Last HPCP soap batch still soft and gooey inside

[burtonridr]

I made the most basic soap batch I could find after our first batch came out a little stiff and crumbly. The recipe was olive oil, canola oil, lard, coconut oil and super fatted with evaporated milk. Its been about 3 days now and its still very sticky inside, what can I do different next time so this doesnt happen? or is it normal to wait this long when super fatting with milk type products? I also used salt and sugar per recipe in the lye water(fully dissolved first of course)

 

[AlchemyandAshes]

Can you post your full recipe for review? It's easier to troubleshoot with all the information.
Are you weighing your ingredients, and not using fluid measurements?
Are you using a lye calculator, like SoapCalc or Brambleberry's?
You said your first batch was stiff and crumbly...was it overcooked or lye heavy?
You said "superfatted" with evaporated milk...do you mean you added the milk after cook? How much milk did you add?
If you're HPing your batch, it shouldn't still be sticky or too soft to unmold after 3 days.

 

[burtonridr]

Here is the recipe I used, I got it here http://www.msbrenda.com/basictutorial.html Everything below was multiplied by 1.33 to bring the recipe up to a 4lb batch, I think the original was 3 lbs.

10.64 oz Lard
10.64 oz Coconut Oil
4 oz Olive Oil (extra virgin is not necessary for soap)
8 oz Pure Canola Oil (Not the blended)
4 oz castor oil (Also used as laxative found in pharmacy department) don't worry, your soap won't make you go!)

3 3/4 Tablespoons sugar (See special instructions about adding sugar. This is very important)
1/2 Teaspoon Salt (See special instructions about adding salt. This is very important)
16 oz distilled or rain water (I have excellent well water and use it straight from the tap)
5.45 oz sodium hydroxide.

4 oz Heavy Whipped Cream (add after the soap is cooked).... I used evaporated milk since I didnt have the whipped cream on hand.

-I am weighing my ingredients,
-I didnt use a lye calculator for this recipe,
-the first batch actually volcanod on us, then I thought it was done when it really wasnt, so it didnt actually cook the full length, it burned in the crockpot.
-super fatted after cooking with 4 oz of evaporated milk instead of the heaving whipped cream.
-I un molded after 24 hours, cut a piece off to find the gooey vasoline like insides. If it sits exposed it dries up and feels like soap, its just taking a really long time for the inside to harden up, I'm not sure why?

I think I read somewhere if I cut the cars to soon(like while the inside is gooey) the bars will warp as they cure, is that correct?

 

[AlchemyandAshes]

ALWAYS USE A LYE CALCULATOR FOR ANY RECIPE YOU FIND, EVEN ON THIS FORUM. There may be a typo or just incorrect information and you wouldn't want it to cause a problem in your soap.
If you simply multiplied that recipe by 1.33, you only used a 2% superfat (prior to adding the milk after cook). Also, thats about 2 oz extra liquid than necessary, which would explain the sticky soft inside. Too much liquid can make it take longer to saponify, and yes, your bars will warp during cure.
Have you zap tested or otherwise checked the pH of the soap you were able to slice off?
Adding sugar AND milk, which has sugar in it, can cause overheating.
Was your first batch this same recipe? When it volcanoed, did you lose any liquid or oil?

 

[burtonridr]

ALWAYS USE A LYE CALCULATOR FOR ANY RECIPE YOU FIND, EVEN ON THIS FORUM. There may be a typo or just incorrect information and you wouldn't want it to cause a problem in your soap.
If you simply multiplied that recipe by 1.33, you only used a 2% superfat (prior to adding the milk after cook). Also, thats about 2 oz extra liquid than necessary, which would explain the sticky soft inside. Too much liquid can make it take longer to saponify, and yes, your bars will warp during cure.
Have you zap tested or otherwise checked the pH of the soap you were able to slice off?
Adding sugar AND milk, which has sugar in it, can cause overheating.
Was your first batch this same recipe? When it volcanoed, did you lose any liquid or oil?

I think I read somewhere that a soap calcs assume a CP to make the soap, and if you are doing a HP soap batch things need to be tweaked slightly so it doesnt come out to dry, is that true?

So to much liquid is probably the culprit? I dont fully understand the whole idea of super fatting, i need to check my calc to see if it tells me how much to use.

I zap tested after cooking the soap, prior to pouring it into the mold, should I zap test it again?


The first batch was a different recipe, I pretty much made it up. I took a recipe and modified it to what I had on hand at the time. Lol this stuff seems so much easier than it really is

 

[burtonridr]

I did use the soap calc for the first batch.

 

[AlchemyandAshes]

Lol this stuff seems so much easier than it really is

It isn't Rocket Science, but it IS still science and chemistry...and math (ugh! :x )
I do believe SoapCalc assumes CP...but I don't know how much a difference that makes in this instance. Still, try to research some lye calculators...they are your friends!
I think your problem is mostly just a little too much liquid. If you zap tested after cook and got no zap, you're probably fine. If it didn't zap then it shouldn't zap now! Just leave it for a few days and check again. If after a week its still sticky, its probably a measurement issue. I'm not really familiar with using milk to superfat after HP cook since I primarily CP, so I'll leave that to someone who does...
Good luck with your soapy adventures!

 

[burtonridr]

It isn't Rocket Science, but it IS still science and chemistry...and math (ugh! :x )
I do believe SoapCalc assumes CP...but I don't know how much a difference that makes in this instance. Still, try to research some lye calculators...they are your friends!
I think your problem is mostly just a little too much liquid. If you zap tested after cook and got no zap, you're probably fine. If it didn't zap then it shouldn't zap now! Just leave it for a few days and check again. If after a week its still sticky, its probably a measurement issue. I'm not really familiar with using milk to superfat after HP cook since I primarily CP, so I'll leave that to someone who does...
Good luck with your soapy adventures!

Thanks for the help

 

[VanessaP]

I think I read somewhere that a soap calcs assume a CP to make the soap, and if you are doing a HP soap batch things need to be tweaked slightly so it doesnt come out to dry, is that true?

Not necessarily. SoapCalc has a default of 38% water as weight of the oils, which is the full water amount for CP and HP. HP generally need to be made with the full water amount (not necessarily 100% of them) to keep it from evaporating out and leaving lye-heavy chunks in the soap batter before it is fully cooked. But full water amount is default on pretty much all of the lye calculators I've seen. I think what you may have read about HP being tweaked is that I know some soapers who usually only work with HP using sugar and/or sodium lactate in their soap to help it be more fluid as it gets molded.

For new soapers, it is suggested that they use the full water amounts until more comfortable with the process and have a few batches under their belts. Full water can help give your formula more time to swirl, can help keep your soap from seizing from a FO that doesn't want to play nice, and also can help facilitate the gel phase.

Once I had some batches under my belt, I switched to using a lye concentration rather than water as a % of the oil weight. When I do HP, I use full water. When I do CP, I usually use a 33% solution. However, keep in mind that less water means that your formula can hit trace faster, those mean FOs can cause more problems, and if you prefer to gel your soaps (as I do) then you may have to help it along. When I do my castile, I use a 40% solution (10 minutes to get to trace with stickblender) because olive oil takes so long to come to trace on its own. If I used the full water amount, I'd have been stick blending for probably half an hour.

 

[Genny]

Like everyone else said, sounds like too much liquid. Also, Evaporated milk has only about 6% fat in it, while heavy whipping cream has more than 35% fat in it, so your soap won't be as superfatted as you might want.

 

[burtonridr]

Thanks for all the help, I will stick to full water as suggested for awhile.

Would it hurt anything if I placed the soap somewhere warm and dry to try and speed up the drying out? Maybe even have a fan blow over it?