Lye - Is there a difference?

[Kcryss]

Is there a difference between the various brands of lye? If something says 100% lye does it have the same potency of another brand that stats the same 100%?
I'm running low on lye and need to order more, however just wondering if what I find at the hardware store that says 100% is the same as say, the Red Crown sold on amazon or even the lye from the lye guy.

 

[TheGecko]

Red Crown, Red Hot Devil, Essential Depot and Belle Chemical are available on Amazon. You want Food Grade, 100% or 99%+. Stay away from 'chemical grade'.

I've never purchased Sodium Hydroxide from the hardware store myself, but others have. Some with The Lye Guy.

 

[AliOop]

I used the hardware store stuff for years, with zero problems. It's nice if you only need small amounts, or if they have a good sale.

For medium-sized purchases, I usually buy from Essential Depot but through Amazon rather than the ED website, since I get free shipping with Prime.

When I use up this current batch of ED lye, I'm going to buy my first 50lb bag from the local chem supply store. Even if half of it goes bad before I use it up, it will still cost less than anything else available online.

 

[Catscankim]

I used to use Belle Chemical lye, but the lid is so hard to get off sometimes, so now I have been using Essential Depot. It is like a dollar more expensive on amazon, but the shipping is quicker and more reliable.

 

[DeeAnna]

I've used hardware store lye (Red Devil, Roebic), Lye Guy lye, and Essential Depot lye. They all work fine.

What "100% NaOH" means is there are no other chemicals ~intentionally~ added to the product. Some drain cleaners have other ingredients in them other than NaOH to help the cleaning action. Obviously those products aren't good for soap making.

What "100% NaOH" does not mean is the product is 100% pure NaOH with absolutely nothing else in the product. There will always be some amounts of impurities in the NaOH, due to the manufacturing process and due to the fact that NaOH reacts very quickly with carbon dioxide and water vapor in the air.

Tech grade and food grade NaOH come out of the exact same manufaturing process. The main difference between the two types is the additional lab tests done to document the amounts of impurities so the NaOH can be labeled and sold as suitable for human consumption.

Other than less stringent testing, tech grade NaOH is not any different chemically than food grade NaOH and is just as safe and just as suitable for soap.

So if a person wants to use food grade NaOH for soap making, by all means use it -- no problems, no worries. But if a person has been using hardware store NaOH or other tech grade NaOH, they should not lose any sleep that their soap is somehow inferior. It isn't.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

I mostly use Essential Depot lye, but occasionally use the lye from Ace Hardware. I sometimes find black or grey impurities in the Ace lye that I have to filter out, but otherwise it works fine. From memory, the ED lye is higher purity, like 98-99% while the Ace lye is more like 96%. I leave the calculator at 99% purity when I use ED lye and drop it to 97 or 96% when I use the Ace lye.

I wouldn’t say the shipping is free with Amazon Prime. It’s more like it’s included in the price, but there are also Prime rewards that offset the cost. Right now, 2lbs of ED lye with free shipping is a whopping $25 plus tax using Amazon Prime and 1lb of lye is $7 plus tax at my local Ace Hardware. The price from ED goes down considerably if you buy large quantities. I am an ED club member and recently paid $4.50/lb for 32 lbs of lye, including tax and shipping through their website. The lifetime membership was $100 at the time I joined and I’ve recouped about half of that within a year.

 

[AliOop]

@Mobjack Bay that is a great deal! The lifetime ED membership was quite a bit more expensive when I joined in the past, and the monthly membership didn’t pencil out for me, either. So I didn’t remain a member.

My last purchase of ED lye via Amazon cost me $3.07lb for 32 lbs delivered to my door. Right after I bought that, a local soaper told me about the local chem supply store, not even five miles from my house, where a 50-lb bag was available for $1.08/lb with local pickup.

That was back in July 2021, so prices have gone up significantly. I will definitely check out ED again when I’m ready to buy. Having it pre-divided into 2-lb bottles may be worth paying a bit more to avoid having to divvy up 50lbs from a single container, but I don’t know about 3x more…

 

[Mobjack Bay]

prices have gone up significantly

Absolutely. Now that I’m getting a consistent trickle of special orders, I’m starting to look more seriously at ways to keep costs reasonable. I wish I lived close to any store that sold anything I use in bulk. (my top location picks for my next life will have a restaurant supplier and a major airport hub )

I’m still buying lye in the 2 lb containers because I worry that I won’t manage a large bucket well enough to keep it dry.

 

[TheGecko]

So if a person wants to use food grade NaOH for soap making, by all means use it -- no problems, no worries. But if a person has been using hardware store NaOH or other tech grade NaOH, they should not lose any sleep that their soap is somehow inferior. It isn't.

Interesting to know. When I was researching it yesterday I came across several 'chemical grade' labeled Sodium Hydroxide and specially said "Not for use in food or soap"...hence why I said to look for 'food grade'.

I wouldn’t say the shipping is free with Amazon Prime. It’s more like it’s included in the price, but there are also Prime rewards that offset the cost. Right now, 2lbs of ED lye with free shipping is a whopping $25 plus tax using Amazon Prime and 1lb of lye is $7 plus tax at my local Ace Hardware.

I don't know about that. I just bought a HP 17a Black Toner Cartridge and it was the same price as Office Depot/Max and Staple and ten cents cheaper than HP direct. I also looked at a bunch of stuff I recently ordered and the only thing that cost more than the store was the Argo Corn Starch (which has since gone down two bucks for a 4-pack) and I'm okay with paying a little more since I didn't have run around to other stores looking for it.

Right now, I'm paying $2.81 lb for 8lbs. I've been saving the containers so I can purchase a 45 or 55 lb bucket and then break it down.

I’m still buying lye in the 2 lb containers because I worry that I won’t manage a large bucket well enough to keep it dry.

Save your 2lb containers and then break down the bucket when you get it.

​

 

[Catscankim]

That's a good idea @TheGecko I never ordered big because I worried about how to handle a big container before. I have upgraded a few other ingredients to larger sizes, but still bought the smaller sized lye. I'm kind of afraid of it.

Especially after we had a patient/trauma alert a few weeks ago that got doused in sodium hydroxide. I have nightmares about it now. It was horrific.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

Save your 2lb containers and then break down the bucket when you get it.

This is a great idea! Thanks for the tip. Do you get your lye locally?

I was mostly thinking I would be able to get a deal on lard if I had a restaurant supplier nearby or maybe even find bulk lye within a reasonable radius. The closest WalMart and Big Lots to me are 30 minutes away and Costco is more like 45 minutes. By the time I consider my time and gas, Amazon usually seems like a bargin.

 

[AliOop]

This is a great idea! Thanks for the tip. Do you get your lye locally?

I was mostly thinking I would be able to get a deal on lard if I had a restaurant supplier nearby or maybe even find bulk lye within a reasonable radius. The closest WalMart and Big Lots to me are 30 minutes away and Costco is more like 45 minutes. By the time I consider my time and gas, Amazon usually seems like a bargin.

Ahhh, the trials of of living in a lightly populated, gorgeous piece of nature...

 

[Mobjack Bay]

Ahhh, the trials of of living in a lightly populated, gorgeous piece of nature...

Yep, no retail in the marsh!

 

[Kcryss]

Wow!! Thanks everyone for your input! Good to know that NaOHh is not 100% pure. When I first started soaping, I had a really hard time getting my soap to cook in under 2 hrs. I've been using Red Crown recently (before the giant price spike) and my soap is fully cooked in 20 minutes! That's what drove the question. I'm out and need to order more, but I just can't bring myself to pay 10 dollars a pound.

Red Crown, Red Hot Devil, Essential Depot and Belle Chemical are available on Amazon. You want Food Grade, 100% or 99%+. Stay away from 'chemical grade'.

I've never purchased Sodium Hydroxide from the hardware store myself, but others have. Some with The Lye Guy.

I did see some on Amazon saying 99 or 99.9% but was a bit leery of those.

I used the hardware store stuff for years, with zero problems. It's nice if you only need small amounts, or if they have a good sale.

When I use up this current batch of ED lye, I'm going to buy my first 50lb bag from the local chem supply store. Even if half of it goes bad before I use it up, it will still cost less than anything else available online.

Wow, wonder if there is a chem store somewhere in Denver. I'll have to look around.

I used to use Belle Chemical lye, but the lid is so hard to get off sometimes, so now I have been using Essential Depot. It is like a dollar more expensive on amazon, but the shipping is quicker and more reliable.

They have a great deal on Amazon right now, 10lbs for 50 dollars. I'm about ready to hit the checkout button with it in my cart.

I've used hardware store lye (Red Devil, Roebic), Lye Guy lye, and Essential Depot lye. They all work fine.

What "100% NaOH" means is there are no other chemicals ~intentionally~ added to the product. Some drain cleaners have other ingredients in them other than NaOH to help the cleaning action. Obviously those products aren't good for soap making.

What "100% NaOH" does not mean is the product is 100% pure NaOH with absolutely nothing else in the product. There will always be some amounts of impurities in the NaOH, due to the manufacturing process and due to the fact that NaOH reacts very quickly with carbon dioxide and water vapor in the air.

Tech grade and food grade NaOH come out of the exact same manufaturing process. The main difference between the two types is the additional lab tests done to document the amounts of impurities so the NaOH can be labeled and sold as suitable for human consumption.

Other than less stringent testing, tech grade NaOH is not any different chemically than food grade NaOH and is just as safe and just as suitable for soap.

So if a person wants to use food grade NaOH for soap making, by all means use it -- no problems, no worries. But if a person has been using hardware store NaOH or other tech grade NaOH, they should not lose any sleep that their soap is somehow inferior. It isn't.

Always a wealth of information! Good to know food grade isn't really any diff then the regular stuff.

I mostly use Essential Depot lye, but occasionally use the lye from Ace Hardware. I sometimes find black or grey impurities in the Ace lye that I have to filter out, but otherwise it works fine. From memory, the ED lye is higher purity, like 98-99% while the Ace lye is more like 96%. I leave the calculator at 99% purity when I use ED lye and drop it to 97 or 96% when I use the Ace lye.

That's what I ended up buying today. The Rooto brand from Ace. Thanks for the tip on dropping the purity down. Maybe that will prevent a 2 hr cook time.

Especially after we had a patient/trauma alert a few weeks ago that got doused in sodium hydroxide. I have nightmares about it now. It was horrific.

That's horrible!!! I would have nightmares too!

This is a great idea! Thanks for the tip. Do you get your lye locally?

I was mostly thinking I would be able to get a deal on lard if I had a restaurant supplier nearby or maybe even find bulk lye within a reasonable radius. The closest WalMart and Big Lots to me are 30 minutes away and Costco is more like 45 minutes. By the time I consider my time and gas, Amazon usually seems like a bargin.

I tried joining a few restaurant supply sites, their prices are higher than the local grocery store.

Yep, no retail in the marsh!
View attachment 71209

Sooooo jealous! It's beautiful! I would send a picture of our desert ... but not much to see! lol

 

[DeeAnna]

...we had a patient/trauma alert a few weeks ago that got doused in sodium hydroxide. I have nightmares about it now. It was horrific.

Oh, geeze, I'm so sorry that you had to deal with that.

There were accidents like this, thankfully not many, at one company I used to work at -- workers who died or were terribly and permanently injured. It was sobering and distressing just to hear the stories long after the fact. I know I can be outspoken about chemical safety on this forum, and this is one of the reasons why.

I can't imagine having to personally help someone who has been injured like this, as it sounds like you did. My heart goes out to you.

 

[TheGecko]

This is a great idea! Thanks for the tip. Do you get your lye locally?

I was mostly thinking I would be able to get a deal on lard if I had a restaurant supplier nearby or maybe even find bulk lye within a reasonable radius. The closest WalMart and Big Lots to me are 30 minutes away and Costco is more like 45 minutes. By the time I consider my time and gas, Amazon usually seems like a bargin.

From Shay and Company. But it's not exactly 'local'. From my house it's a little over an hour away, but it's a 25 minute drive from work which works because 1) they aren't open on weekends and 2) my boss and his family love my soap so it's no problem to come in a little late or leave a little early to jet over there ever so often. And I have a Costco close to AND close to work (2 miles).

And if they were open on Saturday, it would be absolutely worth it to make the two hour round trip because it doesn't even compare to how much I would have to pay for shipping. I purchase the majority of my base ingredients from them...I still get Olive and Coconut Oils from Costco, and I'm really liking their selection of FOs that is growing. The only thing they don't carry are Micas and that's okay.