Expired Items

[Sima]

I have a few jars of old tallow, some of them are sealed and some have a smell, does it go when used for making soap?
Also, I found a jar of liquid oil in a good shape but I can't recall what was it, is there any way I can figure out how to use it in soapmaking? Obviously, I put it with tallow to experiment with them in that time and totally forgot about everything when I stopped making soap for a few years.
I found an expired sealed glycerine along with fragrance oils as well, I don't remember what my plans were for glycerine. Is there anything I can make out of it? It looks to me in a good shape, does it really expire? Any advice regarding the expired fragrance oils, they don't have much scent left.
Thank you

 

[AliOop]

Hi Sima,

Regarding the glycerine and fragrance oils, if they don't smell, I'd use them. I've never had glycerine or FOs go bad. However, if the tallow smells bad, it is probably rancid and should be tossed out. Alternatively, you can try "cleaning" it using some of the methods discussed on this forum for cleaning tallow or other expired oils. If you can successfully clean it to where it is odorless, you can certainly try it in soap and see if it develops rancidity. I wouldn't sell any soap made with it, however.

I don't have any advice on the liquid oil; maybe someone else here knows a way of identifying it.

 

[Sima]

Hi Sima,

Regarding the glycerine and fragrance oils, if they don't smell, I'd use them. I've never had glycerine or FOs go bad. However, if the tallow smells bad, it is probably rancid and should be tossed out. Alternatively, you can try "cleaning" it using some of the methods discussed on this forum for cleaning tallow or other expired oils. If you can successfully clean it to where it is odorless, you can certainly try it in soap and see if it develops rancidity. I wouldn't sell any soap made with it, however.

I don't have any advice on the liquid oil; maybe someone else here knows a way of identifying it.

I looked up cleaning rancid oils, it feels easier just through them away. I don't sell soap, it's all for personal and family use, I learned how to make soap as a hobby many years back, practiced some then busy life came in the way. This is why I have all expired supplies.
I hope someone has some advice about the mystery oil.
Thank you for the reply.

 

[ResolvableOwl]

@John Harris systematically uses FOs of 20+ years vintage, and has zero issues with them (or conceals them from us).
Tallow – @AliOop's idea is worth a try to first sniff it, and when in doubt give it another “render” cycle to remove some decay products. Said unknown oil, though, (I guess you're meaning something else than “vegetable oil” aka corn/canola) is more questionable for several reasons. First, when you don't know which oil it is, you don't know the saponification value (how much lye it needs), nor its reasonable usage limits. Then it might have caught some more or less undetectable rancidity (via air contact, light …), that isn't apparent to the eye or the tongue, and seems to be not an issue in soap until a few weeks/months into cure, when DOS strikes at a sudden.
A first clue is to taste it. If it has the slightest stale/bitter/adstringent/rancid taste to it, it's unfit for soap (and likely for food too). If it does not taste bad, it does not mean that it's safe, though.

 

[Sima]

@John Harris systematically uses FOs of 20+ years vintage and has zero issues with them (or conceals them from us).
[/QUOTE]
Interesting! I'd love to know where does he buy his FO from, must be a great resource, mine faded after almost one year.

Tallow – @AliOop's idea is worth a try to first sniff it, and when in doubt give it another “render” cycle to remove some decay products.

OK, I'll try @AliOop's cleaning method in small amounts out of curiosity, I tried to sniff it by separating some in a plate, according to one of the threads I researched here on the forum, I have some rancid.

Said unknown oil, though, (I guess you're meaning something else than “vegetable oil” aka corn/canola) is more questionable for several reasons.

The vegetable oil is fresh, a friend brought it the other day, he thought I use it for cooking. The unknown one is almost 30 oz. and it's old.

Then it might have caught some more or less undetectable rancidity (via air contact, light …), that isn't apparent to the eye or the tongue, and seems to be not an issue in soap.
A first clue is to taste it. If it has the slightest stale/bitter/astringent/rancid taste to it, it's unfit for soap (and likely for food too). If it does not taste bad, it does not mean that it's safe, though

What you are saying makes a lot of sense but not sure I'll be tasting it after reading this. I am just curious to know if there is any way to soap with it. Maybe throwing it away will solve the problem.
Thank you for the reply!

 

[ResolvableOwl]

An edible oil that you aren't eager to taste any more, is most likely not worth making soap from it.

But throwing away? Let me quote one of the great philosophers of our time:

 

[Sima]

An edible oil that you aren't eager to taste any more, is most likely not worth making soap from it.

But throwing away? Let me quote one of the great philosophers of our time:

Do you have any other suggestion?

 

[glendam]

I recently made soap using expired Kokum butter, cocoa butter, old olive oil infusion, etc. I did include some fresh oils so it wouldn’t be all expired stuff (fresh coconut oil, castor oil). The only oil that smelled weird was the kokum butter. It had a strong vinegar like scent. I set it to 0% super fat based on some advice I read here (which made sense). Even before adding the fragrance, the soap seemed to go straight to gel phase after briefly stick blending. Not sure if it is the old oils or the 0% super fat that is causing that. However, I regret not throwing away the kokum butter, as now the entire oil mix smells like that vinegar scent.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

maybe someone else here knows a way of identifying it.

Do you save receipts???
TIP: I have an ORDERS file where I keep a copy of receipts of online orders from various suppliers. in that file are sub-categories of each supplier I order from: WSP. BB, Lotion Crafter, MMS, Soapers Choice, Walmart, Target, etc. It's easy to find when I need to know what I bought and when I bought it.

The unknown one is almost 30 oz. and it's old.

With that amount, and unopened, you probably bought it for a recipe you planned on making. If you have access to your old recipes, you may find the answer there. In which case, would make a small 300g - 500g batch to see if it's worth soaping.

GOOD LUCK!

 

[TheGecko]

I have a few jars of old tallow, some of them are sealed and some have a smell, does it go when used for making soap?

Also, I found a jar of liquid oil in a good shape but I can't recall what was it, is there any way I can figure out how to use it in soapmaking? Obviously, I put it with tallow to experiment with them in that time and totally forgot about everything when I stopped making soap for a few years.

I found an expired sealed glycerine along with fragrance oils as well, I don't remember what my plans were for glycerine. Is there anything I can make out of it? It looks to me in a good shape, does it really expire? Any advice regarding the expired fragrance oils, they don't have much scent left.

I can help you identify the fiber content of yarn, but not oils...there are just so many soft oils out there. You could do a guesstimate of what it based on what common Soft Oils you would have used back then, look up the various SAP values and pick an average and then make a test batch. On the other hand it what...a quart jar? Is it really worth the hassle of trying to figure out what it is?

I don't know anything about glycerine, but I FOs can last a very, very long time if properly kept. I have a few bottles of discontinued perfumes going back some twenty-thirty years ago and every few years or so, I'll open the truck and dab a tiny amount on for the memories. Oxygen and light are the biggest detriment to most products. Glass bottles are better than plastic, brown is better than green/blue which is better than clear. I store all my FOsEO/s in the garage...it's not a room that is used frequently and only for short periods. After receiving my scent and smelling them (gotta do what you gotta do), I make sure that the caps are tightly twisted back on and in the rack in the garage they go. If we are able to get the garage made over this year, then I'll get a cabinet for my scents.

Before tossing the bottles that don't seem to have much scent left, dip a cotton swab in it and let it set out...make sure it is cotton and not some polyester. I've had a few FOs that smelled really 'light' in the bottle that 'grew' when exposed to oxygen.