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Mobjack Bay

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Just to be clear, I wasn’t endorsing the Barrington Declaration or the herd immunity approach. I’m simply trying to assess personal risks as the data improves. The peer-review system isn’t perfect, but the estimates of mortality/fatality rates are getting better as more studies are published. We need the numbers to calculate the risks and benefits of different public health/containment policies. Debate is good, but so is caution when the issue is a pandemic and public health.

I don’t go out without a mask and I wish everyone would wear one for the good of those who are vulnerable. As far as I’m concerned, it’s a simple act of kindness and consideration for others. I don’t understand why it’s so controversial.
 

linne1gi

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Just to be clear, I wasn’t endorsing the Barrington Declaration or the herd immunity approach. I’m simply trying to assess personal risks as the data improves. The peer-review system isn’t perfect, but the estimates of mortality/fatality rates are getting better as more studies are published. We need the numbers to calculate the risks and benefits of different public health/containment policies. Debate is good, but so is caution when the issue is a pandemic and public health.

I don’t go out without a mask and I wish everyone would wear one for the good of those who are vulnerable. As far as I’m concerned, it’s a simple act of kindness and consideration for others. I don’t understand why it’s so controversial.
I agree, it became a political issue and I keep hoping it will cease.
 

JenBen

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Science has came a long way since then and the covid vaccines have been tested, no one has died.

I personally can't wait to get in line for vaccines and I hope the government makes them mandatory.
Not all pharmaceuticals (including vaccines) have positive reactions for all members of the population. The results can be deadly. More troubling however is that thanks to the "National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act" (NCVIA) of 1986, pharmaceutical companies have zero liability for damage caused by this particular category of drug we call a vaccine, even in cases where it has been proven that it was improperly or unhygienically produced.

I think we should give it time and let individuals make the choices they feel are right for them.
 

dibbles

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I think it's fine to let people decide for themselves if they want to get vaccinated or not. As I understand it, the federal government is leaving it up to individual states on how they want to manage this. BUT, if that is the case, I also think it is fine for places of business, airlines, schools, etc. require proof of vaccination to enter facilities and I hope that they do. I will get a vaccine when it is available to me.

We just found out that our neighbor had Covid. It was deer hunting season in November, and everyone at the deer camp ended up with it. Our neighbor (74 years old) just had cold-like symptoms. His brother is in the ICU, and prognosis for him pulling through are not good. Both are otherwise healthy, just older. The sons are 40-50 years old, and also recovered with no problems.
 

paradisi

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On safety of vaccines, the vaccine claim reimbursement program (it's instead of lawsuits, and very few % actually claim injury) etc

National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program | Official web site of the U.S. Health Resources & Services Administration

Vaccine Injury Claims Are Few and Far Between - The New York Times

Vaccine Injury Court: Here's the Truth | Time
 

earlene

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I am sorry your son has been ill, and has lingering symptoms. I hope for a full recovery for him.

My MIL is doing surprisingly well! In her 80's and she does not appear to have any symptoms whatsoever since she tested positive a week ago. She is quite fortunate. Her room phone still is not connected, which is irritating, because when go over to talk to her through the double-pane windows, it's really impossible for us to hear each other clearly.
 

Basil

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@linne1gi I understand being frustrated. I'm a nurse, one of my daughters is a nurse, another one of my daughters a respiratory therapist, another daughter working in hospitals doing her residency, one son-in-law is an ED Dr, and another son in law is a fireman/EMT. Plus I have another daughter and another son in law working in the schools as teachers. All day long my phone is going off from one or more of them telling me about their day, who they came in contact with, how many covid pts they have seen, what PPE they don't have, what the shut downs are, etc. etc. etc. My youngest daughter is married to the fireman and they moved from Florida to Arizona just before the virus hit. They moved to be closer to us again with their 3 year old and 3 month old. They are still with us because they haven't been able to find a house due to the timing. So, we are having to be very careful. My mother is going to have her 90th birthday in two weeks and she's been by herself for the most of the year. I haven't seen my other out of state daughters for a year. It's hard for me to understand why people don't comply as best they can just to protect other people. I know some people have a reason not to wear a mask, but if it's not a medical (physical or emotional) reason, and it's to vocalize 'rights', that seems to me a dangerous way to stand up for 'freedom'. It bugs a lot of health care workers and first responders. You're not alone. As you said, this virus is so unpredictable. That poor 26 year old nurse and all the others who are trying to help while others are trying to make a point. I hope you stay healthy and are able to see that grand baby when it's time.
 

linne1gi

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@linne1gi I understand being frustrated. I'm a nurse, one of my daughters is a nurse, another one of my daughters a respiratory therapist, another daughter working in hospitals doing her residency, one son-in-law is an ED Dr, and another son in law is a fireman/EMT. Plus I have another daughter and another son in law working in the schools as teachers. All day long my phone is going off from one or more of them telling me about their day, who they came in contact with, how many covid pts they have seen, what PPE they don't have, what the shut downs are, etc. etc. etc. My youngest daughter is married to the fireman and they moved from Florida to Arizona just before the virus hit. They moved to be closer to us again with their 3 year old and 3 month old. They are still with us because they haven't been able to find a house due to the timing. So, we are having to be very careful. My mother is going to have her 90th birthday in two weeks and she's been by herself for the most of the year. I haven't seen my other out of state daughters for a year. It's hard for me to understand why people don't comply as best they can just to protect other people. I know some people have a reason not to wear a mask, but if it's not a medical (physical or emotional) reason, and it's to vocalize 'rights', that seems to me a dangerous way to stand up for 'freedom'. It bugs a lot of health care workers and first responders. You're not alone. As you said, this virus is so unpredictable. That poor 26 year old nurse and all the others who are trying to help while others are trying to make a point. I hope you stay healthy and are able to see that grand baby when it's time.
Wow, thank you! It’s so nice to know that someone understands. Your words brought a tear to my eyes, just to feel understood is a glorious thing. The thing that you get, is to wear masks for others, not necessarily yourself. That’s what makes me so unhappy. The “me” ness is so frustrating. Really, thank you! I pray your family stays safe and your mother sees 91! (At least)
 

Basil

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Wow, thank you! It’s so nice to know that someone understands. Your words brought a tear to my eyes, just to feel understood is a glorious thing. The thing that you get, is to wear masks for others, not necessarily yourself. That’s what makes me so unhappy. The “me” ness is so frustrating. Really, thank you! I pray your family stays safe and your mother sees 91! (At least)
Thank you ❤And your family as well!
 

fish123

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The thing that you get, is to wear masks for others, not necessarily yourself. That’s what makes me so unhappy. The “me” ness is so frustrating.
The thing is - there is ALWAYS someone, who would benefit from everyone wearing a mask. Cancer patients, elderly, families with premature babies etc. But I doubt it would do good to mankind to wear masks constantly. It is weakening our immune system (by contracting slightly changed virus in short intervals immune system can respond faster and we avoid serious symptoms).
We can not see smiles, expressions in general on faces around us.
CHILDREN grow up in the world without a smile (only close family is not enough).
I have a leukemia patient in close family and currently we too benefit from everyone wearing a mask. But we still think, that the whole thing is driven ad absurdum and becomes dangerous economical, social and medicinal experiment. We (including leukemia-patient) are definitely against mandatory vaccine - especially this one, new type and tested in haste, not in accordance with standard protocols. People should always have right to decide about their bodies and treatments - and still have right to use schools, planes and other public places.
 

Basil

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The thing is - there is ALWAYS someone, who would benefit from everyone wearing a mask.

People should always have right to decide about their bodies and treatments - and still have right to use schools, planes and other public places.
It’s funny that we’re experiencing the same debate that those in 1918 had with the Spanish flu. I feel that our country doesn’t really learn from history much. Maybe because ‘America’ isn’t really that old so there’s nothing from history to learn yet? I think the key word in the poster is ‘careless’. Even back then, it was about caring. Not putting your life on a line by wearing a mask, but by putting someone else’s life on a line by not.
 

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paradisi

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Wearing a mask emphatically does *not* weaken the immune system.

Not only is that not true, if it was, surgeons, nurses, firefighters, painters, drywallers, etc would all constantly be sicker than everyone else. And they are not.

People would do well to snopes such claims and to research (by which I do not mean Facebook or google or things a chiropractor or naturopath might say, neither of which are medical training).

Also, there's no move to mandatory vaccination in the US, another thing that could be found by looking outside of political sources.

Someone I know is hanging on by a thread in a covid ward and I've had it with false information and selfishness.
 

linne1gi

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Wearing a mask emphatically does *not* weaken the immune system.

Not only is that not true, if it was, surgeons, nurses, firefighters, painters, drywallers, etc would all constantly be sicker than everyone else. And they are not.

People would do well to snopes such claims and to research (by which I do not mean Facebook or google or things a chiropractor or naturopath might say, neither of which are medical training).

Also, there's no move to mandatory vaccination in the US, another thing that could be found by looking outside of political sources.

Someone I know is hanging on by a thread in a covid ward and I've had it with false information and selfishness.
THANK YOU!!! (yes, all in caps, because really thank you) I will state also - People - Wearing a mask DOES NOT compromise your immune system. Honestly, shaking my head here because of all the crappy information out there.
 

Kiti Williams

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THANK YOU!!! (yes, all in caps, because really thank you) I will state also - People - Wearing a mask DOES NOT compromise your immune system. Honestly, shaking my head here because of all the crappy information out there.
I agree, and I wear a mask to keep others at risk, safe. I have found my mask also helped me with my nasty seasonal allergies!
 

JenBen

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On safety of vaccines, the vaccine claim reimbursement program (it's instead of lawsuits, and very few % actually claim injury) etc

National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program | Official web site of the U.S. Health Resources & Services Administration

Vaccine Injury Claims Are Few and Far Between - The New York Times

Vaccine Injury Court: Here's the Truth | Time
1. If vaccines were perfectly safe why would we need the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program?
2. Different vaccines, like different medication, have different side effects. But unlike picking up a prescription, I wasn’t advised of the side effects nor was I given a drug-fact sheet which would’ve informed me. Truthfully, I didn’t even know to ask when I vaccinated my daughter.
3. Almost no one: parent or patient, knows that National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program exists.

Vaccine are pretty amazing but should any product that we and our children are forced to take be shielded from all liability?
 

linne1gi

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1. If vaccines were perfectly safe why would we need the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program?
2. Different vaccines, like different medication, have different side effects. But unlike picking up a prescription, I wasn’t advised of the side effects nor was I given a drug-fact sheet which would’ve informed me. Truthfully, I didn’t even know to ask when I vaccinated my daughter.
3. Almost no one: parent or patient, knows that National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program exists.

Vaccine are pretty amazing but should any product that we and our children are forced to take be shielded from all liability?
No one is being forced to take this vaccine. Just like no one is forced to take the measles vaccine, which, by the way, is now on the rise in this and many countries.
 
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