Four weeks or six weeks?

Soapmaking Forum - Soap & Candle Forums

Help Support Soapmaking Forum - Soap & Candle Forums:

SunRiseArts

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2017
Messages
1,911
Reaction score
1,870
Location
Texas, USA
IrishLass thank you for the links, forgot to say that earlier, I will sure read them, and I have an update ........ :

At the beginning it felt amazing, but as the bar got small, I found it was feeling like burning my skin. Well I guess I deserve it .... putting aquaphor on my face now .... it does not look red or anything, so I guess I will survive.:

In my crazy mind I am thinking the soap cures from the outside in, but maybe I am just crazy

I had made soap before, but only HP or rebatch. I do like the rustic look but wanted to try an artistic approach. I tried the hot process fluid method, but it does not always work, so is why now I am trying the CP. :)

I am an oil painter, so the idea of my soaps looking like art is very appealing.

Try it, but reserve your final judgment.

Also, pics please.

lol This is the one I tried:



Yes. Oh my gosh YES! I found some old soap in the back of my closet that I had completely forgotten about. I pulled out my notes and discovered it was three batches of rebatched soap that was 16 months old. Some were 100% olive oil, some were my standard recipe and some were my standard recipe with shea butter added. All of them were hard as a rock, produced an incredible lather and last longer than a younger bar. However, the incredible feeling my skin had getting out of the shower when using one of those bars cannot be compared to any other soap. The mildness of a well-cured bar of soap cannot be beat. Because of that unexpected discovery, I've decided to allow my soaps to cure for a year. I usually wait 3 to 6 months, but I'm going for a full year now. Since I have soooooo much soap on hand, that shouldn't be too much of a problem. :)

I thought soap goes bad after a year!:silent:
 

shunt2011

Moderator Emeritus
Moderator Emeritus
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Apr 2, 2012
Messages
15,449
Reaction score
9,765
Location
Michigan
I've got soap 6 years old and it's still perfect. Maybe the scent faded but some still smell good to my nose.
 

mx6inpenn

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2015
Messages
602
Reaction score
609
Location
NW Pennsylvania
I thought soap goes bad after a year!:silent:
One of the soaps I'm sending you is 2 years old. I like to say they are like a good scotch, get better with age.

I am sending one that is 8 weeks and one that is 5 months as well. I wanted you to see the difference a good cure makes. I rarely pull one of the shelf that's younger than 3 months for myself.

On a side note, I didn't make it to the p.o. yesterday, but am going shortly, so they will be on their way.
 

IrishLass

Staff member
Admin
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2008
Messages
17,494
Reaction score
11,378
Location
Right here, silly!
I thought soap goes bad after a year!:silent:
You'll soon think differently, I have no doubt. ;) Some soaps might not last that long if their formula and/or their oils were bad to begin with, but if your oils and formula are good, they will hold up indefinitely.

For what its worth, I still have soaps dating all the way back to 10 or 11 years ago (and everywhere in between), and they are still great. The scent is gone in most of them (although not all of them), but the soaps themselves are awesome. I like to pull one out every now and again to use up in the same way a wine connoisseur might pull a bottle of well-aged wine from out of the wine cellar to enjoy. lol


IrishLass :)
 

Steve85569

Supporting Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Messages
1,916
Reaction score
2,125
Location
North East Oregon, USA
Soap and wine get better with age is properly stored.
You CAN use soap after saponification has completed ( no zap).
You CAN drink wine after fermentation has completed.

But they are both a whole lot better given a proper cure time. Even "hot process" wine gets better with aging as does hot processed soap.

As for soaps going bad IrishLass made some very good points. One of the other details in making soap that helps soap last longer is a lower SF as well. There are more that could be discussed but that would amount to a thread hijack....
 

The Efficacious Gentleman

Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Nov 19, 2013
Messages
9,080
Reaction score
9,358
Location
Austria
Sunrise, you have done more m&p than cp if I recall - I think that it might well be that m&p doesn't last too long under certain conditions. But that is not the case for cp. I keep a bar from each batch that I have never made before. You end up with quite a treasure trove
 

RobertBarnett

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2015
Messages
132
Reaction score
56
The best thing you can do is use a bar at 2 weeks, 3 weeks, 4 weeks, and so on. This will let you see the dramatic impact a good cure can have on your soap. It is a real learning experience and a bit fun.

Robert
 

SunRiseArts

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2017
Messages
1,911
Reaction score
1,870
Location
Texas, USA
One of the soaps I'm sending you is 2 years old. I like to say they are like a good scotch, get better with age.

I am sending one that is 8 weeks and one that is 5 months as well. I wanted you to see the difference a good cure makes. I rarely pull one of the shelf that's younger than 3 months for myself.

On a side note, I didn't make it to the p.o. yesterday, but am going shortly, so they will be on their way.
OMG You are so generous! I can't wait!

Thank you all for so much insight. I had no idea. In my mind I thought it lasts only a year, and then it would go bad ... Now I do not feel guilty about making more.

My hubby and I are planning on moving back to the country this year, I made him promise to built me a separate studio house, so I can have space for all my arts and crafts .... :) I know what will happen, there will be soap EVERYWHERE!

Another question..... for the challenge I made a 60 % olive oil 40% coconut. Since it has such a high olive content, how long should I let it cure?
 

BattleGnome

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2016
Messages
1,662
Reaction score
1,489
As long as possible ;p

60% OO is definite a case of passible at 4-6 weeks but sooooooooo much better with a longer cure. I once used a SoapQueen recipe for a baby Bastille that was 80-90% pomace and while it was useable soap at the reccomended 4weeks it had the trademark Castile slime and I put it away for a while. Picked up a random bar six or so months later and it was much better.

After all that... I would say test it at 4 weeks, 8 weeks, 12....etc. It will give you a good idea of how a castille cures without needing the 6-12 months to be considered passable.
 

earlene

Grandmother & Soaper
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Apr 30, 2016
Messages
8,962
Reaction score
10,365
Location
Western Illinois, USA
SunRiseArts, I love that you are going to have your own studio house for your Art. I have always wanted a separate studio for art; you know a separate building away from the main house. Maybe combined with, or adjacent to a formal greenhouse. I am truly envious!

I agree with BattleGnome. The longer the better in my experience. I am absolutely loving the soap I made for the challenge last June. It's super bubbly and just so wonderful now.
 

CTAnton

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2015
Messages
786
Reaction score
501
Location
Connecticut
amazing how this is such a recurrent theme, especially when it comes to high OO soaps.
I look at soap like wine....do you want a Beaujolias or a Cabernet aged several years? Every soap that I've made and found the occasional stray bar of years later has amazed me. Yes, the fragrance has diminished but a good long cure is amply rewarded.I recently did a dual lye 100% OO batch. I tested a sliver of it 2 weeks later and while theres no abundance of bubbles there was no snottiness either. At the beginning of the year I made some Castile soaps to give as gifts for Christmas...a tradition I learned on the forum and from what Ive read, not without its merits....
 

fuzz-juzz

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 14, 2013
Messages
869
Reaction score
487
Location
Australia
I cure for as long as possible.
8 weeks minimum.
You can use it at 4 weeks but as already mentioned, while safe to use, it will turn into mush quickly and it just doesn't have the right feel.
I'm currently using hars that are about year old and they are amazing, hard as a rock lol.
 

Zany_in_CO

Saponifier
Joined
Mar 9, 2017
Messages
6,451
Reaction score
6,408
Location
SE Denver CO
I made him promise to built me a separate studio house, so I can have space for all my arts and crafts .... :) I know what will happen, there will be soap EVERYWHERE!
Ooooo, I'm green with envy! :mrgreen: Will the studio have a cot for guests? hunh? :)
 

winusuren

Active Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2020
Messages
43
Reaction score
9
Location
India
As long as possible ;p

60% OO is definite a case of passible at 4-6 weeks but sooooooooo much better with a longer cure. I once used a SoapQueen recipe for a baby Bastille that was 80-90% pomace and while it was useable soap at the reccomended 4weeks it had the trademark Castile slime and I put it away for a while. Picked up a random bar six or so months later and it was much better.

After all that... I would say test it at 4 weeks, 8 weeks, 12....etc. It will give you a good idea of how a castille cures without needing the 6-12 months to be considered passable.
Hi,
Won't this soap develop DOS due to the addition of carrot puree and buttermilk after a long cure of more than 8 months?
 

ResolvableOwl

Notorious Lyear
Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2021
Messages
1,642
Reaction score
4,258
Location
Germany
Do you have reasons to assume that carrots or buttermilk foster rancidity?

Anyway, if you wonder about maximum waiting/curing time/shelf life, this isn't the right thread anyway. Please start a new thread, rather than necropost.
 

winusuren

Active Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2020
Messages
43
Reaction score
9
Location
India
No actually pureed carrots and buttermilk are natural ingredients. They'll be good in soaps after 45 days of cure and I've tried it too. But when we cure soaps for more than 8 months they might spoil the soap right?? I'm not sure about this. This is the doubt I have.
 

earlene

Grandmother & Soaper
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Apr 30, 2016
Messages
8,962
Reaction score
10,365
Location
Western Illinois, USA
I have not had carrot soaps turn rancid, even after 4 years after cure. I still have some of my own 'Baby Buttermilk' (not this recipe, but that is what I named them & they had buttermilk) soaps that I made several years ago, and there is no rancidity there either.

That is not to say that rancidity could not happen. Of course it could, but the food itself would not necessarily be the cause.
 

TheGecko

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2019
Messages
2,107
Reaction score
3,534
Location
Oregon
Won't this soap develop DOS due to the addition of carrot puree and buttermilk after a long cure of more than 8 months?
Depends. I have two bars of Goat Milk Soap on my desk...one was made over two years ago and the other not quite a year ago; the first was made with evaporated goat milk and the other with fresh goat milk. Nothing wrong with either bar, I keep them to remind myself how far I have come. I also have a bar of Goat Milk Soap that I bought...hmmm, around 13 years ago. I found it two years ago tucked away in the back of a drawer in the bathroom. When I bought it, it had been tightly wrapped in tissue paper, but since soap continues to cure, it had lost a little weight. Outside of that, there was nothing wrong with the soap and it's my traveling soap. I used it in July and will be using it again later this month.

I can't tell you the science of it all, but it has to do with the PH that doesn't allow for the growth of mold and bacteria...which is not the same as DOS. From my understanding of DOS, it is most commonly caused by using rancid oils which is it is important to know the shelf life of your oils. Another cause of DOS can be found in using tap or well water which can contain heavy metals or naturally occurring minerals. Unless you are making a high Coconut Oil soap, a high superfat can cause it. Your Super Fat is made up of unsaponified oils...which can go bad (see shelf life). Another cause of DOS is temperature and humidity; soap cures best in dry, well ventilated, and cool temperatures. And yet another cause is placing your soap on bare-metal racks and trays. Stainless steel is okay since it doesn't rust, but it's just best not to do it. And lastly, if you have chunks of food in your soap yes the chunks will rot.
 

winusuren

Active Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2020
Messages
43
Reaction score
9
Location
India
Depends. I have two bars of Goat Milk Soap on my desk...one was made over two years ago and the other not quite a year ago; the first was made with evaporated goat milk and the other with fresh goat milk. Nothing wrong with either bar, I keep them to remind myself how far I have come. I also have a bar of Goat Milk Soap that I bought...hmmm, around 13 years ago. I found it two years ago tucked away in the back of a drawer in the bathroom. When I bought it, it had been tightly wrapped in tissue paper, but since soap continues to cure, it had lost a little weight. Outside of that, there was nothing wrong with the soap and it's my traveling soap. I used it in July and will be using it again later this month.

I can't tell you the science of it all, but it has to do with the PH that doesn't allow for the growth of mold and bacteria...which is not the same as DOS. From my understanding of DOS, it is most commonly caused by using rancid oils which is it is important to know the shelf life of your oils. Another cause of DOS can be found in using tap or well water which can contain heavy metals or naturally occurring minerals. Unless you are making a high Coconut Oil soap, a high superfat can cause it. Your Super Fat is made up of unsaponified oils...which can go bad (see shelf life). Another cause of DOS is temperature and humidity; soap cures best in dry, well ventilated, and cool temperatures. And yet another cause is placing your soap on bare-metal racks and trays. Stainless steel is okay since it doesn't rust, but it's just best not to do it. And lastly, if you have chunks of food in your soap yes the chunks will rot.
Thank you so much for the detailed reply. Now I'll make some soaps for my kids:)
 

Latest posts

Top