Discouraging comments from others on your CP soaps?

[Millie]

Many people on the forum say cocoa butter hinders lather. I have only tried a high cocoa butter soap when also using castor oil (and/or jojoba) which I think really makes it shine! I get very frothy, dense, whipped cream texture lather when using the combo. Lots of ingredients are outrageously priced in grocery stores, but much more reasonable online. I don't remember if you mentioned where you live, if you post your location maybe others in your area can share their sources. Good luck!

P.s. you can also try a generic bar soap to compare yours to if you can't find a bar of cp. Then you'll have an idea of what people look for in terms of lather.

 

[susiefreckleface]

Hi Makayla,

Very sorry that you feel discouraged by family members' comments. I go along with several of the helpful comments here: give making liquid soap a try, use FO, change the lard ratio, etc. In the end we are creatures of habit and set in our ways. I think it could even relate to the marvelous scheming antics of the marketing ads that tell us what we love, not like, but what we love. It plays in our subconscious on a loop. We used a certain perfume before a date that went well, then a different perfume / different date, not so well... so subconsciously we go back to the perfume that we had a nice date with. And so on and so on. Seriously, marketing degrees, wow! all designed to sell us on what we love.

When it comes to my DH and my hand made shower soap, I mimicked Ivory to a point by making it a lard combination bar. I still can't get him away from the soft soap at the hand sink, I keep intending on following two of the ladies collaborations here with their liquid soap - but I've just had too much going on lately (that's why I've disappeared lately - been sick, then DH sick). I've made liquid soap a year ago (to fix a botched bar batch - wrong hydroxide). I liked it quite a lot, DH not so much, I will make it different when I do get the chance to make a batch.

Just stick with your new craft. Make smaller batches to suite yourself and a couple friends at church or work (someone here gave me fantastic advice to make smaller batches when I thought I wanted to make a large slab mold to do fancy designs).

Now it's your turn.... stearic (haha) your family conversations with hints of how much fun you are having and the great successes you've made ((Marketing baby I'm tellin' yeh)), and that so & so from work fell in love with this last batch loved the new scent, yadda yadda yadda ... and don't offer your family any bars until they are clamoring for it by asking you for a bar. :think:

Best of luck to you!

 

[Arimara]

No need to feel discouraged- you only have 5 batches under your belt. That's nowhere near enough experience to make you the soaping queen. Keep making soap and always keep a bar or two of each batch to test every now and then so you can learn what you like and what you don't.

What oils are available to you, if you don't mind? I don't recall if I have read about your plight. Also, a little bit of cocoa butter can go a long way. Unless you love it, cap it at 15% of your recipe max so you don't wast any. that should be about 90g or so for your mold. I'd stick to 10% to get more use out of it though.

 

[Makayla]

P.s. you can also try a generic bar soap to compare yours to if you can't find a bar of cp. Then you'll have an idea of what people look for in terms of lather.

That's a really good idea. I don't know why I didn't think of this before. I'm definitely getting a bar of soap from the store just to compare.

Also, I doubt many people who are from where I live are on this site, sadly.

Hi Makayla,

Just stick with your new craft. Make smaller batches to suite yourself and a couple friends at church or work (someone here gave me fantastic advice to make smaller batches when I thought I wanted to make a large slab mold to do fancy designs).

Now it's your turn.... stearic (haha) your family conversations with hints of how much fun you are having and the great successes you've made ((Marketing baby I'm tellin' yeh)), and that so & so from work fell in love with this last batch loved the new scent, yadda yadda yadda ... and don't offer your family any bars until they are clamoring for it by asking you for a bar. :think:

Best of luck to you!

Thanks. This is another good idea - to make smaller batches. Haha, yeah, maybe if I can wake up their interest in the soaps like that, they'd just be so curious to ask to try the new ones. This is actually a very good point I think.

No need to feel discouraged- you only have 5 batches under your belt. That's nowhere near enough experience to make you the soaping queen. Keep making soap and always keep a bar or two of each batch to test every now and then so you can learn what you like and what you don't.

What oils are available to you, if you don't mind? I don't recall if I have read about your plight. Also, a little bit of cocoa butter can go a long way. Unless you love it, cap it at 15% of your recipe max so you don't wast any. that should be about 90g or so for your mold. I'd stick to 10% to get more use out of it though.

You're right. I just started out and there's tons to learn. Thanks for the tip on using cocoa butter - I'll follow it.

I'll list all of the oils I know I can get:

Olive Oil
Sunflower Oil
Rapeseed Oil
Pumpkin Seed Oil
Lard
Soybean Oil
Corn Oil
Palm Olein (no palm oil)
Sesame Oil (toasted)

The more expensive ones:

Hemp Oil
Castor Oil
Cocoa butter
Coconut Oil

The REALLY expensive ones which are only available in extra small amounts for big prices:

Avocado Oil
Almond Oil
Hazelnut Oil
etc

...and I think that's all, if I didn't miss some.

 

[Arimara]

That's a really good idea. I don't know why I didn't think of this before. I'm definitely getting a bar of soap from the store just to compare.

Also, I doubt many people who are from where I live are on this site, sadly.

Thanks. This is another good idea - to make smaller batches. Haha, yeah, maybe if I can wake up their interest in the soaps like that, they'd just be so curious to ask to try the new ones. This is actually a very good point I think.

You're right. I just started out and there's tons to learn. Thanks for the tip on using cocoa butter - I'll follow it.

I'll list all of the oils I know I can get:

Olive Oil
Sunflower Oil
Rapeseed Oil
Pumpkin Seed Oil
Lard
Soybean Oil
Corn Oil
Palm Olein (no palm oil)
Sesame Oil (toasted)

The more expensive ones:

Hemp Oil
Castor Oil
Cocoa butter
Coconut Oil

The REALLY expensive ones which are only available in extra small amounts for big prices:

Avocado Oil
Almond Oil
Hazelnut Oil
etc

...and I think that's all, if I didn't miss some.

Two of the blue highlighted oils I have used. You'll be fine with them and they can be the bulk of your soap recipe, provided that you're patient. The lard should cure much more quickly than olive oil so making a soap with at least 40% of that is a good idea. I prefer 50-60% lard myself.

The purple oils are good to decent investments IF you find you like them. Castor oil, especially if you can buy a big bottle of it, will last you the longest of the three oils since you can get by with using as little as 1% (though many of us will use at least 3%). You do NOT want to use more than 10% of castor oil or you will make a nice, tacky-feeling soap. Coconut oil, which is a common enough cleansing oil for many of us, is also an oil that can last you a bit. 10-15% of that oil tops will give you some bubbles and a little cleansing factor. That plus the average 5% castor oil will add some bubble factor to your soap.

The red oils, I'm afraid are splurges, even though I know that at least avocado oil is real nice in a soap. If you manage to procure any or are even gifted them, formulate your recipe so that you can use these oils as superfatting oils. Yes they may feel nice saponified but you might want some of the benefits of these oils to live on in the finished product.

Suggested recipe-

50% Lard
25% Olive oil
15% Coconut oil
10% Cocoa butter
1.5 tsp of sugar, dissolved in water (for bubbles).

I suggest 2 parts water for one part NaOH for this. It migh still take the longer part of suggested cure time to feel nice-ish. I waited 3+ months for all my soaps and that made a huge difference.

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

Some great advice offered.

I am in the camp with those who say keep on giving soap to the "poo-pooers". There seems to be too much of a tendency in the world (including this forum) that negative = bad and that anyone who says anything other than praise and cheer-leading chants is being mean and nasty. That isn't always the case.

There have been many threads where people are frustrated that they only get a simple "it's nice" when they ask for feedback, so getting something more definitive, even if it's not praise, gives you things to look at changing.

This is how we develop and learn. My wife is very honest and doesn't always formulate her feedback in the best way, but I need that feedback to make better soap

 

[cherrycoke216]

A lot of great advice from above. I just wanted to say that high lard soap might benefit from the addition of citric acid or EDTA. These are for the hard water and makes soap bubble/ lather more in less effort. My lard soap before citric acid and EDTA are waxy and leaves a film after washing. I have very hard water.
If you cannot get EDTA, citric acid is also a good chelator. You add in 10 g citric acid, and you have to get extra 6 g NaOH to compensate. (or you'll get more SUPERFAT)
Don't feel frustrated, my family did the same thing at first, and now they hate hotel soap & commercial soap.
Keep calm and SOAP on!!!

ETA: you might like dual lye ( NaOH + KOH ) . Just search the forum. It helps high stearic acid soap and high palmitic acid soap dissolve better in water & cut slime and gooey from high OLEIC acid soap like Castile (all olive ) and Bastile ( Castile + other oils like coconut )

 

[Susie]

Some great advice offered.

I am in the camp with those who say keep on giving soap to the "poo-pooers". There seems to be too much of a tendency in the world (including this forum) that negative = bad and that anyone who says anything other than praise and cheer-leading chants is being mean and nasty. That isn't always the case.

There have been many threads where people are frustrated that they only get a simple "it's nice" when they ask for feedback, so getting something more definitive, even if it's not praise, gives you things to look at changing.

This is how we develop and learn. My wife is very honest and doesn't always formulate her feedback in the best way, but I need that feedback to make better soap

I understand what you are saying, and yes, I need that negative feedback to improve my soap, also. However, those people who like shower gel are a stubborn lot. They just do not like bar soap, no matter how marvelous it is!

You can't change them, they won't change their minds. Period. I have tried. Best thing to do is move on to someone else who will appreciate getting it, and hopefully will give honest, thorough feedback.

It was a wonderful thing for my soaping (and me!) when I got married and got someone who has a completely different skin type with different needs to test my soap. And he is honest about what he likes and does not. This allows me to grow in my soaping. I now have recipes for oily skin, and guys.

However, a new soaper needs people who at least WANT to try their soap. Those shower gel users, as much as she loves them, are not going to be helpful.

 

[CaraBou]

I have a friend who was a long time shower gel user that recently converted. She said she finally figured out that the "chemicals" in the gel were causing problems to her skin. I think she had originally gravitated to the gel because it was easy for her to find sudsy vegan varieties. But somewhere along the line she opened her mind. When we recently reunited after several years of not living near each other, I was happy to see her using handmade soaps. I made some vegan bars for her as a gift (not knowing she finally switched away from gel) and she was absolutely thrilled! So, don't give up, but do be patient!

 

[Makayla]

Two of the blue highlighted oils I have used. You'll be fine with them and they can be the bulk of your soap recipe, provided that you're patient. The lard should cure much more quickly than olive oil so making a soap with at least 40% of that is a good idea. I prefer 50-60% lard myself.

The purple oils are good to decent investments IF you find you like them. Castor oil, especially if you can buy a big bottle of it, will last you the longest of the three oils since you can get by with using as little as 1% (though many of us will use at least 3%). You do NOT want to use more than 10% of castor oil or you will make a nice, tacky-feeling soap. Coconut oil, which is a common enough cleansing oil for many of us, is also an oil that can last you a bit. 10-15% of that oil tops will give you some bubbles and a little cleansing factor. That plus the average 5% castor oil will add some bubble factor to your soap.

The red oils, I'm afraid are splurges, even though I know that at least avocado oil is real nice in a soap. If you manage to procure any or are even gifted them, formulate your recipe so that you can use these oils as superfatting oils. Yes they may feel nice saponified but you might want some of the benefits of these oils to live on in the finished product.

Suggested recipe-

50% Lard
25% Olive oil
15% Coconut oil
10% Cocoa butter
1.5 tsp of sugar, dissolved in water (for bubbles).

I suggest 2 parts water for one part NaOH for this. It migh still take the longer part of suggested cure time to feel nice-ish. I waited 3+ months for all my soaps and that made a huge difference.

That's very informative, thank you! Thank you for the recipe, too. I really wanted one with cocoa butter and you provided it.

Some great advice offered.

I am in the camp with those who say keep on giving soap to the "poo-pooers". There seems to be too much of a tendency in the world (including this forum) that negative = bad and that anyone who says anything other than praise and cheer-leading chants is being mean and nasty. That isn't always the case.

I agree with this, I'm not the one who constantly wants to hear praise just for the sake of being praised. It's totally fine for me to hear negative comments regarding my cooking, for example - because then I know what and why, and how to improve next time. And it taught me the different preferences people have. Some love cake with extra sugar, some hate it so much they can't eat it. And I take all of that into account.

But for soaps? I have no clue whose comments I should accept because I have no clue or reference of what makes a good bar of soap. Neither do these people. They can just tell me how they like using it compared to the shower gels. But is that really information I'm looking for? Does that mean that no one else would like my handmade soaps? And is the reason for not liking it simply that they've never used it and prefer other kinds of soap - or that there's something wrong with mine? How do I improve from there?

ETA: you might like dual lye ( NaOH + KOH ) . Just search the forum. It helps high stearic acid soap and high palmitic acid soap dissolve better in water & cut slime and gooey from high OLEIC acid soap like Castile (all olive ) and Bastile ( Castile + other oils like coconut )

I'll keep that in mind when it comes to lard soaps - I didn't know that at all. Thank you!

However, a new soaper needs people who at least WANT to try their soap. Those shower gel users, as much as she loves them, are not going to be helpful.

That's exactly what I'm unsure about. Do they not like the soap because I'm doing something wrong, or because they've never used homemade soap bars and find them strange?

I have a friend who was a long time shower gel user that recently converted. She said she finally figured out that the "chemicals" in the gel were causing problems to her skin. I think she had originally gravitated to the gel because it was easy for her to find sudsy vegan varieties. But somewhere along the line she opened her mind. When we recently reunited after several years of not living near each other, I was happy to see her using handmade soaps. I made some vegan bars for her as a gift (not knowing she finally switched away from gel) and she was absolutely thrilled! So, don't give up, but do be patient!

That's a good story. Maybe my family will change their minds... in any case, I'll keep on making soap and trying to improve. At least I love using it - that's all that matters at this level.

 

[Seawolfe]

I've made some very nice soaps without castor oil, but the only soap I've not used coconut oil in is a true OO castile. I dont know where you are, but if there is an asian community anywhere near you, I would haunt their markets looking for coconut oil. I found a sweet deal on two liters of it at an Indian market once.

That said, my friend in rural China makes a fabulous household soap using almost all lard, because that's what he has. Sugar helps for the bubbles

 

[Soapprentice]

Makayla, Try to get in on the next swap...that way, you will get the best reviews from the group and you will get some great soaps to try out and you will have a reference. Until then, keep soaping!

 

[Luviesmom]

Shoot, this was a very hard thread for me to reply to. I had a goat milk soap business and walked away from it all. My goats, my farm. Everything I thought I wanted. But had a very disfunctional relationship. He gave me theworld 20 years my senior but not happy.

I left. Left it, all my animal babies. Since then, had two great humans.

What I have read from your original post is you doubt your product. Not good. If you don't like it why will anyone else? Stop Being So Hard On yourself!

If you don't like your product then do what Earlene says, make a liquid soap.

Don't quit! The haters will hate.

Thankfully, I have family that supports my hobby. Though, I may not be able to make goats milk soap now, I try something else. And right now, bath bomb creations is what I am able to do.

And possibly with oils you bought you could make lip balm.

The world is your oyster. So what if they don't like your soap. Most importantly if you do...

I feel in love with my husband when he said, "What others eat does not make me **** rainbows."

For a long time I thought I should make rainbows.

 

[Arimara]

You're welcome, Makayla. Just keep soaping and learn to adjust your recipes here and there. When you like them, people might like them too.