I'm so frustrated with european suppliers and living outside EU

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Rune

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2017
Messages
394
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Location
Norway
Hi!

I'm trying to find a place to order supplies. But one difficulty after another pops up.

The first problem, that is constant, is the problem of living in a NON-EU country and customs. I can either order for like nothing INCLUDED the shipping price, seriously nothing, or I have to ask the suppliers to write a low value on the parcel etc, etc. There are several ways to make sure the parcels goes thru customs. To pay doble VAT (the country of the supplier and my country), VAT on the shipping + custom fees and the shipping cost itself, is not an option. One of the suppliers I found for fragrance oils, refused to do that and told that they send parcels to Norway all the time, and nobody have problems with customs. Well, 100% of my parcels have been stopped in the past if I forgot to mail and ask to make sure they can send it as gift, commercial sample, low value etc. I can not take that risk. The supplier would not know if the customer's parcels get stopped in customs.

Had to find another supplier. I was lucky enough to find one that both had fragrance oils that I want, and all the other supplies as well. Not bad prices either. But, because I have learned the hard way, I try to remember to read everything with little writing first. So I scrolled down to the bottom of the page and found the delivery information. Affordable delivery, EXCEPT for Norway and Switzerland. 49 euro in shipping, flat rate up to 30 kilo. Cheap if you order 30 kilo. But that was not my plan.

The worst was their explanation to more than double the shipping rate (compared to Sweden, our neighbours). They claim: "For these countries extra document and clearance fees are charged".

First of all, I have to pay the clearance fee for customs, not them, if the parcel is over the limit amount. Second, the document fee is plain rude! Do you know what they do? They take the VAT, 20-something percent and put straight in their pockets. They EARN money by exporting to us. Because, I have to pay their VAT. But they don't have to pay it. So, I should really pay their prices without VAT. But that never happens (not that I have asked that supplier specifically, but I have asked others before). So they charge the customers a VAT that they don't have to pay to their state. And on top of that, they feel free to more than double the shipping price! So of course I'm not gonna order from Soapqueen.eu (or .nl). Maybe that is the document fee, the work they will have to do to prove that they have exported to NON-EU countries, so that they can keep the VAT themselves?

The shipping prices in general are sooo different from supplier to supplier, even though they use the same transportation methods. Many have unreasonable shipping prices. And shipping varies from country to country. Our closest countries are those who have the highest shipping prices. To send something from Finland to Norway or USA, that is about the same price. Even Norway and Finland are neighbours.

I find it hard to find suppliers in Europe. First, you have to make sure to not order from many suppliers, because of shipping. Then you should find max 2 suppliers that together has more or less everything you need, and both of those have to have relatively reasonable shipping prices. Those two suppliers must have webpages that you can sort of navigate. A lot of countries will be totally int the dark, since you even can't find what "soapmaking supplies" or somthing like that is in their language, like polish or slovakian. Google translate does not help at all, I have tried that. Then, when you finally find suppliers, you struggle to make sure it goes thru customs. Then start the whole process again, often a few times, since it failes in one or the other way one or many places.

I do envy you in USA that have everything in one single country. I do also envy the EU countries. The suppliers sometimes don't make it easy for us Non-EU-citizens. And our governments definately do all what they can to stop us from buying from abroad, at least they do in this country. Just imagine if you were forced to find everything you need in the state of Alabama only. And if you would need something from others states, you had a limit of $42 INCLUDED the shipping price. Impossible? Yes, sure! And that is exactly the reality for us norwegians. What they really do, the government, is forcing us to buy from China instead. The chinese automatically makes sure every parcel goes thru customs, regardless the value, an they ship for a low price or free. It is the easiest country to order from, by far. But I don't want chinese supplies in my soaps. I'm not too sure about the quality or that it does not contain toxic stuff.

And can you imagine, that Ebay has become one of the worst places ever? Now, they have decided that every parcel to Norway should go thru customs (Ebay don't send the parcels, the sellers do), so they add VAT and fees automatically. Then it is a struggle to get that removed. The sellers really have a lot of work if they want to sell to us. They often do, so they try to get it removed by fixing this and that. But it is a lot of struggle, every time, so Ebay is a place I can't use more than in emergency situations.

I easily can get both lye and oils at the grocery store, and our tap water is the cleanest water in the world (where I live). And I have a mould. So I have everything I need for unscented, uncoloured soaps. But that's not very inspiring. So I just have to keep on looking all over Europe to find my maximum two suppliers.

I'm just frustrated because Soapqueen, where I found everything I would need, had a ridiculous policy. And because a fragrance oil supplier that I hoped to order from told me they could not do what I wanted. They had a good reason, though. But that sort is more the norm than the exception for us out in the cold, outside EU.

(I can't blaim anyone for us not being inside EU. I voted myself NO to EU, and I would vote the same again). :-D
 
Im sure we will end up with a similar set of probelms when we leave the EU as well!!

Its crazily expensive for me to order from the US so that no matter what I want its just not cost effective - I usually try and stick with UK businesses.

Have you tried Gracefruit? Noticed their shipping is around £25 but they do allow for VAT exemptions, would that help?

Ive had a quick look at all my usual suppliers and most charge at least £25 rising to £60 to ship to Norway with a few refusing to send FO altogether. Not sure if The Efficacious Gentleman could help as he is Austria (I think) and may know more mainland EU suppliers.
 
While Norway is not EU, it is eec and so a lot of this shouldn't be an issue. Even in the EU, some places don't deliver certain products outside of the country!

But - how far away from the border are you? If I need to, I can be in Germany from Austria in about 30 minutes. I can get many things delivered to a parcel shop and pick it up from there myself. Not always cheaper for me, but for those products which can't be delivered here, it works really well.
 
Yes, you will most likely get similar problems when you leave EU

VAT exemptions does really, really help. I had a full shopping cart at The Soap Kitchen, or what they are called. I did not think it would be problems from the UK, because I have ordered lots of stuff from that country before. But yes, this kitchen claimed 50 GBP (!!!) for shipping to Norway.But they did a VAT exemption. But anyway. 50 GBP is way too expensive. Maybe my cart was too full of heavy items and the price was not too bad after all. And The Soap Kitchen have cheap prices for their items. I tested now buy removing everything but 1 item. And the price dropped. So it was by weight and not a flat-rate.

I have tried Gracefruit. But I don't remember exactly. I left it for a reason. So I guess it was something important I did not find there.

Yes, Gentleman, it should never ever be an issue. We are a part of the EU's inner market. So there are 0 reasons for any issues at all.

Yes, german shops are notorious for not delivering outside Germany. But luckily the shops in other countries most often do deliver outside their country. I can see no reason for the germans to be so ridicilous. If they have to post the parcel anyway, it can be just the same where it is sent, Germany or Angola, that should not matter.

I can be in Sweden in 40 minutes. But, I have to drive more inland to get parcels. And I can't really get it there either anymore. But that shop have made a cheat solution, so it should work, according to them. So it will be a little over 60 minutes to drive. So it is possible, and I have done that before. But I have to pay 8.81 euro in some road fee, or what it is called. Plus gasoline. So it's not necessarily cheaper. And in winter it can be a very, very rough drive. I have to go over a mountain. But I don't have to think about customs, which is a positive thing.

I managed to find soap supply stores in Hungary by using Google Translate. The hungarian shops are not bad, and they have low prices. But the language is just as impossible as Finnish. So I have done tons of copy and paste into Google Translate. And learned some words as well. I tried to place and order with http://kezmuvesellato.hu but I have no idea if they deliver to Norway. So I have sent them a mail. They had some very cheap fragrance oil. Not too many, the rest was from Gracefruit and quite expensive.

Another shop, I think it was Soapcenter.eu, but maybe it was humanityaruhaz.hu. I sent them a mail, and they could ship to Norway. I will anyway buy the package of soap cutter and soap mould from one of those two (can't remember which one. I think both have much the same). That looked good and was cheap as well. Around 22 euros.

Since I know shipping will be quite high, I was looking for shops with lower prices to even it out. Many shops have high prices + high shipping, and I can't afford that. My income is like too bad for it. And Eastern Europe is cheaper than the rest of Europe. The only thing is the impossible languages they have. For example, I had tons of work trying to find out what Nevia fragrance oil would smell like. I could not find out, so gave up. But, at another shop, I found that Nevia fragrance again. It turned out to be Nivea Cream. The had a picture of Nivea. So just like that is Eastern Europe. Maybe Hungary is the worst of them. So UK and Germany/Austria is my number 1 countries to start, because of easy languages. Scandinavian countries have way too high prices, and the shipping is most often more expensive than from more far-away countries. Not that there is any soap supply store here either.
 
I was looking at Plush Folly. I dumped something in my cart, just to check shipping prices. Plush Folly do have something that I really want. Agarwood fragrance oil. But, there is a biiig but here.

They will charge 25 GBP extra for customs clearance. I can only buy bottles of maximum 30ml. And the total can be maximum 300ml. Fragrance oils are so called "restricted items". I guess I have to look out for fragrance oil powder, if that exists?

So, I will have skyrocket high shipping prices for buying next to nothing. That's the reality for Norway, Switzerland, Serbia and Bosnia-Herzegovina.
Luckily, I live close to Sweden, so I can get fragrances in emergencies. But I will not buy from Plush Folly anyway. I'm sure those rules are put opon them by governments, but it is strange that none or few other suppliers have the same rules. Stupid rules don't always need to be followed. I don't think I understand those rules anyway. It is supposed to be no restrictions if you buy for more than 500 grams. Does not make sense, but. When I do buy larger bottles, it is automatically adjusted down in the shopping cart.
 
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