Difference in olive oils?

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narnia

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Is there a difference between the grocery store "Mediterranean olive oil" and "Pomace olive oil?" Thx!
 

Obsidian

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As far as soaping goes, not really. Pomace might trace a bit faster but its what I use and I have no trouble with it.
 

narnia

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As far as soaping goes, not really. Pomace might trace a bit faster but its what I use and I have no trouble with it.
Thank you! Is it just as conditioning as the regular olive oil?
 

Obsidian

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Yes, possibly even more since there are more unsaponifiables in it.
 

narnia

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Yes, possibly even more since there are more unsaponifiables in it.
How so? I mean...what is the difference in the composition or extraction method that would make it have more unsaponifiables in it? I like the science. :)
 

Obsidian

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Pomace is the last oil extracted from the olives, usually using some kind of solvent. Not really sure about the composition or why its different, I just know it is. We need Deeanna to come along and give us a good sciency explanation.
 

ngian

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I don't think Pomace Olive oil has more unsaponifiables than Virgin Olive oil. One sign for this is the extremely similar SAP value they have. I also think that another sign is the also similar amount of saturated / monounsaturated / polyunsaturated fatty acids they have in their nutrition labels.

The only difference I can see after testing both of them are:

-Pomace is 50% cheaper were I live
- Pomace probably has more unwanted chemical because of the extraction method used
- Pomace has more a bigger acidity value (more free fatty acids floating) that's why it comes to trace faster.
 
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narnia

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- Pomace probably has more unwanted chemical because of the extraction method used
- Pomace has more a bigger acidity value (more free fatty acids floating) that's why it comes to trace faster.
Don't like the extra chemicals.

Bigger acidity value would be a positive wouldn't it? Would it help the soap me less alkaline (harsh)?
 

traderbren

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Many of the "Mediterranean" olive oils in stores are actually a blend of olive, canola, and grapeseed. You'll need to read the label carefully to make sure it's 100% olive oil.
 

ngian

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Bigger acidity value would be a positive wouldn't it? Would it help the soap me less alkaline (harsh)?
Acidity value of an oil has nothing to do with the acid value in the PH range of a water based liquid.

You can not meter the acidity value of an oil with ph strips.

If an oil has a high acidity value it means that it has many free fatty acids that lye will saponify instantly (fast acceleration). This phenomenon will not make the soap less alkaline as lye will keep the soap's ph high (9-10,5), range at which the soap works.
 

narnia

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Acidity value of an oil has nothing to do with the acid value in the PH range of a water based liquid.

You can not meter the acidity value of an oil with ph strips.

If an oil has a high acidity value it means that it has many free fatty acids that lye will saponify instantly (fast acceleration). This phenomenon will not make the soap less alkaline as lye will keep the soap's ph high (9-10,5), range at which the soap works.
I DID notice that it reached trace MUCH faster (within 5 minutes) than with the regular OO (30 min)!!

Now, does this mean that it would saponify more completely, leaving less fats to nourish the skin?
 

narnia

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Many of the "Mediterranean" olive oils in stores are actually a blend of olive, canola, and grapeseed. You'll need to read the label carefully to make sure it's 100% olive oil.
My label says 100% olive oil in ingredients.
 

narnia

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I wonder....could I mix the two OOs 50/50? To speed up trace but to keep the nicer properties of the regular OO?
 

ngian

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Now, does this mean that it would saponify more completely, leaving less fats to nourish the skin?
I think that the only thing it can happen with Pomace is for the saponification to be completed sooner reaching a higher peak temperature, making the unmolding and cutting time sorter. The lye discount will not be affected if everything else is equal.

If you want to slow down the saponification speed with Pomace, I would soap cooler, use a whisk instead of stick blender and use a little more water than usual.
 

narnia

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I think that the only thing it can happen with Pomace is for the saponification to be completed sooner reaching a higher peak temperature, making the unmolding and cutting time sorter. The lye discount will not be affected if everything else is equal.

If you want to slow down the saponification speed with Pomace, I would soap cooler, use a whisk instead of stick blender and use a little more water than usual.
I am using goat milk only....no water at all. I will be cooking in crockpot on "warm." So, are you saying that using a regular OO will keep the batch cooler during saponification? However, if I am cooking the soap, I guess it will not matter?
 

ngian

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Everything I wrote so far in this thread was about soaping with CP method. I have not done HP ever before so I don't know how all the above parameters affect the procedure.
 

Obsidian

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Trace time doesn't matter one bit in HP. ngian, not sure why you disagree with pomace having more unsaponifiables, google pomace + unsaponifiables, you will get a ton of info on the subject.
There is some controversy on the chemicals used for extraction, some people believe they stay in the soap, other believe they can't survive the lye. Other likes myself, don't really care either way. Soap is on the skin for such a short amount of time, I don't feel its really a concern.

narnia, do you have access to costco? Their kirkland brand OO is really good and its inexpensive.
 

narnia

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There is some controversy on the chemicals used for extraction, some people believe they stay in the soap, other believe they can't survive the lye. Other likes myself, don't really care either way. Soap is on the skin for such a short amount of time, I don't feel its really a concern.
I am concerned, because things are absorbed into the body through the skin. The short time that it stays on the skin, it still penetrates and that is why people are wanting to make their own soaps...to avoid the chemicals of commercial soaps.

If I had known this, I would never have ordered the pomace. I want a chemical-free soap.
 

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