2/5th Cedarwood EO and 3/5 Lemon EO... but only about 1/5th of an oz total... very faint smelling but I wanted to contrast it with the fragrance free. I can't wait to try them! -Many Thanks Windsong!
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jbrewton
Member
Looks good. Post some lather pics when you have a Chance.
Mark the Box Guy
Well-Known Member
After reading thru the entire thread I have made my first attempt of Songwind's awesome shaving recipe. I did a few alterations from recommendations I found in the thread. 75 KOH/25 NaOH, added some shea and castor oil to the original recipe. Melted the oils and added the lye first, got it to a pudding like trace and then added the stearic acid (thank you Deanna for that suggestion). Reserved some of the shea for a super fat after the cook and I also added 15% glycerin and 1% sodium lactate at the very end. Scented it with just a simple Lavender Essential. Got it in some 8 oz jar and let it sit for a week so far. Let me just say WOW!!!! I love it. As Mark the Box Guy said " it lathers itself when I walk by it and wink."
**** fine photo... and I still wink at it
Well I got to page 89 of the thread before my stearic acid cane in so I decided to give it a go (windsongs 52/48 SA/CO with 11% glycerin and 3% shea added at the end. Used a 2:1 basil/ lavender Eol blend... too much basil I think.
Happy how it turned out. Here is picture just a quick lather in my hands cleaning up. As I've gotten used to shaving with my disposable and just water I'm sure my legs will be in for a treat!
Happy how it turned out. Here is picture just a quick lather in my hands cleaning up. As I've gotten used to shaving with my disposable and just water I'm sure my legs will be in for a treat!
ok so I'm confusing myself here snd being relatively new I'm just going to ask for clarification
adding superfat -
When using a lye calculator (i happen to use Soapee) - I put in the desired super fat (i.e. 3%). Now - the amount for oils that they give include the extra 3% already? So if I wanted to say have Shea butter as my super fat I would include that in my percentages that I input into the calculator?
ok so my tired mom brain is having a hard time articulating so lets skip to an example with numbers.
So for 100g batch 52% stearic acid 48% coconut oil - I input those into the calc and get 52g SA 48g CO and the respective amounts of KOH and water. Now if I add an additional 3% of the oil weight in shea butter (3g for this example) at the end with my glycerin/EO have I now added 6% superfat (because I ticked off the 3% super fat function in the calculator)
I guess what confused me is reading through some people say they reserve X amount of whatever oil for the end after the cook for superfatting and others word it as they add 3% superfat at the end.
:-?
adding superfat -
When using a lye calculator (i happen to use Soapee) - I put in the desired super fat (i.e. 3%). Now - the amount for oils that they give include the extra 3% already? So if I wanted to say have Shea butter as my super fat I would include that in my percentages that I input into the calculator?
ok so my tired mom brain is having a hard time articulating so lets skip to an example with numbers.
So for 100g batch 52% stearic acid 48% coconut oil - I input those into the calc and get 52g SA 48g CO and the respective amounts of KOH and water. Now if I add an additional 3% of the oil weight in shea butter (3g for this example) at the end with my glycerin/EO have I now added 6% superfat (because I ticked off the 3% super fat function in the calculator)
I guess what confused me is reading through some people say they reserve X amount of whatever oil for the end after the cook for superfatting and others word it as they add 3% superfat at the end.
:-?
