Are your soaps palm oil free?

[Lin19687]

I use sustainable Palm and PKO. Harder to work with but Lard/Tallow are not big around here.
I have only had 2 people ever ask me if it was sustainably harvested.
Most people don't even ask what is in it.

I do use Shea but at a small amount. Seems to hinder Bubbles for me and is too expensive for the big size bars I use.

 

[Dean]

I do not use palm oil. My soaps are perfectly lovely without it. I use vegetable oil and coconut oil for the solids. I will add about 15grams (1/2 oz) Shea butter per 1kg (2 lb) for luxury and silkiness, but you can't use a lot of shea in a batch.
This is my latest, Cherry Almond, made with almond milk, but I mostly use fresh goat milk or rainwater. I also pop straight into the freezer and do not gel.
Have been soaping for 6 years.

Ive used very high amt of refined shea successfuly. Refining removes most of the unsaponfiables that cause softness so the amt used can be unlimited in my opinion. Im actually considering of making a facial bar of nearly all shea with a touch SW for hardness and maybe a lil castor. I kno it wont be bubbly. My face cant tolerate any soap even a 100% almond oil bar. Not sure how it would react to all shea.

 

[Saponificarian]

You really don’t want to make an all Shea soap @Dean. It would last forever and while it will lather, somewhat, mine did, I just thought it’s too hard. I use unrefined, by the way.

Shea doesn’t need the SW but it does need some liquid oil and Coconut and if not Coconut, Sugar and 5% KOH should add a bit of lather.

 

[Dean]

You really don’t want to make an all Shea soap @Dean. It would last forever and while it will lather, somewhat, mine did, I just thought it’s too hard. I use unrefined, by the way.

Shea doesn’t need the SW but it does need some liquid oil and Coconut and if not Coconut, Sugar and 5% KOH should add a bit of lather.

Did u notice ur all shea bar to be less drying?

 

[Saponificarian]

My soaps are not drying and I have dry skin. I use mostly unrefined Palm Kernel oil in my soaps and at not more than 15% at most except a break the rules that I use it at 25%, even that is mild because the other oils in the recipe are Palmolein and Shea but I use coconut oil for my hubby’s soap as most of my recipes are to mild for him.

Having read some of your posts. I think you should make a no cleansing oil recipe with mild oils, like the Shampoo recipe on the forum. Here is one of the recipe I make for my children. It lathers but then I cure for like 3 months.

Shea butter 60%
High Oleic Canola/Rapeseed oil 20%
Castor 10%
Another liquid oil 10% ( I use either Sunflower, High Oleic or increase my Canola or Avocado or Sweet Almond oil) Superfat @3%.

I know many Soapers diss Canola and Rapeseed oil but it’s one of my most favorite oil to use. It is extremely mild and silky in recipe and I much prefer it to any other liquid oil.

 

[Sharon Patterson]

I did use palm originally but have now switched to tallow. Unfortunately because of this choice I did lose a customer account that caters primarily to vegetarians and although I tried to explain the fact that once saponification takes place it is no longer a particular oil and what devastation is taking place in the rain forests due to palm harvesting they decided not to purchase more soaps. Most of my customers don't seem to care one way or the other, they just want a beautiful bar of soap. I do use eggs in my soaps sometimes as well which they don't want to purchase either.

 

[cmzaha]

I do not use palm oil. My soaps are perfectly lovely without it. I use vegetable oil and coconut oil for the solids. I will add about 15grams (1/2 oz) Shea butter per 1kg (2 lb) for luxury and silkiness, but you can't use a lot of shea in a batch.
This is my latest, Cherry Almond, made with almond milk, but I mostly use fresh goat milk or rainwater. I also pop straight into the freezer and do not gel.
Have been soaping for 6 years.

I make a facial bar with 57% shea, 5% CO which lathers wonderfully.

Are you using solid vegetable oil such as shortening? Because a soap feels great and lathers great does not mean it has great longevity. I have been making soap for many years and I will say with tweaks they are still getting better and better

@sharon...no way would I have lost a customer for the reason of not using palm, but that is me. But then I will not jump on the bandwagon and discontinue palm use. People come first and need jobs to support their families.

 

[Deadgroovy]

Awesome thank you. The best i have found so far is like the second link 180£ for 8 variations but it just felt too limiting.
Once iv got a recipe i like i would likely want to have some that have swirls which limits me to how many colours i can use then iv got to use one or more of the variations for scent and any oil adjustments.
Then if i wanted to add christmas scents to the range. In a way its a good thing because its also limiting other peoples selling range and you will know what you need and when with stock if you were free to make new recipes whenever it would complicate things. So i suppose its got its positives and negatives. What were you thinking of insteaad of palm if you went that route?
Have you looked into using soapmaker 3? If you want to see more into it as a software inbox me and ill take some screenshots so it might help if you want to buy it. If im remembering correctly we have strict guidelines we have to follow with regards to logging recipes/batch numbers ect sm3 would definatly make this easier unless you already have a system.

I'm looking to try Shea butter (if the demand for palm free is there). I have found a couple of suppliers that sell for about £30 for 5kg.
I have looked into buying SM3 but the price is a bit prohibitive ($99) at the mo. I'm using a free excel template for batch recording http://www.thumbprintsoap.com/free-soap-making-batch-record-template/
and a cheapo excel off etsy for batch costings, Will pm you regards sm3.
Are you thinking of selling yet?

 

[Chris_S]

I'm looking to try Shea butter (if the demand for palm free is there). I have found a couple of suppliers that sell for about £30 for 5kg.
I have looked into buying SM3 but the price is a bit prohibitive ($99) at the mo. I'm using a free excel template for batch recording http://www.thumbprintsoap.com/free-soap-making-batch-record-template/
and a cheapo excel off etsy for batch costings, Will pm you regards sm3.
Are you thinking of selling yet?

Not yet no iv got at least a few more months of testing and playing wuth my recipes yet so i know im happy with what i will be sending to be tested. I know it says 99$ but it only charged me 75£ for the pro version. I would have a look round there quite alot of advice and opinions for using high shea butter. Iv been buying all my oils and micas from the soapery they are great and always quick and free delivery is always a bonus and they email a 10% off voucher too says its only valid for 2 weeks but i tried it after 3-4 weeks and it still worked for me

 

[KiwiMoose]

What is SM3?

 

[Chris_S]

What is SM3?

Soapmaker3 its software that will record your soap recipes track your stock and it has a lye calc built in. its aimed at soap making but iv added my candle recipes too.

Have a look on youtube theres some good tutorial and review based videos on there that will explain in more detail to what it can do

 

[penelopejane]

Thanks everyone for your comments.
The reason I asked the question is that here in the UK a lot of craft market sellers and online sellers seem to promote the fact that they are palm free. I don't know whether that they think people are really concerned about the use of palm oil (de-forestation etc) or that they are jumping on the bandwagon of saving the planet. I am at the moment asking friends and family on their views on this. ns

You have to understand your market and also understand that the majority of soapers here on this forum are from the US. There seems to be very little concern about palm oil and other additives in soap in the US. In fact i found it difficult to buy a vegetarian, palm free soap in the US from a miriad of stores around the country.

In Australia and NZ it is different and, it seems, in the UK. People here tend to want handmade soap to be as close to natural as possible, vegan or at least vegetarian and palm free. Goats milk soap abounds but it is more often used in commercial handmade soap (if you know what I mean - sold in supermarkets) than in exclusive handmade soaps although some sellers have a GM soap available. Very few tallow or lard soaps handmade soaps here. But we have access to really good OO.

Not many customers understand the implications of EDTA and other additives but a lot just don’t want anything except oil in their soap. It is still used by a lot of handmade soapers - and high end brands.

Not many customers seem to understand the difference between FO and EO but a few do. There is a bit of a move away from EOs because the scent fades (or soap makers don’t use enough) so quickly.

You’ll also get people who say: I won’t use FOs then you ask what soap do you use? Then you tell them it has FO and they are shocked: But it has “all natural” on the label!!

It really depends on your market, your soap (if it is good enough without additives) and your niche.

As far as I can see it’s highly subjective and great if you can find a niche and make money out of it!

 

[Chris_S]

You have to understand your market and also understand that the majority of soapers here on this forum are from the US. There seems to be very little concern about palm oil and other additives in soap in the US. In fact i found it difficult to buy a vegetarian, palm free soap in the US from a miriad of stores around the country.

In Australia and NZ it is different and, it seems, in the UK. People here tend to want handmade soap to be as close to natural as possible, vegan or at least vegetarian and palm free. Goats milk soap abounds but it is more often used in commercial handmade soap (if you know what I mean - sold in supermarkets) than in exclusive handmade soaps although some sellers have a GM soap available. Very few tallow or lard soaps handmade soaps here. But we have access to really good OO.

Not many customers understand the implications of EDTA and other additives but a lot just don’t want anything except oil in their soap. It is still used by a lot of handmade soapers - and high end brands.

Not many customers seem to understand the difference between FO and EO but a few do. There is a bit of a move away from EOs because the scent fades (or soap makers don’t use enough) so quickly.

You’ll also get people who say: I won’t use FOs then you ask what soap do you use? Then you tell them it has FO and they are shocked: But it has “all natural” on the label!!

It really depends on your market, your soap (if it is good enough without additives) and your niche.

it would seem even some mass producers dont seem to understa d the differece between fo and eo. i picked up a pack of candles and reed diffusers the other day just to see what it had in them and it nearly made my blood boil when i read they were claiming that presseco scented reed diffuser was an eo. Surely thats got to false advertising or something like that i know fo can be made using eo BUT its still a fo not an eo they are absolutly not the same thing as each other. and it was only a cheap pack i highly doubt that was anything but crappy chemical derived fo made purely in a lab. sorry rant over

 

[Deadgroovy]

it would seem even some mass producers dont seem to understa d the differece between fo and eo. i picked up a pack of candles and reed diffusers the other day just to see what it had in them and it nearly made my blood boil when i read they were claiming that presseco scented reed diffuser was an eo. Surely thats got to false advertising or something like that i know fo can be made using eo BUT its still a fo not an eo they are absolutly not the same thing as each other. and it was only a cheap pack i highly doubt that was anything but crappy chemical derived fo made purely in a lab. sorry rant over

Totally agree. Some are exploiting peoples ignorance about fo's and eo's. Up to us, I suppose to educate them!

 

[Chris_S]

Totally agree. Some are exploiting peoples ignorance about fo's and eo's. Up to us, I suppose to educate them!

Unfortuatly I somehow doubt b&m niether care nor know the difference themselves if it sells they get money. If it was a smaller company i might have told them about it but i would of just got a blank stare if i had mentioned it in there.

They do however have some excellant shelves iv bought for soap curing very small footprint but each shelf is big enough for about a batch and a half so a loaf mold and a half. Found them in the bathroom section near the shower caddys if your interested @Deadgroovy . 20 quid but ideal for tucking away in the corner for extra curing space

 

[penelopejane]

They look great but there is no way at that price that they are stainless steel so it would be a really good idea to put a cotton tea towel between your soap and the metal shelf.

 

[Chris_S]

They look great but there is no way at that price that they are stainless steel so it would be a really good idea to put a cotton tea towel between your soap and the metal shelf.

Iv used paper towel folded over a few times top shelf has a silicone mat on it. @amd suggested to cover even coated metal incase its damaged so knew when i bought it it was going to have to be covered Thank you for bringing up though

 

[amd]

Do you make soaps Palm oil free? Yes

If you sell soap, do people ask if your soap is palm free? No. On the flipside I've only been asked if they're vegan once.

If you are palm free, what do you substitute? Lard / Tallow.

 

[Susie]

I won't use soy either and I won't buy any handmade products that contain it.

^^^This!!! And I really, really try to avoid buying food with soy in it!